Is linux good for someone tech illererate.
from SnokenKeekaGuard@lemmy.dbzer0.com to linux@lemmy.ml on 10 Dec 2023 14:57
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/10098166
from SnokenKeekaGuard@lemmy.dbzer0.com to linux@lemmy.ml on 10 Dec 2023 14:57
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/10098166
Now i’ve been considering moving to linux. I don’t have much of a history using a computer and find it tougher to use than my phone. But I also really appreciate the foss movement. I’ve currently got an old laptop running windows 11 I think and it would prolly speed up with linux too. But I’m afraid I’d fuck smth up trying to download linux, understand it or while using it. Is it worth switching and how different is it to a windows experience.
threaded - newest
Ok i’m reading up on this sub and not arch seems to be the consensus for a newbie. I want to download smth and just have it there without thinking bout it the way it is with windows. Not a hobby that i spend hours on.
Apparently theres many versions of linux you can get?
Linux Mint is very easy with GUI’s for everything you need and the UI is pretty similar out of the box. Try it out on a live usb before making the switch.
Thanks. Just opened the linuxmint website and it looks promising
Yeah, don’t use Arch if you’re new to Linux and not tech-literate. You seem pretty interested in Linux Mint from other comments here, I’d say give that a go.
Considering the nature of this converstaion, i love your instance name lol
i gotta join in with the other Linux Mint voices here. It’s very user friendly. You just need to know:
Probably the most important thing to ask before you do anything is, do you have someone who can fix the computer if you screw it up? Installing Linux means removing Windows, so if you get half way through and get stuck, you’re going to be left with a computer that doesn’t work. Will you be able to recover it, or have someone who can?
Once you’re on the desktop, most of what you do is going to be very similar to Windows, except most of the programs will have different names. I would imagine that the vast majority of people can use Linux once it’s installed, especially if they’re in your situation, where they’re not used to computers and don’t have any habits from Windows.
Oh my thats an issue. I don’t know anyone who uses linux. In my country everyone just has pirated windows as I do. Thanks for the warning.
Create a linux mint install USB. When you boot from it, you’ll be in a fully functional linux OS, without installing anything. This way you can try it out before making a commitment.
Although a recurring recommendation is to install linux on a second PC to try it for a while.
This sounds good. Thanks
It doesn’t have to be someone who knows Linux, you just need to be able to get back to a working computer. If it means going back to Windows until you know more, that’s fine, just keep learning :)
Are you sure about that? Most countries around the world have a Linux user group of some sort. Find out what your local group is called, get in touch and I’m sure you’ll be able to find someone who’ll be more than happy to help.
fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxUserGroups
If your country isn’t on the above page then Google for
(your country name) “Linux User Group”It can be a great experience. I used to work in a program for teaching informatics to people who didn’t have access to technology, and we used linux. The results were great. Most people who came from a phone-only background would feel more comfortable with gnome as a gui, so I’d recommend a gnome-based distro for you, like ubuntu, pop os or fedora. Don’t think too much about the distr, just pick one and give it a try. And don’t forget to post your experience here later.
Good luck!
Thank you. I’m now worried about what tippon said and am 50-50 on trying it again lol.
But you don’t have to remove windows. You can install linux in another partition and have an option to choose which system you want to boot. If I remember well, the ubuntu installer has an option t do that automatically ( I will check for you later) . You can also install linux to an external usb media for testing and insert it every time you want to give it a try (usually, pressing f12 or other vendor-specific combination at boot time allows you to choose boot media)
Edit: found this nice tutorial with images: tomshardware.com/…/dual-boot-linux-and-windows-11
Oh I really appreciate that thanks.
I think it depends on what you plan to use it for.
If it’s just browsing the web or basic usage (email, watching videos, etc.) it’s perfect for a tech illiterate person. You have distros that just work, like Mint, or Pop!_Os (compared to distros like Debian that can require a bit of tinkering, or Arch/Gentoo where you need to tinker a lot more). I’m not certain but I think these distros work well for gaming as well.
If you have specific needs for software like the Adobe suite, Excel or audio/video software, it’s still possible but definitely less accessible.
As far as the difference between Linux and Windows, I’m not sure you’d notice much if you stay at the surface. The main difference is the fact that you actually own your system and you can literally do what you want with it (even irreversibly break it).
This is pretty much my take. For tech newbies that essentially only need a browser, linux mint is great. On the other extreme, if you want to tinker, get your hands dirty, then you probably already know what distro you want.
It’s toughest for the people in between who need some more advanced os functionality or need programs that aren’t natively supported, but otherwise don’t want to know more about their os than they have to. Not because Linux doesn’t have that advanced functionality (and more!) or because there aren’t alternatives and workarounds for those programs, but because of the learning curve.
