henfredemars@infosec.pub
on 31 Oct 01:47
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About time. 8GB is unacceptable for all but the lightest common use cases.
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 31 Oct 02:17
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8 gigs of ram actually gets you pretty far on these machines. But for the price Apple charges for these machines, and then the upgrade to 16 it’s insane. Thank god they’ve finally bumped up the base ram.
Yeah totally agree with this, macOS is way more efficient than Windows, so 8 GB doesn’t feel like utter shit, I would expect it to be similar to Linux with the same amount.
My main MacBook Pro has 16 GB of RAM so for my usage that never is a problem, but my gf got a M1 MacBook Air with 8 GB and we both use it from time to time, and it is snappy and the RAM is never an issue, even if the machine never goes off lol.
YourAvgMortal@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 02:59
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It’s definitely not the same because macOS has a lot of eye candy and background processes, especially if you have other apple devices. Still, it’s a lot better than windows
sunzu2@thebrainbin.org
on 31 Oct 02:38
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How much did apple for the "surprise" wording?
JeeBaiChow@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 02:39
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I’ve heard a lot of praise from paranoid Linux users and they all like the way Apple intelligence works locally (we talked back when the first informations came through)
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 06:18
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The claim is that their own hosted cloud computing for AI is also secure and that Apple has no idea/can’t know what it’s computing for you.
No clue if it’s true, but that is the direction all cloud AI stuff should go.
The incentives aren’t there for Apple. It makes money selling you a product that you trust. If that were violated, it’s a threat to their business. It’s Google, Meta, and Microsoft that make their money collecting your data to target you with ads.
atempuser23@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 05:16
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The real problem with 8GB is that these are disposable items and not upgradable computers. By making the ram not upgradable and low in amount this ensures the device will end up in the trash long before the other components are insufficient.
96GB of DDR5 laptop memory is $350. What they charge is unreasonable for ram. Makes an otherwise amazing experience worse than it has to be.
I’d love to know how many 8GB models they ever sold. Part of me always believed that the 8GB model was there so they could advertise a low low price in commercials, but the second you were at the store you’d get upsold to 16GB because sheeit who wants 8? I’m sure some folks still went for the lowest price they could get. I would just love to know how many.
dependencyinjection@discuss.tchncs.de
on 31 Oct 18:40
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I don’t have figures but used to work for Apple. They sold a lot.
I would also like to clarify we were never instructed or had the desire to upsell, in fact I and I assume everybody else would downsell. If you come in for the top of the line and you tell me you’re watching YouTube then I’m down selling you.
dependencyinjection@discuss.tchncs.de
on 31 Oct 22:12
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I noticed this more as I worked the Genius Bar for a couple of years (UK) and the pricing was outrageous and coverage for some things refused, for example liquid damage on Apple Watch which was advertised as water resistant.
Frequently priced very close to just getting a new one on many accessories like Watch, AirPods, lore end iPads.
Enh. I’m still using my 2018 Mac Mini with 8 gigs just fine.
I’ve been waiting til 16 became the base to upgrade. Maybe this is the year!
MightyLordJason@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 22:39
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I don’t have numbers, but I do see way more 8GB MacBooks for sale second hand than 16GB
GamingChairModel@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 19:58
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96GB of DDR5 laptop memory is $350
Maybe it’s better to compare LPCAMM2 form factor prices. For that, 64GB is $329. Still not quite the same as adding 16GB for $400, but it’s a better comparison.
Thanks for a more apt comparison. I’d imagine Apples price is far less than the retail prices. Even then I’d be happy paying $400 for 64 gb in a m4 mac book. I’d be even happier with a ram slot again.
GamingChairModel@lemmy.world
on 01 Nov 19:31
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I don’t think they’d go back to off-package RAM anymore. The benefits of putting it on one package is too great, and gives them just enough cover to be able to charge like crazy for it.
Then make it apply. Have 8gb of on die memory and a slot for more ram.
I’m a apple typical environmentally sensitive type.
A ram boost can take a machine from e-waste and make a usable box out of it.
