Granixo@feddit.cl
on 13 Feb 2024 17:28
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Even less reasons to move on from Windows 10, nice!
victorz@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 17:42
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This barely affects anyone apparently, so feel free to upgrade. Windows 11 isn’t bad at all. I’m enjoying it whenever I have to use it. (I basically boot Steam and play games and reboot to Linux, so that’s the extent of it.)
orclev@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 17:45
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Windows 11 adds nothing good to 10, and introduces a bunch of highly anti-consumer features that are difficult if not impossible to disable. There’s absolutely no good reason to “upgrade” to 11 if you already have 10.
whereBeWaldo@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 13 Feb 2024 18:47
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Until the Windows 10 eol at least. Man I don’t want 14.10.25 to come
Meh, OS’s don’t die at EOL. There are thousands, if not millions, of machines running Win2k that simply can’t be upgraded because they run industry systems.
And before anyone cries about security - if you’re relying on the OS for your security you’re ignoring everything else (the other layers) that are required… You’re doing it wrong.
There are thousands (tens of thousands?) of Win2k machines that can’t be upgraded because they drive industry systems. Hell, there’s Win95 machines doing the same. Their security is ensured by incorporating layers of control… As should be done with any system, commensurate with it’s risk and criticality.
EngineerGaming@feddit.nl
on 15 Feb 2024 07:23
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You are also forgetting millions of consumers still running Windows XP or 7 and not upgrading not because something critical depends on it, but because “if it ain’t broken, don’t fix it”.
lazynooblet@lazysoci.al
on 15 Feb 2024 07:54
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If there are exploitable remote execution attacks at the OS level that’s a pretty big hole to fill in with additional measures. Anything short of totally isolated would be a risk imo.
To reach their own. I don’t give a hoot about the features in Windows, as long as it runs my games. And I like the look of Windows 11 more than I do 10. So that’s good enough for me. It doesn’t affect me more than the aesthetics. To me it’s an upgrade.
Windows 11 isn’t bad. But it’s a sidegrade from 10. For example, I have an ultrawide HDR display and 11 is a must for HDR. But the damn start bar can’t move to the left anymore which is super annoying on an ultrawide.
iAmTheTot@kbin.social
on 13 Feb 2024 18:35
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Didn't they make it so you could put start back on the left? I'm 99% sure computers at work have done it.
I think they mean put the entire taskbar vertically on the left side of the screen, not left align the icons on the bottom of the taskbar.
iAmTheTot@kbin.social
on 13 Feb 2024 19:01
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Ah I see.
ElusiveClarity@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 19:21
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I haven’t tried it yet so I can’t vouch for it but I’ve read good things about a software called Explorer Patcher that can fix a lot of the W11 garbage.
Evilcoleslaw@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 19:40
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Explorer Patcher just straight gives you the Windows 10 UI but it’s had a lot of stability issues especially as new builds of Windows roll out.
There are some other alternatives like Open Shell which is free and can give more of an XP, Vista, or Win7 style start menu. Then there’s paid options which are a little more polished like StartAllBack and Start11.
On the other hand if the only thing that bothers you is the context menu changes there are a couple of things you can do. You can edit a registry key to just get the old context menu. Or you can use Context Menu for Windows 11 to add your own context menu entries for applications where the developers won’t include the “new” method to register their shell extensions. (It’s been around since Windows 7 IIRC, but has no advantages over the old method until 11.)
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 19:44
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For me Windows 11 gets me about 30 minutes to an hour better battery life than 10. That doesn’t sound like much, but going from 2 to almost 3 is pretty big improvement.
Now that devs finally updated their programs to show up in the new right click menu it’s not obnoxious anymore, and unlike a bloated 10 install doesn’t take 10 years to open.
Sneptaur@pawb.social
on 13 Feb 2024 17:59
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Switch to Linux
chameleon@kbin.social
on 13 Feb 2024 18:46
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This is also going to affect Linux distros, many are moving to x86-64-v2 or even v3. That comes with the same requirements this Win11 build is going to enforce.
