If I had that happen to me I think it would destroy me. I thought of NASA as the one good thing still in the government. The fact that they are just letting it happen is weirdly depressing. I know I should have expected it but somehow it feels very final.
HauntedCupcake@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 18:01
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For this community yes, but I think the over-dramatising works against the wider acceptance of DEI practices. Most people have never even had an article written about them, those people still have personhood, so does this lady. From that perspective it comes off as entitled and decoupled from reality. Who wants to listen to someone acting unhinged on social media?
Obviously, removing the section is wrong, and we should have these articles to highlight the achievements of women in male dominated fields. Plus highlighting that it’s been removed by the vile actions of the trump administration is important
Haven’t you read her post? Her entire work was erased alongside herself… I’m already miles ahead.
Don’t pretend that a NASA article about you won’t make you feel successful
Reading comprehension -20, but I guess that explains why you’d drink up this drivel
MadhuGururajan@programming.dev
on 15 Feb 11:27
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if you can’t understand why it is important to have NASA of all people mention you by name, you’re naive, ignorant or just a child who thinks it’s cool to diss people for wanting recognition.
Please stop being an edgelord for a moment and think about the humans in the situation.
your holier than thou attitude only reeks of loneliness and ineptitude to put yourself in the shoes of others.
Yes, because it can inspire people. It’s a very inspiring story. People can be motivated to do things with their own lives by listening to it. I’m amazed this has to be explained to you why removing it is a bad thing.
I prefer them in the light of justice rather than scurrying around with the darkness.
jabathekek@sopuli.xyz
on 14 Feb 17:06
nextcollapse
Unless the darkness is a really deep pit in some cave and their legs are broken.
Spacehooks@reddthat.com
on 14 Feb 17:07
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Like Riddler “bring him into the light”?
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de
on 14 Feb 20:38
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Justice in the united states? where? how?
mindbleach@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 06:23
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We tried that.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 17:46
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Nah.
I’d rather they see that we have a common enemy in the fascists and extend a hand of solidarity before I run out of the means to survive in a few weeks.
DEI is bad! Treat everyone based on their merits! Remove the bio pages for anyone not white and male!
... ?
whotookkarl@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 16:53
nextcollapse
Diversity, equity, and inclusion get in the way of their nepotism and cronyism hiring. If they were hiring based on merit alone there would be no problem being transparent and publishing their hiring decisions.
Broadfern@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 16:56
nextcollapse
It’s been said better by other people but the general understanding of the right’s use of “DEI” is as a convenient blanket slur.
It’s typically used against Black and Hispanic people the most, followed by trans people, but any/all women are convenient extra padding under the bus tires of their bigotry and insecurity.
Remember that their fascism is based in feelings of superiority in addition to fear. Use that against the cowardly bastards. They can’t stand to see someone “undeserving” do as well as or better than them, so they try to mow it down.
Fuck ‘em.
EDIT: It seems like Rose Ferreira is of Hispanic descent, hailing initially from the Dominican Republic then moved to NY and eventually secured an internship at NASA, and is now an astronomer and aerospace engineer. It seems like her NASA page got reinstated, maybe after backlash. She’s awesome. Hell yeah for the Streisand effect.
Not necessarily. They might be a misogynist, a militant christian or some other form of bigot as well. That’s the beauty of it, you can be “against DEI” as well as a woman or someone with more melanin than the “default” and you get to imagine they don’t hate you, just all those other people.
Also just fucking stupid ignorant assholes who know absolutely nothing other than the TV and their pastor and their radio tell them everyday that DEI is bad.
just like women can be enforcers of patriarchy, and the poor engines of capitalism
NostraDavid@programming.dev
on 15 Feb 14:09
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Anyone who rails against “DEI” is by definition a white supremacist.
This is such a backwards take. “DEI” could always only end in misery, because it pulls people ahead of the line in a time when the working people are already having a hard time. “Is that person hired because of the colour of their skin or the sex of their body, or have they been hired because they’re actually good?”. It could only make a large part of the population feeling left behind because of their sex or race. What do you think that does to the social foundation of a nation?