For someone already tech illiterate, the learning curve is almost a moot point. For the tinkerer, it’s practically a feature. But for the people in between, it can a real obstacle.
You shouşd definetly give mint a try it is one of the most just works distros. great for beginners, maybe test the software you want to use on the live environment before installing, if all goes well than give it a spin.
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Thanks I appreciate the detailed response. Luckily I dont game. I’ll be honest I was hoping/ expecting it to suddenly be twice as fast and that was a major factor in considering linux. But if it decreases overheating I’m still happy with that.
I have been degoogling and going the foss roite on my phone to the point of considering graphene os for my phone too so won’t be going the google route thats for sure.
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Even if you wanted to game casually, getting Steam and games running is straightforward these days. You just need to enable Steam Play for all titles in settings.
This is an excellent reply
Your biggest tech challenge will likely be in installing linux. So take your time and work through a tutorial.
Linux is a fundamentally different OS from Windows. Some desktop environments resemble various Windows versions, while others are very different: they might be more Mac like, or more mobile like, or completely unfamiliar.
Installing programs is generally easier on linux because the default is to use the package manager (basically an app store) rather than downloading sketchy programs off websites that all want to update on their own schedule and all want to start when you boot the OS. Just search them, set updates to pop up weekly or whatever your preferred schedule is, and your package manager will do the rest.
Troubleshooting is harder for new users but easier for experienced users: it typically requires more work that can be daunting for casual users, but it lets you get much deeper into the OS to fix problems, where on Windows you might just be stuck waiting for a patch.
Compatibility is usually the biggest frustration, since many programs do not release a linux version, so you need to find alternatives or run them in a compatibility layer. Both of these solutions can sometimes cause problems getting the exact functionality you need, whereas if you’re using the natively supporting OS it may be smoother.
I’d say so, too. I’ve seen at least 3 tech illiterate people (who gave it a chance) be really happy with Linux. You will probably face some annoyance at some point, as it is with everything. But I think Linux is a good choice. Get help installing it if you know someone who can. It’s not that difficult but that would speed up the process. The most important thing is to save your data so you don’t accidentally overwrite it.
Linux has come a long way and is very user friendly now that even non-techie people can hit the ground running when using it. Similar to what the other comment mentioned, installing it is like 80% of the hard part. Just pick a distro that is recommended for beginners (i.e. Mint), and read up on a guide for creating a bootable usb installer. Distros like Mint make it very easy to install, you just need to know how to boot it from a usb drive.
Linux and Windows are very similar, but they have some very important differences. My recommendation to you would be to install a VM and try to use Linux, if your computer can’t handle a VM or you want a closer experience at running Linux, you can create a Live USB with a program called Rufus, it should even allow you to set some permanence so you don’t have to redo everything every time you boot it. Running Linux from the USB will let you use the system without altering anything, and you’ll have an install button that will have a graphical interface to install Linux on your system should you want to.
Yes you’ll fuck things up. Don’t keep anything remotely important on it and screw around with it. That’s how you learn. Blow your install away intentionally, try a different distribution the next time. There’s a lot more variability between distros, and more customizability compared to Windows too.
If you want to learn something new and different anyway. It’s definitely not like Windows except at the most surface level; you can get by in the GUI for almost everything until something goes wrong, but that’s exactly when you want to have been learning cmdline stuff, so you can try to salvage it.
This is an interesting question.
My daughters have grown up with Ubuntu as their main typing and work computer, with windows being what they game on. They are just as able to use one as the other. They don’t break stuff in Ubuntu, and I find myself troubleshooting their windows game pc more than their Ubuntu installs. They don’t touch the command line in either OS.
I use Debian as my main ride, and don’t do any troubleshooting with that either, unless I’m just tinkering around and even then it’s not like I’m borking the whole OS.
I think most Debian distributions could be installed and used with no issue, and unless you are gaming or doing 3D modeling or CAD, could be daily driven. I don’t believe you need any more ability to use Linux than you do windows. I believe you have just as much chance blowing your windows OS away as you do any Linux distribution. Just practice 3-2-1 backups, which you should do with any OS, and take it one step at a time.
Assuming your laptop has hardware that has Linux support—wifi cards manufactured by certain companies are what typically make things difficult—a just works distribution like Ubuntu, Mint, and Pop!_OS will have a gentle learning curve for doing things that you want.
Mint is almost purpose made for people new to Linux or for people who just want to use their computer. It also has a large and friendly community around it, so there is community support, if you get stuck or confused on something. My parents, who are no tech people, have been happily using Mint for a couple of years now, with far less headache compared to Windows.
