FancyLad@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 07:43
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Vaporware until proven otherwise. I’ve given up on caring
Fecundpossum@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 07:58
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Yeah, and it’s sad bro. I put about 900 hours into Elite: Dangerous, which I enjoyed a great deal, but it still left me longing for something with more depth. Back then I thought Star Citizen would be the next leap forward in my career as a space trucker who dabbles in bounty hunting and deep space exploration. I wanted to have games worthy of justifying a home cockpit setup, and now it seems like a lost cause.
I really hope someone picks up the torch. Even if it’s just Frontier making a generational leap with the Elite IP.
subignition@fedia.io
on 18 Oct 2024 08:33
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Elite:Dangerous is sad for its own reasons, too, and I have a similar count of hours logged. Glacial pace of development and a lack of strong game design / sense for balance. I'm still stunned by how much of a selling point the background simulation was, and how limited it actually is in practice (it did get some love over the years, but far too little too late IMO.)
Passerby6497@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 13:24
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I really wanted to like it, but it just never scratched the itch when I played it. I love stuff like freespace 2, but E:D just never did it for me. Which sucks, because the community search thing sounded really fun at the time.
gamermanh@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 18 Oct 2024 18:54
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It annoyingly needs a more complex HOTAS to properly play than most cheap entry-level ones have, while also not having ENOUGH complex need to justify me pulling my godamn keyboard over for
Literally the main reason I don’t play it even though slapping my quest 2 on and space VR flying is fucking fun
Sonotsugipaa@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 18 Oct 2024 08:38
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I haven’t played E:D so I can’t really make comparisons, but maybe X3/X4 can pique your interest?
I don’t think they can justify a home cockpit setup, they’re also kinda hard to get into (especially X3, you can’t get far without a guide), but hey, there’s a combined 1.5% chance that you haven’t heard of them and that you’ll enjoy at least one of them if you don’t care much about graphics. Or voice acting. Or UI/UX.
Agent_Karyo@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 08:59
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X3 is a fun game, with a very developed universe (you’ll see factions conduct invasion in real-time as you do your own thing) with a wide variety of gameplay. The universe of X3 honestly makes Star Citizen seems like a theme park for children.
That being said it is extremely difficult to get into them both because there are so many gameplay options and the UI/UX is subpar (prepare to be constantly fiddling with menu and looking up how to execute a given course of action).
erin@lemmy.sidh.bzh
on 18 Oct 2024 08:59
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peopleproblems@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 09:49
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Good lord if that ain’t the truth.
It has every opportunity to be good, but I can’t even navigate the goddamn menus, let alone step into my ship.
Forget about using something other than a mouse and keyboard too, it just won’t work.
Fecundpossum@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 10:08
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Yeah, I never even bought it after reading the reviews about how janky it is, I want to use a HOTAS and rudder pedals and it doesn’t sound possible in X4
I play it with hotas and it works fine. You’ll absolutely still want to keep a keyboard and mouse handy though because the RTS/management half of the game is really not that well controlled with a flight stick.
PushButton@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 10:16
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Like any of these games, you need to change the key bindings.
I have a set that I use in all space sim. What I am trying to say is that the control can be the same as any other space sim.
This type of game might not be your kind of stuff.
crapwittyname@lemm.ee
on 18 Oct 2024 10:58
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I couldn’t find a way to bind a double press in X4, so hold RB and tap X for example. These combinations are essential because there is no other way to use a controller to perform all of the necessary controls. It’s a shame because I would have invested a lot into the game if that was surmountable.
Steam might be able to bind that. But then you’re probably going to need a diagram next to you while you play so you remember all your controls.
crapwittyname@lemm.ee
on 18 Oct 2024 11:21
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I tried binding in Steam but the controller settings in Steam are kind of terrible too. Half the time I don’t know what a setting does, and I feel like I need to do a training course to understand it. So I gave up and went back to Elite.