Alas, I have no idea what a good alternative would be, but I always recognized “DEI” as a bad idea. I don’t have to be a chef to be able to tell that this dish tastes like ass, even if I can’t cook for shit myself.
That does not make me (or anyone else who thinks DEI is ass) a white supremacist “by definition”.
At the end of the day, it’s the ultrarich hoarding all the money that’s the actual issue - an economy that’s not fair to the citizens of the nation. The top 3 wealthiest persons in the USA have the same amount of money as the bottom 50%.
Careful now thats a nuanced opinion that doesn’t stroke my victim complex or reductively imply anyone who disagrees with me on complex systemic social issues is a nazi supremacist.
Prepare to be downvoted and hit with five paragraph essay replies picking apart everything you just said. You racist, mysoginistic, hateful, privileged, homophobic, transphobic, double checks progressive slurs & insults 101 field guide uhh third Reich bringing supremacist scum.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 17:23
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Everyone seems to forget that DEI as a name for these programs started during the first Trump admin.
DEI has always been a ruse.
They “embraced” these concepts to get all of the existing programs to label themselves as such.
They let Biden “extend” these programs so that anything supporting non-white-males would group together under the same banner.
Now they are “extinguishing” the whole lot of them now that it’s nice and easy and their targets have huddled together and identified themselves.
There was a complex network of programs doing these jobs before DEI existed. DEI was a ruse to centralize them so they could be extinguished.
They built the barrel, then used fascist rhetoric to get all the fish to group together in the barrel. Now they’re shooting the fish in the barrel.
I’d love to believe it.
I can’t find anything backing this up.
The has become a wall of text. Sorry.
1st half of this post is refuting “trump defined DEI”. I would live to be proved wrong on this, but it seems like something that happened during trump and was defined by Biden.
2nd half is more positive.
I don’t know when DEI actually became the official term. Probably during the Biden administration .
According to wiki, however, DEI has been around since the 60s, in principle.
Basically, government bodies using their autonomy to enact DEI policies in response to #MeToo, #BlackLivesMatter, George Floyd, and lots of other public sentiment & unrest. However nothing official at the government level of “DEI”.
Essentially, trump was asleep at the wheel with COVID and civil unrest, did fuck all (or encouraged civil unrest), and government bodies (which still had autonomy) enacted policies inline with the population.
So, what constitutes DEI?
What the right is defining it as? What it has been since the 60s? What Biden enacted? What the government bodies enacted during sleepy trump?
The 2nd half:
Being against DEI is like being against Antifa, or declaring Antifa a terrorist organisation. It’s not really a thing.
DEI is the awareness that previous centuries of discrimination no longer applies.
DEI isn’t a tangible thing. It’s humanity.
It didn’t happen during trump’s first term. But it did progress.
It didn’t happen during Bidens term. But it did progress.
That is humanity. Humanity progresses. Humanity is love, equality and freedom for all.
And a bit more ideologically…
Progress in the next 4 years is gonna be slow.
But everyone has worked on this before. It’s a hiatus. It will come back, and will be easier and more streamlined than before. Loads of people are backing up data, so it can be (relatively) easily restored. None of this has to be worked out again, nothing shared on the internet can truly die, ideas can’t be killed.
It’s gonna be 4 years of shit.
Hopefully Americans learn, and don’t vote in more conservatives.
…
…
Hopefully Americans get a chance to vote in another party.
Edit: typo, equality not equity
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 00:18
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Thank you so much for your work on this.
My post that you are replying to is mostly a tongue-in-cheek commentary on how programs that have existed for decades self-labeled as something that the right was able to rally against, thereby making themselves a single large target instead of a decentralized force distributed across agencies.
I just know that I first started seeing “DEI” as a label pop up in the first Trump admin. Frankly, in 2018, it was called “Climate and Diversity” in my local environment. Shortly thereafter it got relabeled.
DEI has been around since the 60s, in principle.
Yup! Remember how I said that before it was labeled there was a complex network of programs doing this job? DEI is more of a label than a program. I fully agree.
So, what constitutes DEI?
What the right is defining it as? What it has been since the 60s? What Biden enacted? What the government bodies enacted during sleepy trump?
It’s not well defined! It’s a scare word. It’s a label that we lined up behind that unintentionally made it easy for antiracist programs to be identified and targeted.