As others have said, the installation of whatever distribution you chose will probably be the most intimidating aspect of switching to Linux. It doesn’t require being technically savy, just a willingness to learn and follow the procedures. It will be helpful to have your phone handy when you are doing the installation, so you can look things up incase there is something you don’t understand.
If there is anything on the laptop that is important to you, back it up. The simplest way to install Linux will make whatever on the drive inaccessible. Additionally, find and record your Windows product key, just incase you want tk go back to Windows.
If you’re not doing anything crazy, there’s no reason linux should be any harder to use than Windows.
Once you’re up and running, daily life will be pretty straightforward.
Plenty of great advice in the other posts that I won’t rehash. One thing I didn’t see mentioned is using a live boot to try out linux. You can basically run it off a USB stick before you install it to get a feel for what it’s like. Most “beginner friendly” distros will have tutorials on how to create the live disk. Example for Pop!_OS: support.system76.com/articles/live-disk/
I’m going to reframe the question as “Are computers good for someone tech illiterate?”
I think the answer is “yes, if you have someone that can help you”.
The problem with proprietary systems like Windows or OS X is that that “someone” is a large corporation. And, in fairness, they generally do a good job of looking after tech illiterate people. They ensure that their users don’t have to worry about how to do updates, or figure out what browser they should be using, or what have you.
But (and it’s a big but) they don’t actually care about you. Their interest making sure you have a good experience ends at a dollar sign. If they think what’s best for you is to show you ads and spy on you, that’s what they’ll do. And you’re in a tricky position with them because you kind of have to trust them.
So with Linux you don’t have a corporation looking after you. You do have a community (like this one) to some degree, but there’s a limit to how much we can help you. We’re not there on your computer with you (thankfully, for your privacy’s sake), so to a large degree, you are kind of on your own.
But Linux actually works very well if you have a trusted friend/partner/child/sibling/whoever who can help you out now and then. If you’ve got someone to help you out with it, Linux can actually work very very well for tech illiterate people. The general experience of browsing around, editing documents, editing photos, etc., works very much the same way as it does on Windows or OS X. You will probably be able to do all that without help.
But you might not know which software is best for editing photos. Or you might need help with a specific task (like getting a printer set up) and having someone to fall back on will give you much better experience.
Beautifully said
That depends. You could go the same path ChromeOS & SteamOS does and setup an immutable distribution.
Can you remember a password?
I tried helping someone with their steam deck and they got stuck because they didn’t know what they set their password to.
That aside, start with running Linux on a liveboot USB. It is very easy. See how it is for yourself and decide from there
In fairness, I frequently forgot my steamdeck root password, because the need to use it was so few and far between. If you’re always in game mode, then there’s almost 0 reason that I’d need my password.
I agree, but this was instantly. Like sub-10 minutes. . .
Been there. Frustrating af
Yes just install something that never breaks, has a graphical appstore with the correct sources, and a good GUI.
I would say try Fedora Silverblue from Ublue.it. it updates automatically (at least it should), and all your apps can be installed from your software store.
Based on my own experience as well as taking into account the suggestions of other people, here are the top three Linux distros for beginners:
These are basically just “install-and-go” distros; no need for advanced setup.
+1 for Pop!_OS, it’s not given me any issues at all! Zorin OS, looks really good as well, especially if you want a more Windows (visually) experience
Nowadays there are linux distros that gives the same “double clicks your cares away” experience ala windows – ZorinOS, Linux mint and Garuda linux.
I wouldn’t recommend Garuda to someone that’s completely clueless about tech as KDE is less intuitive than gnome and cinnamon, and because you have to use the command line a tad more than on mint zorin. It is still a good choice for a new user though, just maybe more for someone who is reasonably competent at using a pc
There are several comments ITT that mention the “just works” distros, like Mint or Pop!_OS etc. But make no mistake, these distributions are every bit as powerful as any other distribution. They’re not “dumbed down” versions by any means, it just means that they’ve paid close attention to crafting a polished user experience.
Case in point: I’m a seasoned Linux user and still I prefer Pop!_OS. Some of my even more experienced Linux colleagues use Mint, Fedora, etc. because we’re paid to write code that solves customer problems, not tinker with our operating systems on our workstations. I don’t think I actually know anyone in real life that uses Arch (btw)—is it even a real distro or is it just a meme?—or even Debian (unless it’s for a server and even then we’re more likely to use Alpine and install+configure everything we want and nothing we don’t).