I don’t blame you. Over the years I’ve seen some really impressive controller setting though. You can do a lot things with the steam settings. But yeah, you need to want to really invest in learning how to do it, and then actually remembering what you’ve set.
No, X is absolutely my type of game. Don’t blame me for the horrible controls and menus, I didn’t create that hot mess. It’s also a well complained about part of the game.
haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com
on 18 Oct 2024 10:37
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What part do you feel is horrible? I enjoyed playing it a lot.
I play with an HOTAS, so controls are the same as in Star Citizen for me
FancyLad@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 10:13
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I remember how awesome Distant Worlds was, as a community event, and I wish I appreciated it more at the time. 65000 light years and back, I even bought a T-shirt and coin to commemorate the event lol
o7
Fecundpossum@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 10:17
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My big in game accomplishment was making it to SagA*, I spent some time in colonia and joined a discord of nerds that hung out there getting big exploration creds. I actually made the trek all the way back to the bubble after spending about a month in the galactic core. It was an epic adventure in my mind, but afterwards it was hard to be motivated for the engineering grind.
morbidcactus@lemmy.ca
on 18 Oct 2024 12:04
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I sold my pledges off 9 years ago, the reason I even made a reddit account in the first place. Was getting disillusioned with it back then and I was super excited when I initially backed it, had a decent amount of ships in the hangar at the time, but felt like I was only ever going to see them in the hangar
limitedduck@awful.systems
on 18 Oct 2024 12:38
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Stat Citizen has its problems, but it’s literally not vaporware since there’s something available that you can download and play with.
Roberts is relatively well-known in and out of the Star Citizen community for being a perfectionist at the best times.
In a parallel universe, Roberts would have been allowed to continue working on Freelancer, and it would still be in development hell in 2024 with no end in sight.
On the other hand, Starlancer is a perfectly contained game with great singleplayer gameplay, story, coop and a lot of attention to detail that shines and rewards good players for playing the game. So he can do stuff well, the correct environment needs to be there for it to happen though.
You’re probably right. But getting free rein and an almost infinite source of funding is certainly not that environment.
jagermo@feddit.org
on 18 Oct 2024 08:06
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I backed it with about 60$ on the Kickstarter and have tried a few alphas. It’s nice but unpolished. I don’t care about the drama and by this point, if they release a game, I’ll be happily surprised - and if not, meh.
itsnotits@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 10:45
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It’s* nice but unpolished.
DarkThoughts@fedia.io
on 18 Oct 2024 11:25
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Tits* nice but unpolished.
blargbluuk@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Oct 2024 11:41
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I prefer unpolished tits personally
LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world
on 19 Oct 2024 20:27
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Iunno man, just a skinge of Brasso and them breats are pearly shiny 'n blindingly incandescent.
Same for me, though I did splurge a bit ($150 I think) to get the game on a USB key shaped like one of the starships in the game. I will never get that USB key…
If they ever get done I will consider spending more time with it, I don’t really care for early access into an unfinished game.
I should have asked for a refund when we had the chance…
I imagine that the news headlines of the future will be:
12 Dyson Spheres and 700 Million Years Later, What’s Going on With Star Citizen’s Development?
Mango@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 08:14
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I get the emails all the time and have no idea what’s going on.
thisbenzingring@lemmy.sdf.org
on 18 Oct 2024 13:14
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I try to follow the emails also but its a hot mess. I can never understand any interesting developments. Its like reading AI jibberish.
Mandy@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Oct 2024 09:00
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All bs and scam atuff aside. This is what happens when you have a leader who never gets told no.
Dude never finished and feature krept freelancer too before Microsoft kicked him to the curb and finished it themselves.
SupraMario@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 12:58
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Yep, feature creep is basically this entire dev cycle. Dude just keeps adding more and more and never really finishing anything. I grabbed the game on sale a few years ago, I have maybe 15 hours into it. It’s got stuff to do, but not what I would expect from the money and time that’s been spent on it.