There's plenty of life left in some of the later hardware not on the official Win11 support list, but hardware old enough to be excluded by this build is really overdue for retirement and/or being considered retrocomputing.
far_university1990@feddit.de
on 13 Feb 2024 19:30
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Many distro seem to go with „one package v3/v2, one for earlier pc“ and make package manager install correct one. So no „cant use on old hardware“ impact.
Also linux runs on 30+ year old hardware, not gonna change that now.
Sneptaur@pawb.social
on 13 Feb 2024 20:15
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That makes sense, but remember that security patches are backported to old kernels for quite a long time. Therefore, using an LTS release of Linux should extend a computer’s life longer than Windows.
KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 14 Feb 2024 05:37
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What in the world are yall running machines this old for? Literally a $50 modern computer would be an improvement, and would likely more than quarter the energy requirement.
Just because you can still run 20 year old hardware, doesn’t mean you should.
Sneptaur@pawb.social
on 14 Feb 2024 15:34
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I’m not running anything old, just kinda trolling a bit and being an annoyance about Linux.
CriticalMiss@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 2024 06:43
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Considering Debian still ships 32bit, this likely won’t affect my distro of choice.
Show me file compatibility that doesn’t wack your files, so you can trust you’re seeing what the author intended.
Show me Publisher, any kind of CAD.
Which shell are you using?
I can go on for days why the “switch to Linux” mantra is simplistic and naive, at best.
Linux has its place, but I’m not dealing with supporting users with it as a desktop OS. I don’t even use it myself (other than to tinker), because I don’t have time to play fuck-fuck with borked files from one system to another. My “get work done” machines run Windows, especially because I work with other people, and I need to ensure any documents I send to them appear as intended.
There’s a reason Windows is the defacto standard, and it’s the standardized UI (and not by accident, if you read the MS research from the 80’s). Add to that support for systems management since the early 90’s, with SMS, Exchange/DC (a directory service) that all works natively with the OS since Win2k.
Linux as the base for a hypervisor? Fantastic. As a host for docker? Great! As a base OS for lightweight, dedicated-purpose devices (RPi, consumer routers, hell, commercial routers! IoT)? Perfect!
Sneptaur@pawb.social
on 13 Feb 2024 20:14
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To be fair, your arguments basically boil down to “show me equivalent Linux support for Microsoft products”
You could make all the same arguments and conclude Macs are less suitable for doing work than windows, yet there are tons of professionals using MacBooks who get by just fine. If you don’t need to be fully ingrained in the Microsoft ecosystem you don’t NEED to be on windows.
This only affects people running Intel/amd chips pre 2008-2011
The last version of win11 supporting these processors is EOL in 2025. Windows 10 is also EOL in 2025
Kissaki@feddit.de
on 13 Feb 2024 17:30
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If the CPU does not support POPCNT, Windows 11 version 24H2 will not boot. The instruction requires a processors that supports SSE4.2 or SSE4a.
[…] Intel launched support for SSE4.2 in Intel Nehalem core processors in late 2008. AMD added support for the instructions in late 2011. Older processors continued to be sold for some time.
The article may be a bit off on the AMD processors, K10 (Phenom etc) supports SSE4a and was released in late 2007.
MeekerThanBeaker@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 17:39
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From what I’ve read, it only affects AMD processors from 2011 and earlier, and Intel processors from 2008 and earlier.
So… just people who bypassed the earlier TPM requirement and installed Windows 11 on those older CPUs for some reason.
Who would do this, like three people in the world?
tripledd@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 18:38
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Guess I’m one of the three. I did the tpm bypass on an old computer I built way back. Mostly just for fun, I don’t actually use it for anything anymore.
That said, looks like the CPU is new enough (i7 950) this change won’t affect it.
Evilcoleslaw@lemmy.world
on 13 Feb 2024 19:17
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This is kind of a nothingburger. It requires an instruction that first launched on AMD Phenom and Intel’s Nehalem architecture (1st gen i5/i7). I would think the vast majority of people running 11 on unsupported CPUs would be running something newer than that.
KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 14 Feb 2024 05:34
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Doesn’t stop certain communities raging. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Jaysyn@kbin.social
on 13 Feb 2024 19:39
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Don't worry MS, any PC with those processors in my house are already safely running Linux.
Thanks for your concern.
Kumabear@lemmy.world
on 16 Feb 2024 02:11
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I think windows 10 is going to be the last windows I use on my personal computer.
I hope that proton and general native Linux gaming support gets to a fully supported level before they kill off windows 10.
With the popularity of the steam deck for the first time I’m actually somewhat confident it’s going to get there eventually.
threaded - newest
Even less reasons to move on from Windows 10, nice!
This barely affects anyone apparently, so feel free to upgrade. Windows 11 isn’t bad at all. I’m enjoying it whenever I have to use it. (I basically boot Steam and play games and reboot to Linux, so that’s the extent of it.)
Windows 11 adds nothing good to 10, and introduces a bunch of highly anti-consumer features that are difficult if not impossible to disable. There’s absolutely no good reason to “upgrade” to 11 if you already have 10.
Until the Windows 10 eol at least. Man I don’t want 14.10.25 to come
Meh, OS’s don’t die at EOL. There are thousands, if not millions, of machines running Win2k that simply can’t be upgraded because they run industry systems.
And before anyone cries about security - if you’re relying on the OS for your security you’re ignoring everything else (the other layers) that are required… You’re doing it wrong.
There are thousands (tens of thousands?) of Win2k machines that can’t be upgraded because they drive industry systems. Hell, there’s Win95 machines doing the same. Their security is ensured by incorporating layers of control… As should be done with any system, commensurate with it’s risk and criticality.
You are also forgetting millions of consumers still running Windows XP or 7 and not upgrading not because something critical depends on it, but because “if it ain’t broken, don’t fix it”.
If there are exploitable remote execution attacks at the OS level that’s a pretty big hole to fill in with additional measures. Anything short of totally isolated would be a risk imo.
To reach their own. I don’t give a hoot about the features in Windows, as long as it runs my games. And I like the look of Windows 11 more than I do 10. So that’s good enough for me. It doesn’t affect me more than the aesthetics. To me it’s an upgrade.
Windows 11 isn’t bad. But it’s a sidegrade from 10. For example, I have an ultrawide HDR display and 11 is a must for HDR. But the damn start bar can’t move to the left anymore which is super annoying on an ultrawide.
Didn't they make it so you could put start back on the left? I'm 99% sure computers at work have done it.
I think they mean put the entire taskbar vertically on the left side of the screen, not left align the icons on the bottom of the taskbar.
Ah I see.
I haven’t tried it yet so I can’t vouch for it but I’ve read good things about a software called Explorer Patcher that can fix a lot of the W11 garbage.
Explorer Patcher just straight gives you the Windows 10 UI but it’s had a lot of stability issues especially as new builds of Windows roll out.
There are some other alternatives like Open Shell which is free and can give more of an XP, Vista, or Win7 style start menu. Then there’s paid options which are a little more polished like StartAllBack and Start11.
On the other hand if the only thing that bothers you is the context menu changes there are a couple of things you can do. You can edit a registry key to just get the old context menu. Or you can use Context Menu for Windows 11 to add your own context menu entries for applications where the developers won’t include the “new” method to register their shell extensions. (It’s been around since Windows 7 IIRC, but has no advantages over the old method until 11.)
For me Windows 11 gets me about 30 minutes to an hour better battery life than 10. That doesn’t sound like much, but going from 2 to almost 3 is pretty big improvement.
Now that devs finally updated their programs to show up in the new right click menu it’s not obnoxious anymore, and unlike a bloated 10 install doesn’t take 10 years to open.
Switch to Linux
This is also going to affect Linux distros, many are moving to x86-64-v2 or even v3. That comes with the same requirements this Win11 build is going to enforce.
