This, I think, is the real promise of vibe coding tools—that you can learn how to code without a CS degree.
I learned to code without a CS degree. I used a for Dummies book, W3schools, Stack Overflow and the good guidance of a senior developer. Learning to code was never the issue. And I think poking around in the code, experimenting, stumbling on unrelated but helpful answers, before finding your problem, are all great ways to become experienced that are prevented by the use of a tool like Bolt. If Bolt produces code that confuses experienced developers, how is the vibe coder supposed to learn anything useful from it?
Badabinski@kbin.earth
on 07 Aug 20:43
nextcollapse
I learned to program by shitting out God awful shell scripts that got gently thrashed by senior devs. The only way I've ever learned anything is by having a real-world problem that I can solve. You absolutely do NOT need a CS degree to learn software dev or even some of compsci itself, and I agree that tools like Bolt are going to make shit harder. It's one thing to copy stack overflow code because you have people arguing about it in the comments. You get to hear the pros and cons and it can eventually make sense. It's something entirely different when an LLM shits out code that it can't even accurately describe later.
peoplebeproblems@midwest.social
on 07 Aug 22:31
collapse
Or that it can produce repeatedly. That’s something that bothers me. Slight changes in the prompt and you get a wildly different result. Or, worse, you get the same bad output every time you prompt it.
To be fair, in the quoted passage the author is explicitly not referring to Bolt, but asking for explanations of specific, probably small scope issues from non-agentic AI tools.
Personally even while in school for CS I spent a large number of hours staring at a screen being totally unsure how to proceed to figure out what I didn’t understand, most of it trivial details, or making random edits and hoping it would fix something. I’m sure there are advantages to learning by stumbling around, but I really don’t think it’s the ideal way unless you’re already a very methodically curious person.
The temptation to jump directly to asking the AI to just do everything for you without yourself understanding it is definitely going to be a stumbling block for people learning, and I’m not sure if there’s a good way around that one, but otoh something available 24/7 that can mostly accurately answer beginner questions in context and as you have worded them seems like it would be crazy helpful, so many times I just wasn’t able to progress until I could get some attention from someone.
threaded - newest
This is the endgame, isn’t it? Just a matter of time.
No, nothing would change: those who can’t code will continue to not coding or write some useless gibberish.
AI: for expert novices.
I learned to code without a CS degree. I used a for Dummies book, W3schools, Stack Overflow and the good guidance of a senior developer. Learning to code was never the issue. And I think poking around in the code, experimenting, stumbling on unrelated but helpful answers, before finding your problem, are all great ways to become experienced that are prevented by the use of a tool like Bolt. If Bolt produces code that confuses experienced developers, how is the vibe coder supposed to learn anything useful from it?
I learned to program by shitting out God awful shell scripts that got gently thrashed by senior devs. The only way I've ever learned anything is by having a real-world problem that I can solve. You absolutely do NOT need a CS degree to learn software dev or even some of compsci itself, and I agree that tools like Bolt are going to make shit harder. It's one thing to copy stack overflow code because you have people arguing about it in the comments. You get to hear the pros and cons and it can eventually make sense. It's something entirely different when an LLM shits out code that it can't even accurately describe later.
Or that it can produce repeatedly. That’s something that bothers me. Slight changes in the prompt and you get a wildly different result. Or, worse, you get the same bad output every time you prompt it.
And then there are the security flaws
To be fair, in the quoted passage the author is explicitly not referring to Bolt, but asking for explanations of specific, probably small scope issues from non-agentic AI tools.
Personally even while in school for CS I spent a large number of hours staring at a screen being totally unsure how to proceed to figure out what I didn’t understand, most of it trivial details, or making random edits and hoping it would fix something. I’m sure there are advantages to learning by stumbling around, but I really don’t think it’s the ideal way unless you’re already a very methodically curious person.
The temptation to jump directly to asking the AI to just do everything for you without yourself understanding it is definitely going to be a stumbling block for people learning, and I’m not sure if there’s a good way around that one, but otoh something available 24/7 that can mostly accurately answer beginner questions in context and as you have worded them seems like it would be crazy helpful, so many times I just wasn’t able to progress until I could get some attention from someone.