Before somebody says that we don't deserve dogs, please just don't.
We do deserve them. We basically made them and they love us and we love them.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 02:44
nextcollapse
I’d even argue that, despite not being accurate, human-dog existence is symbiotic. We’re better with each other than the sum of us as individuals. Yeah, not every dog is good with humans, and some humans shouldn’t be allowed near any animal, but on average, a human and a dog together is the most perfect pairing of two different species on the planet.
MalReynolds@slrpnk.net
on 08 Dec 2024 02:51
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Very much agree, evolution or no. Sometimes it’s just right.
ryedaft@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 12:46
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That’s not because of a chill and nice process though. It’s because our ancestors would put down any domestic animal that was unhelpful or annoying. Cats bringing us offerings of mice and other small animals is not because they are homicidal maniacs but because at one point a cat started doing that and the cats that didn’t were killed.
nomous@lemmy.world
on 08 Dec 2024 16:15
nextcollapse
That’s not at all how natural selection works. Successful traits are passed on and unsuccessful ones aren’t. In the case of dogs, the canids able to tolerate being around prehistoric people were able to eat the scraps and early man found the canid provided protection and warning of other predators, it was very much a symbiotic relationship.
Feline and man for all intents and purposes just kind of agreed to exist together. As we developed agriculture and formed permanent settlements the grain attracted rodents which in turn attracted cats. The cats provided free pest control and companionship and are self-cleaning so were essentially given free reign, that relationship remains relatively unchanged.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 16:55
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I have no clue where you’re pulling that from, but it absolutely does not match archaeological evidence, historical evidence, or existing practices of folkways.
That’s not how selective breeding has worked for ages.
The only time culling has been used is in food animals, which is a different thing entirely.
And that cat thing? That’s bullshit entirely. There are enormously absolutely zero records of that, so unless you have actual first hand evidence you can share, you’re pulling that one out of your ass entirely, or whoever told you that was
ryedaft@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 18:16
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People are still throwing bags of kittens in rivers and leaving boxes of puppies to die on the side of the road. Why do you need archaeological evidence for something that is still happening? Cats and dogs breed a lot and they have large litters. Just because you would never hurt an animal doesn’t mean that people wanted to live with that many animals in the past.
And yes, that is exactly how natural selection works. It’s death and replication.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 19:18
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Dude, GTFO with that shit.
Also, if another species is specifically culling the other species, that’s called selective breeding, not natural selection, you fucking pointy headed, ignorant cretin.
And you need archaeological evidence because you fucking claimed that’s how dogs and cats got domesticated. You made the fucking claim, and it is wrong.
Now, does animal abuse exist? absofuckinglutely
But that’s not what the fucking topic of conversation was. You, you festering pimple of a human being decided to spew the pus of your ignorance into what was a nice, friendly discussion about dogs and humans. You did so by making outright false claims and going on a tangent that’s unrelated.
Your inability to comprehend what’s being discussed, and then doubling down on something you could have looked up, like the definitions of natural selection and selective breeding shows exactly what kind of moron you are.
So, go look up those definitions. Go, look them up. But don’t waste your damn time or mine coming back to triple down by having looked it up, been shown you were wrong, but being too much of a jackass to back down and say “oh, gee, I learned something today in a science meme community”.
This, the kind of shit you’re trying to pull is what sucks about the internet. Jesus fucking christ, it’s SCIENCE MEMES and you’re coming in spouting off complete off topic bullshit, and you’re somehow surprised people are repeatedly correcting you, and you can’t be bothered to verify the fucking definitions?
GTFO with your bullshit.
AllHailTheSheep@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 05:35
nextcollapse
depends on the person. my neighbors, who never walk their dog, barely feed it, and just let it out in the back yard for 3 hours a day (hoarders backyard in the city where all it can do is stand in the 2x2 corner where it uses the bathroom and bark, asking them to play with it) do not deserve a dog. for any responsible owner though, I agree
Mostly rhetorically, and without an ability to adopt this dog myself, what would vigilante justice look like in this situation?