Being against DEI is like being against Antifa, or declaring Antifa a terrorist organisation. It’s not really a thing.
DEI is the awareness that previous centuries of discrimination no longer applies.
DEI isn’t a tangible thing. It’s humanity.
It didn’t happen during trump’s first term. But it did progress.
It didn’t happen during Bidens term. But it did progress.
That is humanity. Humanity progresses. Humanity is love, equity and freedom for all.
I can’t agree more! The label of DEI just makes these programs easier to find. This us true both for people seeking assistance from these programs and for people seeking to dismantle them. Such identification is a double-edged sword, and that’s what my depressed brain was trying to communicate.
Progress in the next 4 years is gonna be slow.
But everyone has worked on this before. It’s a hiatus. It will come back, and will be easier and more streamlined than before. Loads of people are backing up data, so it can be (relatively) easily restored. None of this has to be worked out again, nothing shared on the internet can truly die, ideas can’t be killed.
It’s gonna be 4 years of shit.
Hopefully Americans learn, and don’t vote in more conservatives.
…
…
Hopefully Americans get a chance to vote in another party.
I love you. Thank you for this message of hope. I’m sorry to qualify it by saying: just because data can be restored, doesn’t mean that people or careers can be.
Nice.
With the tongue in cheek context, I understand your comment more: DEI (as an idea & movement) blossomed under trumps first term, because of the bullshit he caused and the reaction of the public.
The government had actual civil servants (as opposed to appointed oppressors or whatever), and reacted in a sensible way.
But yeh, the damage being done to people is unimaginable. People’s entire careers are being deleted from public records because they are a woman in STEM, or because they are the wrong colour, or because they don’t fit Christians opinion of normal. It’s fucked up
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 01:19
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I don’t have to imagine it. Part of why I’m grumpy and bitching on the internet is that I’ve found myself unemployed with a deleted career and an almost-finished phd. I’m kind of at a loss for what to do or what comes next or how I’ll pay rent in two weeks. I’m scared and I was victim blaming myself. Thanks for helping to contextualize my pain and pull me back to reality. I’m doing a lot better now after talking to people on lemmy than I was last night or even this morning.
towerful@programming.dev
on 15 Feb 03:59
nextcollapse
Yeh, venting on the internet helps. And it’s always great when you actually connect with someone.
I always wish I’d learned a trade. Electrician, plumber or tiler. Get an apprenticeship, learn a trade, be a sole trader, do something physical that’s always in demand.
Plenty out there to do, and it’s ok to mourn your last job (being a student/doctorate is a job).
Connect with old friends and family. Meet some new people. Somebody will be looking for someone smart and compassionate
You mentioned space science, right? I’m an engineer at an aerospace company, feel free to message me if you want to chat about the industry, I’d love to help if I can.
SARGE@startrek.website
on 14 Feb 17:57
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As I keep telling people, they keep saying “DEI” because even most Bible belt folks get uncomfortable when you drop the hard R they really want to say.
They can’t stand to see someone “undeserving” do as well as or better than them, so they try to mow it down.
in australia and new zealand we have a concept called “tall poppy syndrome” (people who stand out from the crowd, who promote themselves excessively and publicly) and the reaction to that: “cutting down the tall poppy”. cutting down the tall poppy originally meant just bringing them back down to earth, but kinda morphed into simply criticising anyone that does well
we tend to have a relatively strong egalitarian streak, and perhaps that change was tearing people down rather than distributing their success to equalise
anyway, related: tearing down the tall poppy, ie pulling down anyone that stands out
SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social
on 15 Feb 16:07
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Remember that their fascism is based in feelings of superiority in addition to fear.
Hi, it’s me, I’m the “well akshuslly” guy today. Fascism (and the whole right-wing mindset) is based on fear, primarily fear that they, personally and individually, are interior. That’s why they need the constant and over-the-top demonstrations of dominance and claims of superiority—to drown out those fears.
I appreciate where you’re coming from. I said it the way I did because for some, at least from my observation, there is a sick sadism to it rather than fear alone.
Academic definitions would agree with you and it does hold true for the general populace; however I wanted to add the caveat so as not to mistakenly give the impression that fascists should be pitied, in any capacity.