At those time frames it’s not just feature creep you have to worry about, but tech- and social creep as well. Think back what games were popular 12 years ago and what hardware we had. That’s why usually in longterm, large scale projects you have a technological freeze, where you essentially ignore all progress made outside of your project for the sake of completion, which Star Citizen clearly hasn’t done.
Mandy@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Oct 2024 17:41
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Onebof the reasons it runs like shit with seemingly going random glitches
They changed engines 4 times.
Their code is held together like an ork gargant
TachyonTele@lemm.ee
on 18 Oct 2024 09:12
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Why finish the game when you can sell “ships” for hundreds of dollars each?
No, it’s horrific. And the reason why is evident in what the previous commenter said.
The most expensive “package” costs $48000. You just don’t see it till you already spend like $10k on the game. They have two additional hidden stores that unlock when you spend money on the game already. The commenter above probably didn’t see those two stores and only knows about the “reasonable” pricing.
Jrockwar@feddit.uk
on 18 Oct 2024 10:08
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$700 million is the estimated development cost of the Falcon Heavy.
Not a game, not a space simulation, but the actual Falcon Heavy rocket. A rocket that can actually go into space.
I know they’re different things but I thought I’d leave this here to put things in perspective.
athairmor@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 13:34
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As of 2022, according to its financials, the company has spent $637 million on development, with 2020 – 2022 averaging over $106 million a year. Assuming that the company continues spending around $100+ million a year, it doesn’t take a mathematician to realize that the $790 million raised so far at the time of writing is on the verge of, or has likely, run out.
No, the article is claiming $700M in development costs—based on $637M spent by 2022–and $790M raised. They’re speculating that the company is going to run out of money soon.
athairmor@lemmy.world
on 18 Oct 2024 14:00
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That’s not how you calculate profit. Their revenue might exceed their costs so far but they have to keep spending. The game isn’t done and it costs money to just keep the lights on.
Look, I don’t know their financials. I’m just correcting what you claimed and pointing out what the article is claiming which is that their spending appears to be outpacing their revenue.
I actually do appreciate the clarification then, thank you. But I’ll still suggest to the readers of this convo, articles like these aren’t written for the edification of its readers, it’s written to bait engagement. The speculations of gaming journalists on Star Citizen is as reliable as Fox News’ speculation on the Mexico/USA border.
And as someonewho has been following following the numbers, it’s growing in revenue and daily active players every year. They just opened a massive new office in Manchester so they can hire more people. The people they do hire get paid well and stick around for years. If they were worried about cash flow, they have a lot of fat they would be trimming right now, but their expenses and revenue keep growing in step with eachother. They have no investors to pay, no vaults to fill. They make money and spend it growing the business. Those expenses represent 12 years of good wages and benefits for workers.
Star citizens success is a threat to capitalist, investor focused gaming. Gaming news is run by game industry capitalists and has zero oversight or accountability for bring truthful.
Silentiea@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 18 Oct 2024 20:50
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Pretty much all articles these days are “written to bait engagement”. Even the ones that are also “written for the edification of [their] readers”.
I don’t think so, SpaceX claimed (and NASA apparently verified) that the development costs for the Falcon 9 were $300 million. It’s in the Wikipedia article, also here: newspaceeconomy.ca/…/how-much-would-falcon-9-have…
I was under the impression that the Falcon Heavy was a ground-up development. But in any case the Falcon 9 was cheaper, so go figure…
tacosanonymous@lemm.ee
on 18 Oct 2024 14:07
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Who tf is Erin Roberts?
ms_lane@lemmy.world
on 19 Oct 2024 01:53
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It was a scam then and it’s still a scam now.
Harvey656@lemmy.world
on 19 Oct 2024 03:45
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They aren’t listening to their community is what. I play almost daily, and all they fucking talk about is ‘wait for 4.0, it’s going to be so much better!’ But they refuse to fix major problems, performance sucks, and the recent 3.24.2 patch may or may not have borked the game in many ways.
