from ampersandrew@lemmy.world to games@lemmy.world on 13 Aug 03:17
https://lemmy.world/post/34364314
I’ll be honest: I think matchmaking is just a better experience for how I like to play FPS games. I never got a sense of “community” from sticking with a given server; I would come to find something like it via Discord years later but not just from frequenting a given game server. My server browser experience was mostly that I’d join a game in a progress, as other people come and go from a game in progress, and I wondered what the point of the match was if the teams weren’t even the same at the end of the match as when they began. Most people’s default when running a server was to turn player numbers to max and, in Battlefield’s case, “tickets” needed to win as well, but just because the numbers are bigger doesn’t mean that it’s better pacing for a match, for instance. Matchmaking sets the defaults and ensures a pretty consistent experience from start to finish of each match.
This comment from the developer is true, too.
“Matchmaking servers spin up in seconds (get filled with players), and spin down after the game is over,” Sirland wrote in a thread on X last week. "That couple of seconds when servers lose a lot of players mid-game is the only time you can join, which makes it a tricky combination (and full of queuing to join issues).
My preference for the matchmaking experience is reflected across the audience they cater to, and it contributed to an industry focus on matchmaking and the end of server browsers.
But we still need real server browsers.
If we bought a game, we should be able to do what we want with it, including running those max player/max ticket servers that run 24/7 on one map. We should be able to do it without DICE/EA’s permission, on our own if we so choose, without salaried staff running master server operations, because one day the revenue this game brings in will not justify the costs to keep it going. We should be able to deal with cheaters by vote kicking them from the server rather than installing increasingly invasive mandatory anti cheat solutions that don’t even fully solve the problem anyway, because it’s unsolvable.
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It would be nice if we had both options. Let people matchmake for the default experience and let those that prefer custom servers to use those instead. There are problems with using only community hosted servers, such as game rules and less ideal admins.
That being said, the longevity that community servers offer is likely the reason they have been scrapped by EA. They want everyone to move to the next title that comes out like what people do with CoD.
EDIT: Typos from mobile
unless they changed it, that’s how csgo works.
God yes. I would rather have a few popular servers over endless empty matchmaking
I miss community servers terribly.
I loved the servers that were 24/7 metro, no drags etc. some of those were (and still are) my favorite. Or pistols only, no Glock 18. When you get rid of custom servers you get rid of that custom experience.
Didn’t they try something similar in 2042 but on their own servers? edit: portal
Yeah, and it’s coming to 6 as well, now with a map editor.
2042 always throws me off. That game was such a disgrace in comparison to 2142 with Titan Wars.
More like a real server browser with real self hosted dedicated servers. Couldn’t imagine mods at this point
They have a browser where you can run your own games. If you use official rules, you get full xp. I don’t get what people are complaining about.
As per the article, persistence, and a way to bypass DICE.
Speaking for myself, I miss multiplayer games before they had XP and progression.
They are persistent, they stay open as long as someone is in it. No one is kicked after the game.
Bypass dice isn’t a feature but a fantasy, never happening. I don’t really get what it would bring to the table either.
The ability to keep the video game. The ability to play it on a LAN. It’s not a fantasy; it’s history. We used to have this.
That’s more then a server browser. You are just being deceptive. You cherry picked the one quote in the article that makes it look like there is nothing in your post and your comments aren’t honest.
What you are talking about is a whole other debate entirely and simply not how the industry runs anymore when it comes to multiplayer shooters.
I want that stuff too but that’s not what server browser means. The finals and cod don’t have server browsers. Bf6 will have a server browser.
The ideas are bound together. Same with anti cheat. Same with preservation. Removing private servers caused all of these problems at the same time. The author of the article speaks for the group who want the community that I admitted never mattered to me, that Portal doesn’t provide, but other knock-on effects of the death of the server browser do matter to me.
There is a server browser. There are no servers hosted on private machines. I would like fully private servers too but there is still a server browser regardless.
You are conflating two different things.
Hence the article expressing the desire for a real server browser, as it seems like a lot of people aren’t served by the replacement they whipped up.
They have explained what they are complaining about several times now, so get off your pedantic horse and either join the conversation that is happening or fuck off.
It bothers me because 90% of the people in the conversation think there will be only matchmaking and nothing else because of how OP framed it.
You want to talk about how you can’t have your own private server completely disconnected for EA, fine. But that doesn’t mean the game has no browser, jfc.
No, you seem to be the only one confused here. They said a REAL browser, not just a list of servers.
Does that sound like OP was whining about simply not having a list of servers? Improve your reading comprehension before you whine about how something was stated.
