LibertyLizard@slrpnk.net
on 02 Oct 16:57
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Curious how much hate I’ll get for saying this but I unironically think we should stop attacking pedophiles. They’re a tiny problem, already widely hated and illegal so there’s no need to express any additional feelings about them. And the intense anger and hatred cultivated around them is mainly just a weapon powerful people use to manipulate us.
fossilesque@mander.xyz
on 02 Oct 17:12
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Epstein.
LibertyLizard@slrpnk.net
on 02 Oct 17:36
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I had a feeling people would bring this up. But was the problem with Epstein that people feel too warmly towards pedophiles? Or is it that we let the rich and powerful get away with almost anything?
If Epstein was just some random pauper victimizing people he would have gone to jail much sooner.
And, Epstein is actually being used as a political tool right now. I think that use happens to be appropriate in this specific case but the broader pattern is not as benign.
Electricd@lemmybefree.net
on 03 Oct 20:40
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I don’t disagree, except in the Epstein case the problem is not (only) that there are a bunch of pedophiles. I would say that the problem is that there is a broad, rich, influential network of pedophiles, that could be easily dismantled if the Epstein files were properly investigated. The magnitude of the event makes it all the more revolting.
LibertyLizard@slrpnk.net
on 02 Oct 17:37
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That’s my point though, we need to attack the real enemy which is the rich and powerful.
StrongHorseWeakNeigh@piefed.social
on 03 Oct 01:46
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Another part of the problem is when people say, “Kill all pedophiles” and people agree or at least don’t strongly disagree. Then, some of those people who say, “kill all pedophiles” also turn around and say that trans people are groomers and pedophiles.
Popular culture tends to equate the terms “pedophile” and “child molester”, even though most pedophiles never sexually abuse any children, and not all child molesters are driven by pedophilia.
By spreading the hate for all pedophiles, not only do we spread hate for people that never chose to be like that, we also contribute to their social isolation and inability to gain professional help, while at the same time reinforcing the “pedophile = predator” pattern.
Therapy for pedophilia is available, and it works. We need nonjudgmental ways to direct such people to get help, not panic and outcry.
JohnAnthony@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 03 Oct 13:30
nextcollapse
That is well said and something I often struggle to express without sounding super creepy. If someone is attracted to kids, but would never touch one because they know it would be profoundly wrong, I believe they should be congratulated and directed to therapy. Prison, a public lynching or self loathing and isolation are not going to help.
Which doesn’t have much in common with pedo island, obviously.
When I studied with a researcher on this, I learned it even stronger than “not all”: Most perpetrators of child sexual abuse are specifically not pedophiles. By focusing on pedophilia (and there focusing on expressing anger rather than effective preventative measures, which feature support rather than trying to feel morally superior), resources are not only overallocated in one place but underallocated in another, thus making the problem worse
Manipulated? So you think it’s ok to see children as sexual objects?
Edit: It was a joke above but If you are not a pedophile please elaborate. I can not see how to excuse thia behavior, but maybe you have a better take. I am open to you opinion
FiskFisk33@startrek.website
on 05 Oct 09:21
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no one said anything at all about excusing the behaviour, the argument I see is that an excessive amount of mind space and resources is spent combating it.
I don’t think you intentionally created a straw man, but a straw man you did create.
My hot take on this is based on an assumption. Last I checked we can predict sexual preferences with a high degree of certainty based on genetics. (Stick with me here this is NOT a eugenics argument) It seems pretty reasonable that preventative therapy and manditory check-ins would go a long way to preventing the issue than any sort of retroactive punishment
Ofc it would need to be handled with a lot of disgression since there’s no reason to destroy someone’s social life based on genetics alone
ryedaft@sh.itjust.works
on 02 Oct 20:47
nextcollapse
No. You can’t.
Edit: “last you checked” was that asking ChatGPT or some other nonsense?
Unfortunately, no, we can’t. Pedophilia appears fairly randomly, and there are many factors of risk, of which genetics has not been indicated.
The good news is, pedophile does not equal child molester! Most pedophiles never abuse children, and by expanding anonymous therapy options, we can ensure even less of them cross the line.
Ah yeah that was more the heart of what I was getting at anyway. The current system of punishment doesn’t really solve anything. Just gives angry people some sense of animalistic satisfaction
TL;DR The most prominent correlation is between pedophilia and CSA victimhood. Survivors are more likely to develop pedophilic tendencies themselves, though most still don’t.
Electricd@lemmybefree.net
on 03 Oct 20:43
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And by continuing the hate on pedophiles instead of pedocriminals, they feel bad and hide themselves, can’t talk about it, and can’t get helped if they require some
People have all switched to use correct words not to discriminate people, why not the same for people who suffer from this?
threaded - newest
Curious how much hate I’ll get for saying this but I unironically think we should stop attacking pedophiles. They’re a tiny problem, already widely hated and illegal so there’s no need to express any additional feelings about them. And the intense anger and hatred cultivated around them is mainly just a weapon powerful people use to manipulate us.