Women and visible minorities are often given the absolute worst conditions for getting out of the shit cycle started by white dudes. This can mean that they don’t have great scores on tests and stuff and that can look like they are, by default, not as smart if you’re the kind of person whose brain is barely firing enough to allow you to breathe.
So you extend that out and suddenly it’s “wait if they get hired at all and they’re not as smart that means they don’t deserve it!”. DEI does, I’m sure, bring some people in that might not be the best candidates but it never brings in people who are unqualified for the job like the racists believe, and the even the metric for “best” on paper is clouded by the aforementioned lack of support.
They’re connected because these people believe that there’s no way a straight white male would ever lose to a minority or a woman despite the fact that most of the people who believe it are huge losers barely stumbling through life while ignoring the fact that they are supported by everyone else.
I’m a straight, white dude whose parents can financially support me when I need it shit’s hard enough as-is. To act like I don’t have serious privilege and like so many people don’t have it even worse than me…god I can’t even fathom that level of self-centered egotism.
DontMakeMoreBabies@lemm.ee
on 15 Feb 00:32
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I’ve got cousins who live in a house purchased by my grandparents. Pretty sure my uncle has always lived in places they’ve bought? His kids, college age, told me that they aren’t privileged…
Man, why is it so common to find those people among the group that is so clearly privileged even compared to poor people that are otherwise exactly like them?
I mean, I’m sure it’s because we fetishize hardship and idiots feel like they aren’t of value unless they’ve had some kind of major setback so having privilege makes them feel like they didn’t still earn whatever it was just because doing it didn’t come with a heap of other issues but fuck.
If someone hired someone provably less qualified that would be easy grounds for a discrimination lawsuit. The problem is actually usually the opposite. People from disadvantaged groups often have to work way harder and be way more qualified just to be treated equally in society.
DEI isn’t about who we hire and fire specifically but about how we as a society of institutions act overall. People in DEI might review the hiring and firing practices more holistically as one part of their job. Possibly focusing on recruiting practices including all communities (who are you advertising the job to?), job descriptions being simplified and more honest to what is actually required (broadening who qualifies), training hiring and firing authorities about unconscious bias, etc. That enables them to follow the eeoc laws and truly hire people that are most qualified while having a more representative candidate pool, resulting in a more representative group of employees. When you’re correcting your hiring practices to be more equitable, you don’t need to hire people less qualified.
DEI would also be how they are treated once there, how the organization treats their staff in a fair and equitable manner. How current policies and processes can be changed to remove structural bias. How to best utilize a broad range of perspectives to improve your organization. For business often how you can include a broader range of targets to market to, etc. Analyzing the structure as a whole for institutional bias. That’s all DEI.
The right has perverted the concept of DEI to make people believe unqualified people are landing positions when that’s not what DEI is even there for.
The current admin cabinet hires are completely based on DEI. What other companies would hire such a diverse cadre of alcoholics, rapists, and idiots, while most companies tend to hire on merit.
I think they’re clarifying that the removal of the DEI program erased you, not the DEI program itself. It’s a small nit to pick, but then you confirmed it, so I think they just got confused. Words are hard sometimes
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 18:21
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No, the DEI program erased me.
atomicorange@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 18:31
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So the DEI program wasn’t inclusive enough? Would the situation have been better without the DEI program? Just trying to understand the issue, typically DEI has the effect of increasing visibility but it sounds like you had the opposite experience.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 18:56
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The DEI program (at least the one that interfaced with me) excluded and erased anyone who didn’t fit their prescribed notions of diversity.
I had a bad experience with an advisor in 2018. She invited me to her home, and asked me to bring food. We ate dinner. After, she put on netflix and started rubbing her butt on me. I ate her out, giving her my virginity. I quickly switched advisors. I had a swarm of “feminists” come down on me to cancel me for daring to eat out my female boss. Because I have something like a penis, it must be my fault, workplace hierarchies be damned.