AllHailTheSheep@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 09:27
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you can try to report it to a local animal cruelty prevention group however a lot of time what they can do is very limited
ryedaft@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 12:03
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It doesn’t have to be vigilante justice. In a number of countries animal cruelty is illegal. The simple fact that the animal is malnourished would be enough to involve the police.
But I don’t know what country any of you live in.
100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it
on 08 Dec 2024 13:56
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Dogs show us how good we can be
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social
on 08 Dec 2024 17:21
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Do you know what a child’s face looks like after their family Golden rips it off?
Because I do.
So, yeah, your statement still works, I guess.
100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it
on 08 Dec 2024 19:26
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And how does this disprove the millennia of evidence in favour of dogs as a positive influence on people?
I’m sorry about those kids.
I really.
Yet, I still think that my dog makes my life better in ways that I hadn’t even dreamed of before adopting her.
Of note, it’s unclear whether the dog died a natural death, or whether it was killed to be buried with its human. An analysis of its remains may reveal this mystery.
I couldn’t find an answer though. Most online sources of the discovery are from back in 2020, then it’s just memes.
prex@aussie.zone
on 08 Dec 2024 05:13
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Edit: still very cool & I’m sure they loved that dog like I do mine.
OprahsedCreature@lemmy.ml
on 08 Dec 2024 05:50
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Well now I’m curious as to how they date oral histories
MartianSands@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Dec 2024 08:07
nextcollapse
Stories about events we can identify in the archeological record, probably. Forest fires, major battles, geological events, things like that which can be used to line the stories up with specific real-world events
Siegfried@lemmy.world
on 08 Dec 2024 12:30
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Those dudes survived a volcanic eruption that wiped out half of humanity. I guess they still remember it?
Siegfried@lemmy.world
on 08 Dec 2024 15:35
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I strongly believe that it happened. It doesn’t need to be a “flood of biblical dimensions” but just one terrible enough to convince a few early tribes that it was the end of the world as we know it.
That’s mankind lore
nomous@lemmy.world
on 08 Dec 2024 16:19
nextcollapse
I feel like the myth existing in cultures around the world from Mesopotamia to the Americas gives it credence. It makes sense that a “world-changing event” would work its way into various disparate cultures myths.
Absolutely, water being such a vital part of life pretty much ensures it’ll be referenced. Kind of the same thing as various sun gods in cultures around the world.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de
on 29 Dec 15:22
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what makes most sense to me, at least to explain stories in europe, is simply when doggerland got covered by the ocean. That’s a fucking big landmass that would have been prime real estate, no shit it being lost to water would be something people make stories about. And back then people didn’t live their entire lives in one village, they migrated all the time and people would hop between tribes and shit, lots of people would have personally seen that it was now underwater and spread that knowledge around.
blazeknave@lemmy.world
on 08 Dec 2024 18:46
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First half really had me expecting you asking about blow jobs
exasperation@lemm.ee
on 08 Dec 2024 20:18
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I once dated someone with an extensive oral history.
LogicalDrivel@sopuli.xyz
on 08 Dec 2024 05:57
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Id love to see a recreation of the dog. Its hard to get a sense of scale but the head looks quite big.
Also:
Along with the dog, a small number of microchips were found which can be interpreted as grave gifts.
Microchips? Is that like chips of flint napping or were the ancient alien dudes on to something?
the original text has it as “mikrospån”, which should be translated as microblade, a 3-5cm flint blade used to make microliths.
LogicalDrivel@sopuli.xyz
on 08 Dec 2024 14:54
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Ah thanks, i kind of forgot Firefox translated it for me. That makes much mores sense.
xx3rawr@sh.itjust.works
on 09 Dec 2024 04:49
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Bro how else would anthropoligists know the dog had an owner. Duh
witty_username@feddit.nl
on 08 Dec 2024 06:14
nextcollapse
A family?
MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml
on 08 Dec 2024 11:22
nextcollapse
Edit: wrote bullshit, but the link is still interesting.
fossilesque@mander.xyz
on 08 Dec 2024 11:31
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History as an academic term usually goes hand in hand with writing, not civilization. When I write, I refer to earlier periods as “prehistoric.” This is because historians primarily use written text and similar as their subject of study.
RedCarCastle@aussie.zone
on 08 Dec 2024 11:25
nextcollapse
threaded - newest
Science is not supposed to make me cry, dammit!
Before somebody says that we don't deserve dogs, please just don't.
We do deserve them. We basically made them and they love us and we love them.
I’d even argue that, despite not being accurate, human-dog existence is symbiotic. We’re better with each other than the sum of us as individuals. Yeah, not every dog is good with humans, and some humans shouldn’t be allowed near any animal, but on average, a human and a dog together is the most perfect pairing of two different species on the planet.
Very much agree, evolution or no. Sometimes it’s just right.
Agreed completely.
That’s not because of a chill and nice process though. It’s because our ancestors would put down any domestic animal that was unhelpful or annoying. Cats bringing us offerings of mice and other small animals is not because they are homicidal maniacs but because at one point a cat started doing that and the cats that didn’t were killed.
That’s not at all how natural selection works. Successful traits are passed on and unsuccessful ones aren’t. In the case of dogs, the canids able to tolerate being around prehistoric people were able to eat the scraps and early man found the canid provided protection and warning of other predators, it was very much a symbiotic relationship.
Feline and man for all intents and purposes just kind of agreed to exist together. As we developed agriculture and formed permanent settlements the grain attracted rodents which in turn attracted cats. The cats provided free pest control and companionship and are self-cleaning so were essentially given free reign, that relationship remains relatively unchanged.
I have no clue where you’re pulling that from, but it absolutely does not match archaeological evidence, historical evidence, or existing practices of folkways.
That’s not how selective breeding has worked for ages.
The only time culling has been used is in food animals, which is a different thing entirely.
And that cat thing? That’s bullshit entirely. There are enormously absolutely zero records of that, so unless you have actual first hand evidence you can share, you’re pulling that one out of your ass entirely, or whoever told you that was
People are still throwing bags of kittens in rivers and leaving boxes of puppies to die on the side of the road. Why do you need archaeological evidence for something that is still happening? Cats and dogs breed a lot and they have large litters. Just because you would never hurt an animal doesn’t mean that people wanted to live with that many animals in the past.
And yes, that is exactly how natural selection works. It’s death and replication.
Dude, GTFO with that shit.
Also, if another species is specifically culling the other species, that’s called selective breeding, not natural selection, you fucking pointy headed, ignorant cretin.
And you need archaeological evidence because you fucking claimed that’s how dogs and cats got domesticated. You made the fucking claim, and it is wrong.
Now, does animal abuse exist? absofuckinglutely
But that’s not what the fucking topic of conversation was. You, you festering pimple of a human being decided to spew the pus of your ignorance into what was a nice, friendly discussion about dogs and humans. You did so by making outright false claims and going on a tangent that’s unrelated.
Your inability to comprehend what’s being discussed, and then doubling down on something you could have looked up, like the definitions of natural selection and selective breeding shows exactly what kind of moron you are.
So, go look up those definitions. Go, look them up. But don’t waste your damn time or mine coming back to triple down by having looked it up, been shown you were wrong, but being too much of a jackass to back down and say “oh, gee, I learned something today in a science meme community”.
This, the kind of shit you’re trying to pull is what sucks about the internet. Jesus fucking christ, it’s SCIENCE MEMES and you’re coming in spouting off complete off topic bullshit, and you’re somehow surprised people are repeatedly correcting you, and you can’t be bothered to verify the fucking definitions?