Epstein.
I had a feeling people would bring this up. But was the problem with Epstein that people feel too warmly towards pedophiles? Or is it that we let the rich and powerful get away with almost anything?
If Epstein was just some random pauper victimizing people he would have gone to jail much sooner.
And, Epstein is actually being used as a political tool right now. I think that use happens to be appropriate in this specific case but the broader pattern is not as benign.
USA government: Who?
I don’t disagree, except in the Epstein case the problem is not (only) that there are a bunch of pedophiles. I would say that the problem is that there is a broad, rich, influential network of pedophiles, that could be easily dismantled if the Epstein files were properly investigated. The magnitude of the event makes it all the more revolting.
That’s my point though, we need to attack the real enemy which is the rich and powerful.
Insert same image meme here.
Another part of the problem is when people say, “Kill all pedophiles” and people agree or at least don’t strongly disagree. Then, some of those people who say, “kill all pedophiles” also turn around and say that trans people are groomers and pedophiles.
There’s actually more to it!
Popular culture tends to equate the terms “pedophile” and “child molester”, even though most pedophiles never sexually abuse any children, and not all child molesters are driven by pedophilia.
By spreading the hate for all pedophiles, not only do we spread hate for people that never chose to be like that, we also contribute to their social isolation and inability to gain professional help, while at the same time reinforcing the “pedophile = predator” pattern.
Therapy for pedophilia is available, and it works. We need nonjudgmental ways to direct such people to get help, not panic and outcry.
That is well said and something I often struggle to express without sounding super creepy. If someone is attracted to kids, but would never touch one because they know it would be profoundly wrong, I believe they should be congratulated and directed to therapy. Prison, a public lynching or self loathing and isolation are not going to help.
Which doesn’t have much in common with pedo island, obviously.
Absolutely. Bring justice to chomos!
When I studied with a researcher on this, I learned it even stronger than “not all”: Most perpetrators of child sexual abuse are specifically not pedophiles. By focusing on pedophilia (and there focusing on expressing anger rather than effective preventative measures, which feature support rather than trying to feel morally superior), resources are not only overallocated in one place but underallocated in another, thus making the problem worse
Heard of that claim before, but didn’t find studies to back it up, so didn’t include it here. Won’t be surprised if it is true, though
Pedophile is fine, pedocriminal is not
In Europe they have become the goto excuse to cut away internet privacy and freedom.
Found the pedophile
I expected this and I am willing to accept the abuse to make what I feel is an important point about how we’re being manipulated.
Frankly, I am shocked only one person has chimed in with this type of comment so far.
Manipulated? So you think it’s ok to see children as sexual objects?
Edit: It was a joke above but If you are not a pedophile please elaborate. I can not see how to excuse thia behavior, but maybe you have a better take. I am open to you opinion
no one said anything at all about excusing the behaviour, the argument I see is that an excessive amount of mind space and resources is spent combating it.
I don’t think you intentionally created a straw man, but a straw man you did create.
My hot take on this is based on an assumption. Last I checked we can predict sexual preferences with a high degree of certainty based on genetics. (Stick with me here this is NOT a eugenics argument) It seems pretty reasonable that preventative therapy and manditory check-ins would go a long way to preventing the issue than any sort of retroactive punishment
Ofc it would need to be handled with a lot of disgression since there’s no reason to destroy someone’s social life based on genetics alone
No. You can’t.
Edit: “last you checked” was that asking ChatGPT or some other nonsense?
Unfortunately, no, we can’t. Pedophilia appears fairly randomly, and there are many factors of risk, of which genetics has not been indicated.
The good news is, pedophile does not equal child molester! Most pedophiles never abuse children, and by expanding anonymous therapy options, we can ensure even less of them cross the line.
Ah yeah that was more the heart of what I was getting at anyway. The current system of punishment doesn’t really solve anything. Just gives angry people some sense of animalistic satisfaction
Sounds like I gotta catch-up on the research tho
TL;DR The most prominent correlation is between pedophilia and CSA victimhood. Survivors are more likely to develop pedophilic tendencies themselves, though most still don’t.
And by continuing the hate on pedophiles instead of pedocriminals, they feel bad and hide themselves, can’t talk about it, and can’t get helped if they require some
People have all switched to use correct words not to discriminate people, why not the same for people who suffer from this?
You’ll be surprised how many people here on Lemmy will defend the pedos in charge.
It’s not wrong to like kids. You can’t control what you like. It’s wrong to act.
Not supporting someone because they’re a pedophile is bad. Not supporting someone because they’re a pedocriminal is good