You don’t know me in real life. But I use Arch. It started out as a way to get a more thorough understanding of the bits and pieces that make up Linux. Now that it’s all setup and configured, it all just works, and works the way I made it work. I don’t need to tinker with it much now, unless I want to. It’s probably the only Distro I’ll use from now to the end of time, because I’m quite content with it.
Or you’ve invested so much time setting it up that you don’t dare abandon it (sunk cost).
I jest but there may be a grain of truth to it anyway. We humans tend to get comfortable with what we know and when we spend so much time installing, configuring and tinkering a system that we use daily, we end up knowing it pretty well.
I like to try a new distro on a personal computer every year or so, just to keep my agility of computing systems nimble. But still I usually end up back to Pop!OS and MacOS. Although that practice did pull me away from Fedora to Pop!
Maybe. To be fair, most of what’s important to me to do what I need to do. Like individual applications are available on most other distros, and my dot files, and hence configuration for those applications, is where most of my tinkering time was spent and they are stored in repository. I share this between between my work Mac (macos) my desktop (Arch) and my personal laptop (also Arch). I would be able get going on another Distro pretty quickly if I decided to.
But I really do love Arch. I can get going with Arch on fresh machine quickly too, I now know my way around it, where to look for info, and generally just what to do to achieve what I want to do.
The hardest part will probably be the installation, but if you can follow a youtube guide you’ll be fine. Go for a distro like PopOS or Fedora that have polished out of the box experiences.
Thanks. Also have to say, priapus used to be my account name across all social media for a while lol.
Haha, thats a fun coincidence. At some point Priapus became my go to for accounts I didn’t want connected to my main online name.
Yes. Linux is good enough for everyone, whether they like it or not. :)
I’d say so - since you’re coming in relatively cold you’re probably not so used to Windows that you’d get frustrated with how Linux works compared to it, and if you’re just using it for regular, everyday stuff like web browsing there’s practically no difference.
Not really, to be honest.
I think Linux has come a long, long way. But unfortunately, “tech illiterate” has become much, much more illiterate.
It feels like Linux will forever be stuck in this ‘just behind’ mentality because companies like Apple and even Microsoft can funnel so many resources into making sure their distribution ;) is user-friendly.
That said, I think Microsoft sees the writing on the wall and is ducking out. Apple has no reason to. Their designers, unfortunately, are on point.
Except for most “tech illiterate” people, they just need a browser…
…which works identically in Linux and Windows. With the bonus of not running random exe files.
Uhh, no. Tech illiterate people might spend most of their time in a browser, but it’s not all most of them need.
Thinking otherwise is just being out of touch with reality.
There’s a reason why chromebooks are so popular, and it’s not just the price.
Because they are the Crayola of fuckin computers?
I really don’t think people is reasoning “yes I definitely need a computer that exclusively can browse the web no matter the price” because otherwise, if price is no objection, they would buy an ipad with a keyboard.
This considering that a Chromebook instantly loses the resale value as soon as you pay it and it comes with a time bomb which is known only to hyper technical people. Chromebooks on discount have just 1-2 years of updates left or in some cases they’re already EOL. It’s crime against the environment that a Linux machine with a browser has a EOL date when it could receive browser updates indefinitely without any issue.
Depends on just how illiterate imo.
Here’s a good usecase:
My mum is completely tech illiterate, I have to teach her how to every task individually, and she has to write them down and follow them step my step. Tasks like emailing a document are a challenge. Linux is great for her. She isn’t used to windows anyway, and Linux makes it harder for her to accidentally make damaging changes, collect viruses or experience unexpected ui updates. It has much less maintaince, so it’s a lot less work for me to manage the system.
Here’s a bad usecase:
You are a user who can do the basics of using a website, install new apps, use usb drives etc etc. You are used to windows ui like where to find apps, where the close button is etc. You dont have a tech friend set up your stuff but if something goes wrong you are boned. This isn’t a good use unless you are interesting in becoming more tech literate (its easier to learn, if you can google your problems).
Thanks for the advice
I think it is , you had to learn how to use windows and you can learn how to use a Linux distro, I recommend Ubuntu or fedora with KDE, most of the concepts for your day to day should be similar with small subtle changes.
Your browser will still function the same . you will have a home directory with subdirectories for all your files. Kind of like my computer on windows.
The main thing is to mentally understand that it is not windows , just like iOS is not android.
If you can’t find a replacement or Linux version of a program there is a windows compatibility layer called WINE that can be used but that is a topic for another day.
There are things call live CDs or live USBs that let you try the OS without installing it. It runs off a USB or CD.
There are always people willing to land a hand online if you do have an issue.
If you do end up using it for a long time you will learn more about computers just from your day to day use of Linux as it doesnt hide stuff from you.
