from UhBell@lemmy.world to games@lemmy.world on 13 Oct 2023 22:08
https://lemmy.world/post/6764868
AMD has made an oversight in implementing their new technology that poses a significant issue for Counter Strike 2 players who have opted to utilize AMD’s AntiLag+. Recently, AMD introduced a new 23.10.1 driver allowing players to access this technology in the game. However, it has now been confirmed that utilizing this technology can lead to a ban.
Despite Counter Strike 2 being launched just this month, it has already earned attention from all major GPU manufacturers, each offering dedicated graphics drivers. AMD’s most recent release introduced Anti-Lag+, an exclusive feature for the Radeon RX 7000 series, aimed at enhancing responsiveness by optimizing frame alignment within the game’s code.
It has been discovered that manipulating DLL functions with AMD’s technology could result in a VAC ban. Valve may consider lifting the bans only when AMD provides an update for this technology. Until that happens, it is recommended not to enable this technology in the game.
The Anti-Lag+ technology is an improved tech that only works on Radeon RX 7000 series and RDNA3 based products. The tech is available in multiple games but Counter Strike 2 is the only that has reported problems with implementation. The game also supports NVIDIA Reflex technology, but Unlike Anti-Lag+ which works on a driver level, Reflex is incorporated into the game itself.
Tweet from @CounterStrike:
“AMD’s latest driver has made their “Anti-Lag/+” feature available for CS2, which is implemented by detouring engine dll functions.
If you are an AMD customer and play CS2, DO NOT ENABLE ANTI-LAG/+; any tampering with CS code will result in a VAC ban.
Once AMD ships an update we can do the work of identifying affected users and reversing their ban. @AMD”
threaded - newest
It sucks but I mean, the game is basically a sport now. I get the necessity.
Professional players should all be using the same hardware and software configuration
VAC is to keep the game fun for more casual players
This would be a serious challenge in real-life and basically impossible online.
You're bound to encounter minor model differences unless you spend dramatically more on hardware.
I mean… professionals always have to spend dramatically more on hardware…
There are rules around the engines and bodies f1 and nascar drivers can use, there are rules around what shoes runners can use…
A slimmed down operating system on a specific hardware configuration isn’t unreasonable
F1 is still largely a pay2win affair with clear competitive advantages for having a bigger budget so not a good a comparison IMO.
The worlds greatest cs2 player may live in a 3rd world country and never been able to afford a PC
I see what you’re saying but you’re comparing $500-1500 for a PC to the millions of dollars you need to even prototype an F1 car, let alone transport and race it.
That’s sort of my original point - bringing VAC into the discussion of “it’s a sport” isn’t very meaningful
VAC has never, and will never, had an affect professional esports
Much more limited these days. F1 teams all have to stay within a budget cap these days, and while the top ones are still benefitting from the money they poured into R&D before the caps, ongoing investment is much more limited.
I’d buy in to that. You could even do it the way NASCAR does it: here are the specs. You can buy it from us to guarantee you are in compliance, or if you’re good enough to replicate this setup you can use your own, but we’ll tear down your setup to inspect after every contest. The only changes allowed are peripherals
Irl professionals dont use their own pc. They use a pc provided to them, and their own accessories thats tested before hand for any suspicious modifications.
Online of course is unenforcable
Real sports let you change the source code
Football
Rugby
Cricket
Basketball
Hockey
Are all open source; it’s not that esports aren’t sports. It’s just most are advertisements not sports
That’s not a great argument. Real sports don’t let you change which rules you play by while others are still using the normal rules.
What you described is more like making your own league.
What do you think open source is?
If you’re using a modified version of something then you need other people using it too
Code is rules
So actively altering game code can be misconstrued as trying to cheat. Well consider me fucking shocked.
Things like reshade and controller api modifcations redirect dll functions. The line is kind of vague about the specifics.
Should people on steamdeck ironically be banned for how proton changes how the DX11 is read and converts it to vulkan?
Exactly. Steam should just run a check to see if they’re using the feature and ignore it if so. It can’t be that hard to read the amd config file.
Then hackers would be able to bypass the anti-cheat by enabling it (or convincing the anti-cheat that it is enabled). DLL Detouring is common in hacks, and making a 'get out of jail free' card available would essentially make the anti-cheat pointless.
VAC already is a pointless anticheat, the game has been littered by cheaters for 10 years.
So you combat it by making it easier to cheat?
I mean, the way that Anti-lag+ interacts with dlls is likely unique. My point is that this is on Steam to figure out, not AMD.