I was kicked out of space sciences, and clawed my way back over a several year long struggle. In the meantime, I decided to transition to female. I am intersex, and hoped that it would help me avoid harassment. I cannot go on HRT because it would kill me. I try to qualify and push back against the HRT worship performed by mainstream trans culture. Trans people try to cancel me for speaking to my life experience and for pointing out that there are negative medical consequences of HRT that needs to be a part of the discussion. HRT should not be pushed as the default or only way to be trans. This and lingering animosity from the 2018 incident caused me to get kicked out a second time.
DEI, as it was implemented, was as much about reaching out to marginalized communities as it was about enforcing that everyone in the workplace hold the same beliefs. It was as much about bringing in new faces as it was about silencing even moderately dissenting voices. It was about supporting a diversity of identities, while also silencing a diversity of thought. I believe that the exclusive and inequitable implementation of DEI is a major driver of many people’s animosity towards it.
My situation would have been better without the DEI program. I would have my PhD by now, and I would probably not be unemployed. I recognize that for others the program was a foot in the door. That does not change the fact that for many like me, it was a boot in the ass.
I hope you realize how bad this entire chain sounds, and that is WITH your one sided account that’s clearly skimming over things you did, especially the second time you were kicked out.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:16
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I do not, and I would LOVE for you to tell me what I did wrong.
No one else will give me that courtesy.
All I tried to do was live my life and do my work. I didn’t even try to go after my former advisor. I repeatedly said that she wasn’t a monster. I just tried to move on after learning the hard way about how workplace hierarchies make relationships toxic.
And you’re right, I did skim over details for space. I was also sexually assaulted by that former advisor AFTER I split with her personally and professionally. Even then, I refused to go after her for her actions because I just wanted to move on.
Tell me what I did wrong. I really, honestly, do not see it.
I cannot, as you clearly aren’t telling the whole story. All I can tell is that you’re telling a very biased story, and you’re blaming DEI for… squints hiring women? Hiring feminists? It’s hard to tell who exactly you’re blaming for fucking your advisor and not getting abackslap and cigar.
Which is… Well, right up the alley of someone wanting rid of DEI I guess.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:23
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I have no problem with DEI hiring. I love that part of it!
I have a problem with the rape apologists masquerading as feminists populating DEI committees to powertrip over prosecuting wrongthink, and the cops that they use to harass people.
I don’t want any positive recognition for my mistake of eating out my boss after her advances towards her employee. I only wanted the drama and bullshit to end so I could focus on Saturn.
And that’s not a problem with DEI, that’s a problem with academic politics, which is what it sounds to me like you got slapped with, in the best case.
In the future, in academics you have to remember that the squeaky wheel does NOT get the grease, it’s considered a problem, annoying, distracting, and it gets removed so it goes away. You have to work bottom-up, not top-down. Top down is only an option when youre good friends with someone above them, or several someone on the same rung as them.
tl;dr: DEI sn’t the problem, the problem is a toxic workplace. DEI or no DEI, toxic employees will find SOME kind of structure to exert their will. Throwing away good structures because bad people abuse them is active harm.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:40
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It was the DEI committee doing the slapping.
The DEI committee was the top-down instrument coming after me and others for wrongthink.
I firmly believe in bottom-up approaches, and that’s what I tried to implement. Unfortunately those at the top were too powerful, and those at the bottom too scared to speak out in my favor.
I was not the wheel that was squeaking. I was desperately trying to move on from the drama. It was the DEI committee that couldn’t stop squeaking. They got the grease of getting me kicked out twice.
… See, now I’m just starting to think this whole thing is simply made up.
I work in academia. A DEI committee is a specific thing that has specific duties, and they wouldnt even be involved in this sort of thing. No one is being hired, no one is lacking an accomodation or opportunity, no one is being excluded. "DEI Committee"is certainly a big Republican Boogeyman dogwhistle though. So I think I’m just done here.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:55
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Well, that’s been my life for the past seven years.
I really wish it weren’t true.
I went all-in on a reboot and second chance only to get shat on again.
I really don’t have anything else to live for at this point and I don’t know what to do other than to speak my truth and hope that the next attempts at something like DEI can learn from it.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:43
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I got raped by my advisor, then sexually assaulted, then tried to move on without rocking the boat.