They need to perfect the game that already exists, fix the issues and iron out the code before working on more fucking mechanics. I swear it’s so bad. The article calls Chris a perfectionist, but that couldn’t be furtfrom the truth, he is a dreamer, that says put this amazing thing in then forgets about it and moves on to the next thing overnight. The game will go nowhere until he’s gone.
Edit: fixed a spelling error and added some basic formatting.
Denjin@lemmings.world
on 19 Oct 2024 10:01
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Bug fixes don’t bring in new whales with investment money, new silly features does.
The point ceased to be about making the game years ago and became about attracting new money because that’s easy and making good games is hard.
The interesting part is, if they say the game is complete or at least in “1.0” shape, it will suddenly mean that people will judge it as a product and not just a vision. CIG won’t call it finished as long as they possibly can.
threaded - newest
.
Vaporware until proven otherwise. I’ve given up on caring
Yeah, and it’s sad bro. I put about 900 hours into Elite: Dangerous, which I enjoyed a great deal, but it still left me longing for something with more depth. Back then I thought Star Citizen would be the next leap forward in my career as a space trucker who dabbles in bounty hunting and deep space exploration. I wanted to have games worthy of justifying a home cockpit setup, and now it seems like a lost cause.
I really hope someone picks up the torch. Even if it’s just Frontier making a generational leap with the Elite IP.
Elite:Dangerous is sad for its own reasons, too, and I have a similar count of hours logged. Glacial pace of development and a lack of strong game design / sense for balance. I'm still stunned by how much of a selling point the background simulation was, and how limited it actually is in practice (it did get some love over the years, but far too little too late IMO.)
I really wanted to like it, but it just never scratched the itch when I played it. I love stuff like freespace 2, but E:D just never did it for me. Which sucks, because the community search thing sounded really fun at the time.
It annoyingly needs a more complex HOTAS to properly play than most cheap entry-level ones have, while also not having ENOUGH complex need to justify me pulling my godamn keyboard over for
Literally the main reason I don’t play it even though slapping my quest 2 on and space VR flying is fucking fun
I haven’t played E:D so I can’t really make comparisons, but maybe X3/X4 can pique your interest?
I don’t think they can justify a home cockpit setup, they’re also kinda hard to get into (especially X3, you can’t get far without a guide), but hey, there’s a combined 1.5% chance that you haven’t heard of them and that you’ll enjoy at least one of them if you don’t care much about graphics. Or voice acting. Or UI/UX.
X3 is a fun game, with a very developed universe (you’ll see factions conduct invasion in real-time as you do your own thing) with a wide variety of gameplay. The universe of X3 honestly makes Star Citizen seems like a theme park for children.
That being said it is extremely difficult to get into them both because there are so many gameplay options and the UI/UX is subpar (prepare to be constantly fiddling with menu and looking up how to execute a given course of action).
you can try X4: Foundations ^^
The controls in X4 are so horrible though.
Good lord if that ain’t the truth.
It has every opportunity to be good, but I can’t even navigate the goddamn menus, let alone step into my ship.
Forget about using something other than a mouse and keyboard too, it just won’t work.
Yeah, I never even bought it after reading the reviews about how janky it is, I want to use a HOTAS and rudder pedals and it doesn’t sound possible in X4
I play it with hotas and it works fine. You’ll absolutely still want to keep a keyboard and mouse handy though because the RTS/management half of the game is really not that well controlled with a flight stick.
Like any of these games, you need to change the key bindings.
I have a set that I use in all space sim. What I am trying to say is that the control can be the same as any other space sim.
This type of game might not be your kind of stuff.
I couldn’t find a way to bind a double press in X4, so hold RB and tap X for example. These combinations are essential because there is no other way to use a controller to perform all of the necessary controls. It’s a shame because I would have invested a lot into the game if that was surmountable.