You can do this because the game let’s you host a server (your rules or official ones) and includes a server browser so random people can find it and join your game.
You can’t do this because although there is a server browser, you can’t run private servers disconnected from eas infrastructure.
I am correcting OP because most of what he said in his post and what people are repeating in the comments implies that there is only matchmaking and implies that the first part isn’t possible.
What isn’t real about the browser we are getting?
Or, hear me out, people are whining about their own experiences, complaining in general about how they hate matchmaking only games. Several people even specifically mention other games before they go on to complain.
This is mostly basic commiserating that you seem to be mistaking for misunderstanding.
IMO it’s the opposite, what exists now is less than a server browser. I’d call it a custom games browser instead. Whichever one you pick will be on the official servers.
I agree it isn’t how the industry is now, but it isn’t going to improve if everyone just accepts it.
Yep. This is the correct answer but that’s not what this thread is about; it’s a nostalgic circle jerk mixed with a sprinkling of “back in my day”.
Don’t get me wrong here, I like the suggestions in this thread but literally one of the suggestions being upvoted is how the game is planned to handle servers (quick join is random and then there will be a list of community servers).
I’m fine with the official servers being random join, as long as I can pick and choose a community server. Which to state again, is apparently planned.
I’m still waiting for reviews on release to make sure they hold true to their marketing though. Can’t trust shit from large studios.
Bit it doesn’t even work on linux, basically DOA for me.
supposedly doesn’t work on windows either if you play valorant or maybe other games with similar anticheats competing for the same system area no video game shoud have control over
ah so that post I saw the other day saying “begun the kernel wars have” makes senses. someone posted the fact they couldn’t play BF6 cause Valorant was installed.
yeah. I’ve been wondering when this would happen since spore. Took longer than I expected really.
I want servers so I can avoid playing maps I don’t like… Looking at you Siege of Cairo.
Server browsers are the better experience for me. Jump in a game and its already going, less pressure to stay because there’s no matchmaking ban/penalties. Everyone is there primarily to have fun because KD WL MMR ELO isnt being logged. If im desperately outclassed, or life gets in the way, I can just quit with no guilt or punishment. If im having a good time i can stay with mostly the same people for a long time.
Thats before you even get into the technicalities and longevity considerations.
Plus it’s great if the server is made specifically for a map you really love. Like TFC/TF2 with say 24/7 2fort. I love me some 2fort and yeah I will play it for hours on end, it’s comfy.
A server browser similar to Arma would have been a godsend as it allows people to set up unique rules, experiment with different game modes and play around the map itself. While BF isn’t a milsim sandbox game a server browser is what keeps older BF games alive especially on console and the removal of that does make you wonder if we’ll be playing BF6 a decade down the line.
They are implementing just that. Official servers don’t show up on it but everything hosted by the community does.
Based on the article, a server is probably a docker container or something like it they spin up and replace each new match. Sounds to me like they deliberately designed around a system that makes a server browser impossible.
The way I interpreted that part was that they were trying to smooth over the frustrating part of finding a server, because at large scale, you end up in a spot where it’s difficult to actually secure a slot on one. That might be their reasoning, but it’s still an excuse to omit a key feature.
Docker doesnt affect that. I ran a Palworld server in Docker for several months, it’s just a different, and better, way to package the software
Bring back community servers, so the developers can keep their official servers and people that want to play on community servers can do that do.
It’s a solved problem that publishers tells you is hard to do in the name of money.
Don’t look harder into it.
That’s exactly what they did. You have official matchmaking, then you have community servers people host. If you use official rules, you can still earn xp in the community servers.
They have a server browser, official matchmaking servers just don’t show up but they only last one game anyways.
Article about BF6: shows picture of BF2042.
Because it talks about the same “Portal” feature in 2042 that came before.
One doesn't need to replace the other.:)
The big problem with matchmaking is that in the long run, it kills game. When people start to move on to a new thing, the population that stays because they're attached to the game gets fucked over by matchmaking.
The less people they are, the worse it works. That's when a server browser and the ability to run community server becomes crucial. It will keep a game alive for a decade after its last update.
How would a server browser help in that case?
Matchmaking puts people into a limited number of servers. Yeah, you get the problem of realizing that those folk have been playing Tribes 2 for over twenty years at this point but you also have people to play with on that one 24 player server. Versus twelve servers with 2 players and a bunch of bots (if the game has them) each.
I always would rather both options. But from a game health standpoint… hoppers tend to have clear advantages at most player counts.