There's plenty of life left in some of the later hardware not on the official Win11 support list, but hardware old enough to be excluded by this build is really overdue for retirement and/or being considered retrocomputing.
Many distro seem to go with „one package v3/v2, one for earlier pc“ and make package manager install correct one. So no „cant use on old hardware“ impact.
Also linux runs on 30+ year old hardware, not gonna change that now.
That makes sense, but remember that security patches are backported to old kernels for quite a long time. Therefore, using an LTS release of Linux should extend a computer’s life longer than Windows.
What in the world are yall running machines this old for? Literally a $50 modern computer would be an improvement, and would likely more than quarter the energy requirement.
Just because you can still run 20 year old hardware, doesn’t mean you should.
I’m not running anything old, just kinda trolling a bit and being an annoyance about Linux.
Considering Debian still ships 32bit, this likely won’t affect my distro of choice.
Hahahajahahajha
OK.
Show me tables in any open competitor to excel.
Show me OneNote/Sharepoint
Show me SCOM.
Show me file compatibility that doesn’t wack your files, so you can trust you’re seeing what the author intended.
Show me Publisher, any kind of CAD.
Which shell are you using?
I can go on for days why the “switch to Linux” mantra is simplistic and naive, at best.
Linux has its place, but I’m not dealing with supporting users with it as a desktop OS. I don’t even use it myself (other than to tinker), because I don’t have time to play fuck-fuck with borked files from one system to another. My “get work done” machines run Windows, especially because I work with other people, and I need to ensure any documents I send to them appear as intended.
There’s a reason Windows is the defacto standard, and it’s the standardized UI (and not by accident, if you read the MS research from the 80’s). Add to that support for systems management since the early 90’s, with SMS, Exchange/DC (a directory service) that all works natively with the OS since Win2k.
Linux as the base for a hypervisor? Fantastic. As a host for docker? Great! As a base OS for lightweight, dedicated-purpose devices (RPi, consumer routers, hell, commercial routers! IoT)? Perfect!
Switch to Linux, lol.
To be fair, your arguments basically boil down to “show me equivalent Linux support for Microsoft products”
You could make all the same arguments and conclude Macs are less suitable for doing work than windows, yet there are tons of professionals using MacBooks who get by just fine. If you don’t need to be fully ingrained in the Microsoft ecosystem you don’t NEED to be on windows.
This only affects people running Intel/amd chips pre 2008-2011
The last version of win11 supporting these processors is EOL in 2025. Windows 10 is also EOL in 2025
The article may be a bit off on the AMD processors, K10 (Phenom etc) supports SSE4a and was released in late 2007.
From what I’ve read, it only affects AMD processors from 2011 and earlier, and Intel processors from 2008 and earlier.
So… just people who bypassed the earlier TPM requirement and installed Windows 11 on those older CPUs for some reason.
Who would do this, like three people in the world?
Guess I’m one of the three. I did the tpm bypass on an old computer I built way back. Mostly just for fun, I don’t actually use it for anything anymore.
That said, looks like the CPU is new enough (i7 950) this change won’t affect it.
Not having a TPM doesn't mean that old
sure, but not having POPCNT means way older than not having TPM
.
that's sorta what I meant
The oldest machines to support windows 11 are about years old at this point. It’s OK to call them old.
Old =/= unusable/useless
What the POPCNT instruction is used for
This is kind of a nothingburger. It requires an instruction that first launched on AMD Phenom and Intel’s Nehalem architecture (1st gen i5/i7). I would think the vast majority of people running 11 on unsupported CPUs would be running something newer than that.
Doesn’t stop certain communities raging. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Don't worry MS, any PC with those processors in my house are already safely running Linux.
Thanks for your concern.
I think windows 10 is going to be the last windows I use on my personal computer.
I hope that proton and general native Linux gaming support gets to a fully supported level before they kill off windows 10.
With the popularity of the steam deck for the first time I’m actually somewhat confident it’s going to get there eventually.