Steam might be able to bind that. But then you’re probably going to need a diagram next to you while you play so you remember all your controls.
I tried binding in Steam but the controller settings in Steam are kind of terrible too. Half the time I don’t know what a setting does, and I feel like I need to do a training course to understand it. So I gave up and went back to Elite.
I don’t blame you. Over the years I’ve seen some really impressive controller setting though. You can do a lot things with the steam settings. But yeah, you need to want to really invest in learning how to do it, and then actually remembering what you’ve set.
No, X is absolutely my type of game. Don’t blame me for the horrible controls and menus, I didn’t create that hot mess. It’s also a well complained about part of the game.
What part do you feel is horrible? I enjoyed playing it a lot.
The controls and menus.
I play with an HOTAS, so controls are the same as in Star Citizen for me
I remember how awesome Distant Worlds was, as a community event, and I wish I appreciated it more at the time. 65000 light years and back, I even bought a T-shirt and coin to commemorate the event lol o7
My big in game accomplishment was making it to SagA*, I spent some time in colonia and joined a discord of nerds that hung out there getting big exploration creds. I actually made the trek all the way back to the bubble after spending about a month in the galactic core. It was an epic adventure in my mind, but afterwards it was hard to be motivated for the engineering grind.
I sold my pledges off 9 years ago, the reason I even made a reddit account in the first place. Was getting disillusioned with it back then and I was super excited when I initially backed it, had a decent amount of ships in the hangar at the time, but felt like I was only ever going to see them in the hangar
Stat Citizen has its problems, but it’s literally not vaporware since there’s something available that you can download and play with.
.
In a parallel universe, Roberts would have been allowed to continue working on Freelancer, and it would still be in development hell in 2024 with no end in sight.
On the other hand, Starlancer is a perfectly contained game with great singleplayer gameplay, story, coop and a lot of attention to detail that shines and rewards good players for playing the game. So he can do stuff well, the correct environment needs to be there for it to happen though.
You’re probably right. But getting free rein and an almost infinite source of funding is certainly not that environment.
I backed it with about 60$ on the Kickstarter and have tried a few alphas. It’s nice but unpolished. I don’t care about the drama and by this point, if they release a game, I’ll be happily surprised - and if not, meh.
I prefer unpolished tits personally
Iunno man, just a skinge of Brasso and them breats are pearly shiny 'n blindingly incandescent.
Same for me, though I did splurge a bit ($150 I think) to get the game on a USB key shaped like one of the starships in the game. I will never get that USB key…
If they ever get done I will consider spending more time with it, I don’t really care for early access into an unfinished game.
I should have asked for a refund when we had the chance…
Oh, wait, it was 30 usd. And i backed Shadowrun Online for 66, so Star Citizen might even be the better bet :)
I imagine that the news headlines of the future will be:
I get the emails all the time and have no idea what’s going on.
I try to follow the emails also but its a hot mess. I can never understand any interesting developments. Its like reading AI jibberish.
All bs and scam atuff aside. This is what happens when you have a leader who never gets told no.
Dude never finished and feature krept freelancer too before Microsoft kicked him to the curb and finished it themselves.
Yep, feature creep is basically this entire dev cycle. Dude just keeps adding more and more and never really finishing anything. I grabbed the game on sale a few years ago, I have maybe 15 hours into it. It’s got stuff to do, but not what I would expect from the money and time that’s been spent on it.
At those time frames it’s not just feature creep you have to worry about, but tech- and social creep as well. Think back what games were popular 12 years ago and what hardware we had. That’s why usually in longterm, large scale projects you have a technological freeze, where you essentially ignore all progress made outside of your project for the sake of completion, which Star Citizen clearly hasn’t done.
Onebof the reasons it runs like shit with seemingly going random glitches
They changed engines 4 times.