The DEI committee decided to go out of their way to defend the rapist and remove me. That is what I am charitably calling rape apology.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:47
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Now, to respond to your edit/tl;dr:
I didn’t want the DEI hiring baby thrown out with the bathwater. DEI structures were overpowered and centralized and enabled these toxic dynamics. I am only saying that this poor implementation is what led to animosity against DEI programs. Most people don’t see the hiring, but they do see the drama and firing and abuses of power. This feeds into the fascist agenda and pushes people away from progressive causes.
tl;dr: this is how we got people willing to vote for Trump
Lumelore@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 14 Feb 20:58
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As a trans woman, I don’t see HRT being pushed as the only way to be trans. I think the vast majority of us recognize that there are many different paths people take. I have a friend who can’t take HRT because of blood clotting issues they have, and they are still 100% valid. Even if someone’s health doesn’t prevent them from taking HRT and they just don’t want it, they are still valid as well. The people saying that HRT is necessary to be trans are known as transmedicalists and they are cringe.
Edit: This got double posted somehow, so I deleted the first one.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 21:03
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Thank you. I wish that the world had more people with compassion like you.
Thanks for answering, and I’m sorry about the creep in the replies downplaying your advisor raping you. I believe you, and I know it can be especially difficult for people who are perceived as “masculine” to get support when they come forward about being assaulted. Many self-proclaimed feminists still uphold the patriarchy by embracing gender essentialism bullshit. All I can say is, people are imperfect, biases are tough to unlearn, and living up to our ideals is a constant battle against complacency. I still value those ideals (diversity, equity, and inclusion), and I’m sorry the so-called DEI committee at your university failed to embody them.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 22:51
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Thank you.
I also still value those ideals. I wish that we as a society could do a better job of embodying them.
You should explain in more detail how that can possibly be the case. What other extenuating circumstances were there? What community or region did this occur in? I’m sorry if this is a hurt you didn’t want to discuss but this makes no sense in the context of DEI programs and their intention.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 18:57
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I just responded to another comment asking questions in the same spirit. Please see my answer there.
quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 14 Feb 20:45
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Now I’m confused, what does DEI stand for? I thought it meant Diversity, Equity and Inclusion.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:52
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That’s what it claims to mean, but that’s frankly not how it was implemented.
Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion are fabulous ideals that result in better science that improves the lives of more people. If properly implemented, they create a better workplace ecosystem that better serves its employees and our nation/planet/community.
I wish that DEI programs didn’t stand for Demonization, Exclusion, and Inequity.
quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 14 Feb 21:04
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I’ve been reading the whole thread and it looks like you’re blaming an entire program for the bad experience you had with a particular group of people.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 21:09
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A particular group of people… who ran the program and used it as a tool of oppression.
Because of this, I think that it’s valid that I direct my criticisms towards the program. Would you rather I start rattling off names? Or should I focus on the structural inequities that enabled and rewarded these bad actors?
I suspect that these overreaches of power contributed to the rampant public animosity towards these programs and enabled fascism.
I hope that someone learns from my criticisms so that we can prevent what happened last year from happening again.
quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 14 Feb 21:49
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Because of this, I think that it’s valid that I direct my criticisms towards the program
That is exactly the incel mentality. These people did me wrong so I will blame the entirety of what, in my eyes, they represent.
anindefinitearticle@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 22:14
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No, it’s not incel mentality.
It’s the mentality of addressing structural issues and inequities instead of symptomatic bad actors.
It’s the mentality of trying to fix broken systems that wronged me.
Inequality is structural and needs to be addressed structurally if we want to solve it.
Blaming people and trying to get revenge by punishing them is the mentality that created the problematic structures that I’m trying to address.
Can you give me a few solid examples or some slides that they shared for your specific DEI program? I’ve done two and it’s some of the most boring and dry shit that I’ve ever listened to.
For ours, it was mainly that you can get talent from anywhere. It wasn’t about hating white men or nothing. I mean, at least it wasn’t for the ones that I’ve attended?
DarkCloud@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 16:53
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Still on Threads, supporting billionaire owned platforms.
Break the cycle of abuse already.
radiohead37@lemmynsfw.com
on 14 Feb 17:02
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Complaining about the platform she used completely misses the point.