GTFO with your bullshit.
depends on the person. my neighbors, who never walk their dog, barely feed it, and just let it out in the back yard for 3 hours a day (hoarders backyard in the city where all it can do is stand in the 2x2 corner where it uses the bathroom and bark, asking them to play with it) do not deserve a dog. for any responsible owner though, I agree
Mostly rhetorically, and without an ability to adopt this dog myself, what would vigilante justice look like in this situation?
you can try to report it to a local animal cruelty prevention group however a lot of time what they can do is very limited
It doesn’t have to be vigilante justice. In a number of countries animal cruelty is illegal. The simple fact that the animal is malnourished would be enough to involve the police. But I don’t know what country any of you live in.
Dogs show us how good we can be
Do you know what a child’s face looks like after their family Golden rips it off?
Because I do.
So, yeah, your statement still works, I guess.
And how does this disprove the millennia of evidence in favour of dogs as a positive influence on people? I’m sorry about those kids. I really. Yet, I still think that my dog makes my life better in ways that I hadn’t even dreamed of before adopting her.
Are we certain that the dog didn't die so that it could be buried with someone?
We aren’t. I can’t find a source to the dog’s toys but Phys.org does say it was buried with a person.
LiveScience.org mentions the same question back in 2020
I couldn’t find an answer though. Most online sources of the discovery are from back in 2020, then it’s just memes.
Dude, the dog was 8400 years old! 🤡
Aboriginal oral histories date back at least another 2000 years before this.
Edit: still very cool & I’m sure they loved that dog like I do mine.
Well now I’m curious as to how they date oral histories
Stories about events we can identify in the archeological record, probably. Forest fires, major battles, geological events, things like that which can be used to line the stories up with specific real-world events
Those dudes survived a volcanic eruption that wiped out half of humanity. I guess they still remember it?
People are still talking about some flood that probably happened at some point in pre-history.
I strongly believe that it happened. It doesn’t need to be a “flood of biblical dimensions” but just one terrible enough to convince a few early tribes that it was the end of the world as we know it.
That’s mankind lore
I feel like the myth existing in cultures around the world from Mesopotamia to the Americas gives it credence. It makes sense that a “world-changing event” would work its way into various disparate cultures myths.
Or it’s because people all around the world always lived next to water and encountered floods.
Absolutely, water being such a vital part of life pretty much ensures it’ll be referenced. Kind of the same thing as various sun gods in cultures around the world.
what makes most sense to me, at least to explain stories in europe, is simply when doggerland got covered by the ocean. That’s a fucking big landmass that would have been prime real estate, no shit it being lost to water would be something people make stories about. And back then people didn’t live their entire lives in one village, they migrated all the time and people would hop between tribes and shit, lots of people would have personally seen that it was now underwater and spread that knowledge around.
First half really had me expecting you asking about blow jobs
I once dated someone with an extensive oral history.
Id love to see a recreation of the dog. Its hard to get a sense of scale but the head looks quite big. Also:
Microchips? Is that like chips of flint napping or were the ancient alien dudes on to something?
the original text has it as “mikrospån”, which should be translated as microblade, a 3-5cm flint blade used to make microliths.
Ah thanks, i kind of forgot Firefox translated it for me. That makes much mores sense.
Bro how else would anthropoligists know the dog had an owner. Duh
A family?
Edit: wrote bullshit, but the link is still interesting.
History as an academic term usually goes hand in hand with writing, not civilization. When I write, I refer to earlier periods as “prehistoric.” This is because historians primarily use written text and similar as their subject of study.
I’m getting real jurassic bark vibs here
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.ml/api/v3/image_proxy?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Foriginal%2F002%2F307%2F265%2F9a6">
Same as a child for many even into this day
My dogs are my family 100%. I’ll mourn them when they’re gone like I’d mourn any other family member. Except for that one cousin. Fuck that guy.
Yeah I do believe we all have one bad seed to deal with