Their code is held together like an ork gargant
Why finish the game when you can sell “ships” for hundreds of dollars each?
Try thousands. Most expensive ship runs you about 3000$
Jesus. That’s hilarious
No, it’s horrific. And the reason why is evident in what the previous commenter said.
The most expensive “package” costs $48000. You just don’t see it till you already spend like $10k on the game. They have two additional hidden stores that unlock when you spend money on the game already. The commenter above probably didn’t see those two stores and only knows about the “reasonable” pricing.
$700 million is the estimated development cost of the Falcon Heavy.
Not a game, not a space simulation, but the actual Falcon Heavy rocket. A rocket that can actually go into space.
I know they’re different things but I thought I’d leave this here to put things in perspective.
.
No, the article is claiming $700M in development costs—based on $637M spent by 2022–and $790M raised. They’re speculating that the company is going to run out of money soon.
.
That’s not how you calculate profit. Their revenue might exceed their costs so far but they have to keep spending. The game isn’t done and it costs money to just keep the lights on.
Look, I don’t know their financials. I’m just correcting what you claimed and pointing out what the article is claiming which is that their spending appears to be outpacing their revenue.
I actually do appreciate the clarification then, thank you. But I’ll still suggest to the readers of this convo, articles like these aren’t written for the edification of its readers, it’s written to bait engagement. The speculations of gaming journalists on Star Citizen is as reliable as Fox News’ speculation on the Mexico/USA border.
And as someonewho has been following following the numbers, it’s growing in revenue and daily active players every year. They just opened a massive new office in Manchester so they can hire more people. The people they do hire get paid well and stick around for years. If they were worried about cash flow, they have a lot of fat they would be trimming right now, but their expenses and revenue keep growing in step with eachother. They have no investors to pay, no vaults to fill. They make money and spend it growing the business. Those expenses represent 12 years of good wages and benefits for workers.
Star citizens success is a threat to capitalist, investor focused gaming. Gaming news is run by game industry capitalists and has zero oversight or accountability for bring truthful.
Pretty much all articles these days are “written to bait engagement”. Even the ones that are also “written for the edification of [their] readers”.
but only as in the modifications to Falcon 9 to make Falcon Heavy, right?
I don’t think so, SpaceX claimed (and NASA apparently verified) that the development costs for the Falcon 9 were $300 million. It’s in the Wikipedia article, also here: newspaceeconomy.ca/…/how-much-would-falcon-9-have…
I was under the impression that the Falcon Heavy was a ground-up development. But in any case the Falcon 9 was cheaper, so go figure…
Who tf is Erin Roberts?
It was a scam then and it’s still a scam now.
They aren’t listening to their community is what. I play almost daily, and all they fucking talk about is ‘wait for 4.0, it’s going to be so much better!’ But they refuse to fix major problems, performance sucks, and the recent 3.24.2 patch may or may not have borked the game in many ways.
They need to perfect the game that already exists, fix the issues and iron out the code before working on more fucking mechanics. I swear it’s so bad. The article calls Chris a perfectionist, but that couldn’t be furtfrom the truth, he is a dreamer, that says put this amazing thing in then forgets about it and moves on to the next thing overnight. The game will go nowhere until he’s gone.
Edit: fixed a spelling error and added some basic formatting.
Bug fixes don’t bring in new whales with investment money, new silly features does.
The point ceased to be about making the game years ago and became about attracting new money because that’s easy and making good games is hard.
The interesting part is, if they say the game is complete or at least in “1.0” shape, it will suddenly mean that people will judge it as a product and not just a vision. CIG won’t call it finished as long as they possibly can.
The game was supposed to be finished 6 years ago. 12 years in development for what we have now is a joke
pay to win pay to shit your pants pay to get ripped off
Apparently the player base is happy with how things are and the only people complaining are doing from outside
12 years of early access. Thousand dollar DLC spaceships. Remaining players “happy”.
This is as close to a cult as you will find in gaming.