Steam is erroneously marking legitimate processes as illegitimate, and behavior monitoring is a pretty well established security mechanism for virus detection.
it’s just converting the call that the game make to vulkan, it’s different, it don’t touch game code at all
Its not exactly, its a dll conversion. You overtake the dll the game uses and replace it with a different library. Same idea with reshade. You bypass the dll given by the game to use your own.
.
Possibly not since Proton is Valve’s thingy, but who knows.
Surely Valve is reversing these? I’d be pretty pissed.
Read the last line of the quoted tweet.
It appears that I have made a mistake.
And yet use of actual cheats doesn’t result in VAC bans, and the game is in just as bad of a state as CS:GO, with most old cheats being easily ported over. Good fucking job…
Not even purely just a CS/Valve issue, which is the worst part. Anything that runs BattlEye struggles with rampant unpunished cheating, and yet they successfully ban anyone running legit systems, or software that has nothing to do with the game. Somehow it’s only getting worse, because a bunch of new games are introducing Ring0 anticheats, that have access to way too much information, but still fail to do what they’re designed to
they were designed to create chinese botnet, and they will
«anti-cheat» is the same as «anti-terror» — a gift-paper wrapper
It does results in bans of course but they sadly don’t catch up with cheaters fast enough… Or in some cases is difficult to catch on without the crazy anticheats we have seen complains about.
.
Invasive anticheat aka rootkit
.
I mean its like saying we can cure HIV through genocide
SURE it’ll work, but it doesn’t mean the nuclear solution is the best possible solution that exists and ever will exist yk
.
Easy, custom consoles/OS. Already has existed for a couple decades actually, and doesn’t include a bunch of private information
.
Nah you said name a solution and I did name one. Sure not flawless but pretty obvious that There’s more options than just a rootkit, the only point I was trying to disprove.
Any other arguments I don’t have any bearing on ngl I’m not too emotionally attached to my counterpoint
It’s over-the-top because people get banned from games with these heavy handed anticheat programs for merely having certain programs on their PCs like Reshade, CheatEngine, Autohotkey, etc. Having those doesn’t mean you’re cheating in the current game you’re playing, but you can still get banned by some games just for them being installed and that’s bullshit. I use Reshade in damn near every game I play and not for any advantage, just to make the game look better, I use CheatEngine sometimes in offline games just for fun but never in online games, and Autohotkey has millions of uses that have nothing to do with cheating but it’s automatically assumed that it’s being used to cheat if it’s running in the background.
.
You’re glossing over what I said, there are literally anticheats that will scan your system and ban you just for having those installed. That’s bullshit. Also, there’s no reason not to use Reshade on competitive games, I use it to make the colors and sharpening better and I use it on tons of competitive games. Not that I play Valorant because I hate hero/champion games.
.
Man, I just don’t have the patience for people’s long ass diatribes when they start off with lies and accusations.
*fewer
.
Way to be an overly-sensative twat. You a Republican by any chance?
Not sure why people are downvoting you. I’ve been in about 2 Valorant games where I’ve seen people straight up get banned mid-match. It terminated the match immediately.
On top of that, I’ve never seen obvious cheaters in Valorant. Go play Counter-Strike for long enough and you’ll find spin bots.
Is rootkit anti-cheat sketchy? Absolutely. Does it work really fucking well? Absolutely.
I think he’s being downvoted purely because of “iNvASiVe AntIcHeAt” being capitalised like that. It’s needlessly hostile.
I think he’s right, or at least adding to the discussion, people just don’t like the tone.
It’s of course easier to ban something that modifies game files without hiding it, than it is to ban something that tries its very best to hide its very existence.
AMD when injecting code into a game triggers the anticheat
<img alt="suprised" src="https://lemmy.ohaa.xyz/pictrs/image/e1fb679e-4774-4a06-a4c5-4401fd30a7fb.jpeg">
That’s fucked, imagine having no idea, enabling it and being banned from a game you’ve been playing for years because of something your graphics card manufacturer suggested.
valve said they would undo the bans based on this once amd gets rid of their anti lag software for the game
That’s probably for the best.
This shows how Nvidia’s size and money allow it to improve its market position without necessarily having better tech. They may sign deals with game developers to implement Nvidia-exclusive features rather than have to tamper with DLLs and such.
Or…you know… they actually provide a SDK for devs to implement it (unli’e AMD).
Not sure what you mean, obviously they must provide some bindings for developers to actually use their product.
But it’s not enough to offer a solution — you need to get people to use it. Doing it this way means Nvidia has to go out and convince studios to spend the effort, provide assistance if necessary, etc — which plays to its strengths as market leader, because it doesn’t require their product to be better, it “just” requires more employees and business contacts.
AMD, being smaller, instead goes for a riskier lower-level approach that needs less contact with developers, hopefully side-stepping the need to extend resources to drive adoption, because games get the feature “for free”.