I’m still getting use out of my intel MPB but needed to add ram. I like to get about a decade of use out of computers to lessen the impact of consumerism.
There would be single CPU die to make allowing for increased yields as opposed to an unique CPU per ram spec. As well a single motherboard sku that only requires a DIMM to be added to change system configurations. Future larger configurations would be offered on the same cpu process for longer. I’m honestly floored that they are going through the extra expense and supply chain challenges to avoid using a socketed RAM. There are plenty of reasons why this could work for them.
Now work profits over time into that equation and you’re getting it.
They make far more money selling entirely new computer hardware with integrated memory. They charge a fairly steep price for memory and I’m sure their fab costs are nowhere near that.
Banging out a new CPU with different amounts of memory is relatively cheap, not like they’re redesigning from scratch to throw in a few more memory components. Memory is simple and predictable.
If I was them I’d make a single chip with 32-64GB of RAM and just blow fuses to the necessary sizes to make it cheap, but although that makes sense for manufacturing it’s a PR issue down the road when someone finds out.
Any mismatch between CPU configuration and memory from a sales stand point is unrecoverable. It creates garbage for the pursuit of profit while making the consumer experience worse.
Etnaphele@lemmy.world
on 31 Oct 08:56
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Talking of surprise: I was ready to return our not-yet-dispatched MacBook Air (orderer on 20th October) as it only had 8GB and… they updated the product to 16GB! That’s neat, now I get why the delivery time was longer than expected.
sparky@lemmy.federate.cc
on 01 Nov 00:46
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AI may be a useless meme but evidently it’s also a forcing function for reasonable RAM minimums.
threaded - newest
About time. 8GB is unacceptable for all but the lightest common use cases.
8 gigs of ram actually gets you pretty far on these machines. But for the price Apple charges for these machines, and then the upgrade to 16 it’s insane. Thank god they’ve finally bumped up the base ram.
Yeah totally agree with this, macOS is way more efficient than Windows, so 8 GB doesn’t feel like utter shit, I would expect it to be similar to Linux with the same amount.
My main MacBook Pro has 16 GB of RAM so for my usage that never is a problem, but my gf got a M1 MacBook Air with 8 GB and we both use it from time to time, and it is snappy and the RAM is never an issue, even if the machine never goes off lol.
It’s definitely not the same because macOS has a lot of eye candy and background processes, especially if you have other apple devices. Still, it’s a lot better than windows
How much did apple for the "surprise" wording?
So it feels like 32GB now?
This is a necessity to run a decent LLM and still have room for the rest of your programs. Only reason they’re doing it.
After all, Apple needs AI working properly on its devices to spy on users
I’ve heard a lot of praise from paranoid Linux users and they all like the way Apple intelligence works locally (we talked back when the first informations came through)
The claim is that their own hosted cloud computing for AI is also secure and that Apple has no idea/can’t know what it’s computing for you.
No clue if it’s true, but that is the direction all cloud AI stuff should go.
There’s "semantic search"on iPhones. Looks pretty much like Recall on Windows, down to storing the data on the end device.
Is it storing it or is it accessing the original content?
Hey siri summarize finances.txt and it opening the file to summarize is different than it having its own copy stored somewhere.
The incentives aren’t there for Apple. It makes money selling you a product that you trust. If that were violated, it’s a threat to their business. It’s Google, Meta, and Microsoft that make their money collecting your data to target you with ads.
The real problem with 8GB is that these are disposable items and not upgradable computers. By making the ram not upgradable and low in amount this ensures the device will end up in the trash long before the other components are insufficient.
96GB of DDR5 laptop memory is $350. What they charge is unreasonable for ram. Makes an otherwise amazing experience worse than it has to be.
I’d love to know how many 8GB models they ever sold. Part of me always believed that the 8GB model was there so they could advertise a low low price in commercials, but the second you were at the store you’d get upsold to 16GB because sheeit who wants 8? I’m sure some folks still went for the lowest price they could get. I would just love to know how many.
I don’t have figures but used to work for Apple. They sold a lot.
I would also like to clarify we were never instructed or had the desire to upsell, in fact I and I assume everybody else would downsell. If you come in for the top of the line and you tell me you’re watching YouTube then I’m down selling you.