I think the general idea is that if I want to spin up a server for my friend group that’s been gaming together for 20 years, we can buy the game and do just that. That’s opposed to the money I spent on the game being useless when they decide they want to stop paying for servers.
That’s perfectly acceptable justification to shut down gameservers and profit from people moving to the next version of the game. Gone are the days of private servers, especially with client and serverside mods, that kept people engaged with an older game for years. That’s not profitable.
They will have community servers with its own browser. The servers will have full xp as long as the rules are close to the official ones.
Matchmaking wont be the only option.
Source?
From the article.
The community “servers” aren’t persistent though. They’ll only stay online as long as someone is online and using that instance. If that last person leaves the server shuts down - as far as we know, it still seems a like murky, but without being able to rent servers I can’t imagine them just leaving all of them online for free
So in 2042, if you had the premium battle pass, you could set up one persistent server. It was hosted by them but didn’t disappear without players. I don’t know how it will work for bf6.
I think the most important feature is that we have persistent lobbies that don’t disband after a game like matchmaking. That they “stay online” while nobody uses it is really not the important part imo.
Having long played some old CS, there was so much sense of community from connecting to a personal server instance, regularly seeing the same people, familiarize with specific rules to that server, getting to know the admin etc. I’m sure you feel a sense of community from match making, but it can definitely exist outside of matchmaking IMO.
And I’m not advertising for one over the other. But I’d be very happy to see the persistence of accessing personal servers for a game.
I always liked going into older BF servers that weren’t so populated just to be able to get a lay of the land without being destroyed in three seconds.
Or to be able to use the vehicles and get used to them without as much threat.
Maybe I just want a mode that lets you free-roam maps…
Sounds like you just like sight-seeing tbh.
I do! I enjoy camera modes in games a lot, too. I like to look at the architecture in games because I think it’s fascinating.
For BF, though, I do think a little playground would be great. Since they have that map builder tool, I may end up just having to make one myself.
Especially for adjusting piloting controls. If you try to do that while playing a normal match you may not ever even get to fly a chopper to see if you made a good change, for example. I played the beta all day on Saturday and didn’t get a chance to fly anything during that time.
BF6 is the only thing keeping me on windows. If they don’t include a server browser I’m not buying it.
Vote with your wallet and don’t buy this. Many years ago we’ve got dedicated servers and free map builders. Nowadays we get matchmaking and 3 maps and additional 3 for 20 bucks.
I played the BETA, its good, I’m buying.
When it comes to video games you will always get outvoted by millions or children who don’t know any better and don’t care.
Oh no, whatever will I do with my time if I can’t play with literal children.
Wolf ET never stopped having a server browser… ;)
Still miss this game
You don’t have to. You can still play it!
I still have it downloaded but its 100% bots every time I try to play.
I know exactly why they didn’t make dedicated servers and why doing so would be a scramble. But we are going to need them regardless
Server browsers and dedicated servers are subjects that make me want to start with the old man “back in myyy day” style comments.
I saw somebody mention CS, which is a good one, but for me the peak was in Quake 2 because of personal circumstances like getting into overclocking and then moving to a university network connection when modems were the norm at home.
Certain servers running certain mods were awesome late-night hangouts. I have a few really fun memories of all of us coordinating to do goofy stuff rather than play whatever the game at hand was. Then somebody new would join the server and start wrecking us until we caught their attention with the text chat and got them involved too, lol.
It’s very simple. If it doesn’t have a Server Browser, has MTX, has Gacha, has Rootkits, is Online Only/No LAN, or is made by any of the AAA studios, I don’t play it.
The amount of time I’ve spent playing online games has fallen off a cliff after forced matchmaking, particularly SBMM. They’ve legitimately ruined my enjoyment of games.
I got into Overwatch for a bit, but the SBMM meant that at lower levels it was basically a coin flip if I would get a team that wanted to play as a team, or a bunch of kill whores who only cared about their K/D ratio. I don’t want to have to drop hundreds of hours int mastering the game just to have actual teamwork.
Oh, I love skill-based matchmaking. Without it, if you’re having a good time, it means your opponent is almost surely having a bad time, rather than keeping the matches close. At low ranks, often times a single piece of knowledge can escalate your play to a higher level, which can make those low ranks feel kind of swing-y, but I don’t know that that’s a problem that can really be solved unless you remove the asymmetry. That said, I no longer wish to substitute matchmaking for the likes of a server browser.
The two are not mutually exclusive.
Arguing against servers because you want match making is like arguing that you hate McDonalds serving Cheeseburgers because you want Chicken nuggets.
They shouldn’t be mutually exclusive, but the companies who want to monetize people perpetually see them as such.