Anyway best of luck to you whatever you decide to do.
I think it is , you had to learn how to use windows and you can learn how to use a Linux distro, I recommend Ubuntu or fedora with KDE, most of the concepts for your day to day should be similar with small subtle changes.
Your browser will still function the same . you will have a home directory with subdirectories for all your files. Kind of like my computer on windows.
The main thing is to mentally understand that it is not windows , just like iOS is not android.
If you can’t find a replacement or Linux version of a program there is a windows compatibility layer called WINE that can be used but that is a topic for another day.
There are things call live CDs or live USBs that let you try the OS without installing it. It runs off a USB or CD.
There are always people willing to land a hand online if you do have an issue.
If you do end up using it for a long time you will learn more about computers just from your day to day use of Linux as it doesnt hide stuff from you.
Anyway best of luck to you whatever you decide to do.
Thank you so much everyone. I’m very likely going to try the live usb method with linux mint probably. I really appreciate all the advice.
Smart choice! The option to just try it in a safe way with the live USB is a good way to try it.
Also try out some of the themes in the settings 😉 The amazing wallpapers of Linux Mint are so fancy, so I decided to use it on my work Windows PC, which I am forced to deal with ☺️
Nice choice. Try to stick to the standard repository, kinda like the Play store on android.
I believe Mint tries to have minimal dependence on the command line. But usually it’s easier to help others solve problems with the command line since that is easier to write out than how to click through menus. So don’t let it scare you too much.
The internet is a friendlier place now, at least in the linux help-o-sphere. People don’t let others post destructive “lessons” for people to learn anymore.
Linux is perfect for teaching someone to be tech literate, which should be your ultimate goal.
Just because someone can follow a pictorial cookbook more easily is no reason to not teach them to read. Being tech literate is a little more important than people generally realize, just for having a cursory understanding of how things really work.
I recommend Ubuntu.
It’s development has been focused on teaching and enabling tech literacy across the world since its inception, and is designed to be very user friendly.
For someone as tech illiterate as my mom, I’d advise against trying it. But you are here and my mom would never know that Lemmy is a thing. You also ask about Linux.
I’d guess that you will have great fun using and appreciating what Linux and the foss communities have created.
I put Linux Mint on my wifes, her parents and my parents computers, they all are somewhat to absolutely tech illiterate. I have to remind them to update once in a while and new software gets installed by me. But apart from that, everyone is happy with their rocksolid day to day system. Windows wouldn’t make anything easier, neither for me nor for them.
I really think you would have a great time with either “Linux Mint” because of its rocksolid philosophy of not breaking stuff or shipping “beta software”.
Otherwise a safe option would be a Linux variant with professional support options - just in case you need it. ZorinOS, Tuxedo or Pop_OS! are the most common ones.
Personally i’d take Linux Mint, which in most cases works flawless out of the box. The premium options are nonetheless also great options.
+1 for Linux Mint. It just works unless you try to break it.
I am very curious about the type of person who would rather use a phone than a computer. I am already getting annoyed just typing these two sentences on my phone, because I know hoe much more convenient this would be on my computer.
Swipe typing. Also most people I know are the same
I haven’t seen anyone mentioning this yet, so I will: if you’re looking for the most accessible way to use Linux, nothing beats Endless OS. It’s a Linux distribution that is built specifically with ease of use and offline usage in mind (if you don’t know what a “distribution” is, feel free to ask). It’s pretty different from Windows (the user interface is nothing alike, you should download every program/app from the App Center instead of downloading from your browser), but I think you’d get the gist of it quickly.
Now, whether you would want to change to Linux or not greatly depends on what you use your computer for. If you use your computer mostly for browsing the Internet and making Word documents, then I think you should change. If you play videogames on your computer, but mostly via Steam, then Linux won’t be bad. But if your work depends on something like Adobe Photoshop and you really aren’t available to using any other program, then you would not want tochange to Linux, because Photoshop isn’t compatible with it.
TL;DR: Have a look at Endless OS; and please share what you use your computer for / what devices other than a normal keyboard and mouse you normally connect to your computer, so we can help you determine whether you should just switch to Linux or not.
From what I can gather distributions (distros?) are forks of the original os? Thats an assumption tho.
Don’t use anything special here. I do connect my wireless headphones at most other than mouse and keyboard.
Technically, Linux is just the kernel. What makes a distro different is the software they choose to install and package, and what version: some come with the latest version of kde plasma and busybox, others use versions of GNOME and the GNU core system utilities that are a few years old, etc.
Ooooh ok thanks
Something doesn’t add up, or only 2/3 are true.