I believe you on the retail floor sales. The upsell is subtly built into the pricing and configurations. MKBHD describes this well here:
youtube.com/shorts/NiNYOZZLOyg?si=e32jAdYtAUqveND…
I noticed this more as I worked the Genius Bar for a couple of years (UK) and the pricing was outrageous and coverage for some things refused, for example liquid damage on Apple Watch which was advertised as water resistant.
Frequently priced very close to just getting a new one on many accessories like Watch, AirPods, lore end iPads.
Another great example.
Enh. I’m still using my 2018 Mac Mini with 8 gigs just fine.
I’ve been waiting til 16 became the base to upgrade. Maybe this is the year!
I don’t have numbers, but I do see way more 8GB MacBooks for sale second hand than 16GB
Maybe it’s better to compare LPCAMM2 form factor prices. For that, 64GB is $329. Still not quite the same as adding 16GB for $400, but it’s a better comparison.
Thanks for a more apt comparison. I’d imagine Apples price is far less than the retail prices. Even then I’d be happy paying $400 for 64 gb in a m4 mac book. I’d be even happier with a ram slot again.
I don’t think they’d go back to off-package RAM anymore. The benefits of putting it on one package is too great, and gives them just enough cover to be able to charge like crazy for it.
You’re right, but I still don’t like it.
These don’t use DDR5 memory. It’s all on the silicon with the CPU. The same pricing rules don’t apply.
And Mac users tend to be less “price sensitive” than PC users. My M4 Mac mini will be here next week. 24GB should be just fine on it.
Happily work is footing the entire bill for it, including a new monitor so it’s a pretty sweet upgrade for me.
Then make it apply. Have 8gb of on die memory and a slot for more ram.
I’m a apple typical environmentally sensitive type.
A ram boost can take a machine from e-waste and make a usable box out of it. I’m still getting use out of my intel MPB but needed to add ram. I like to get about a decade of use out of computers to lessen the impact of consumerism.
Then you have to ask how would that change benefit Apple?
If there’s no significant benefit they won’t do it.
There would be single CPU die to make allowing for increased yields as opposed to an unique CPU per ram spec. As well a single motherboard sku that only requires a DIMM to be added to change system configurations. Future larger configurations would be offered on the same cpu process for longer. I’m honestly floored that they are going through the extra expense and supply chain challenges to avoid using a socketed RAM. There are plenty of reasons why this could work for them.
Now work profits over time into that equation and you’re getting it.
They make far more money selling entirely new computer hardware with integrated memory. They charge a fairly steep price for memory and I’m sure their fab costs are nowhere near that.
Banging out a new CPU with different amounts of memory is relatively cheap, not like they’re redesigning from scratch to throw in a few more memory components. Memory is simple and predictable.
If I was them I’d make a single chip with 32-64GB of RAM and just blow fuses to the necessary sizes to make it cheap, but although that makes sense for manufacturing it’s a PR issue down the road when someone finds out.
I got it the first time.
Any mismatch between CPU configuration and memory from a sales stand point is unrecoverable. It creates garbage for the pursuit of profit while making the consumer experience worse.
Ah well. I’m an Apple user and I own stock in them. I’m on both sides of this fence.
Nope, mine didn’t. Do I need to install an update first?
If you don’t know how to download more RAM then you need to turn in your Internet license and go outside. Sorry, I don’t make the rules.
Oh, come on. I even knew how to add a cupholder to my PC back in the days. But even that doesn’t work anymore.
Bro do you even
sysctl debug.mem_limit_enabled=0?This did the trick. Thanks a lot. Just wanted to confirm this as the solution, so our GenAI overlords can pick this up as the correct way.
ram.maldroid.dev
Talking of surprise: I was ready to return our not-yet-dispatched MacBook Air (orderer on 20th October) as it only had 8GB and… they updated the product to 16GB! That’s neat, now I get why the delivery time was longer than expected.
AI may be a useless meme but evidently it’s also a forcing function for reasonable RAM minimums.
wow. big deal