Do you suppose they would have received fewer downvotes if they rephrased their comment such that the first part conveys empathy and the second part recommends to try other platforms?
earphone843@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 17:31
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They intentionally missed the point
Modern_medicine_isnt@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 17:43
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Seriously though. Publicity doesn’t make you a person. You know who else thinks it does. Trump. And thinking that way gets us more people in control who care more about image than doing anything.
A better ending to that post would have focused on the accomplishments, not the person. Like noting that it was that easy to make womens accomplishments dissapear or something like that.
No. She is the one mentioning it, and I don’t understand her point. She complains that no one knows her on Threads, because she moved from Twitter? Then @DarkCloud@lemmy.world 's comment is quite reasonable.
OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml
on 14 Feb 17:33
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Even if you’re against DEI in hiring (which I am), taking down pages of women in STEM is ridiculous. We want to encourage people to know what’s possible and we want them to push for it based on merit.
crmsnbleyd@sopuli.xyz
on 14 Feb 18:24
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equity and inclusion in hiring is about confronting biases in the hiring process, it’s good for meritocracy
prayer@sh.itjust.works
on 14 Feb 20:09
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DEI is an attempt at merit-based hiring. The only difference is what the definition of merit is. The definition that is based on past achievements is biased towards those who have previously had better opportunities, not necessarily better skills. DEI takes a look at the potential of someone in the context of how well they’ve done with respect to what has been available to them.
Someone who has a GED instead of graduating high school on time might have had opportunities closed to them because they had a reason for dropping out of high school (e.x. had to help family by getting a job), so it wouldn’t be equitable to judge them harshly for not having as strong of a resume as someone who had a “conventional” experience and was given more opportunities fresh out of highschool because they could afford to take an unpaid/low pay internship, instead of focusing on taking care of a family.
Nothing about either situation really can tell you about an applicants potential in the field or their work ethic or anything. But 9 times out of 10 the one who was fortunate enough to finish highschool on time will be ahead in the selection process for no reason other than they didn’t have life get in the way of their career.
DEI won’t be able to magically tell you which candidate is better, but it can allow employers to level the playing field and use different metrics to measure merit that might be less biased against people who have had nontraditional lives through no fault of their own.
I just wanna say I appreciate that you went into such detail to explain this. As somebody who’s honestly a little dumb, this has always been something I struggled to understand but could tell I was missing something. It’s nice to finally hear it in a way that makes sense to me.
Cronization@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 20:17
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Why are you against Diversity, Equality, and Inclusion in the hiring process?
The main reason I’m against “Diversity, Equality, and Inclusion in the hiring process” is it makes the average minority at a company worse compared to their white male peers, which is a horrible situation that breeds further racism.
My girlfriend is a visible minority in a STEM field. If people look at her and think “DEI hire”, that’s harmful, not helpful.
gallopingsnail@lemmy.sdf.org
on 14 Feb 23:53
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They could look at her and potentially think “DEI hire,” or they could not think about her at all because she wasn’t hired due to some factor relating to her racial background. What bass-ackwards logic.
or they could not think about her at all because she wasn’t hired
Lmao thanks for implying my girlfriend wouldn’t get a job without being a minority you racist
MadhuGururajan@programming.dev
on 15 Feb 03:45
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That’s not how I read it at all. You’re so close to figuring out why POCs need DEI. You GF can’t get a job without DEI because of racism. Regardless of her skill or experience. DEI forces employers to look beyond skin colour.
LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 03:54
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This guy is desperate for a troll
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 09:35
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How is it racist if the bar is lower for minorities? They will be able to get the job at lower performance
alcoholicorn@lemmy.ml
on 16 Feb 12:46
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DEI was implemented because without it, equally qualified minorities don’t get hired, there’s been endless studies on this. Stop falling for racist propaganda.
?? I’ve worked in hiring and seen a meeting where managers were informed of a new goal to make teams “50% diverse”. You also literally ignored the content of my other comment that included a source.
Inform yourself
Unless you can articulate extremely well how DEI works, I’m going to (likely correctly) assume you’re not informed
When faced with two evenly matched employees, choose the one that increases diversity, equity, and inclusion in the workplace.
The candidates are equally qualified… If a straight, white, male candidate is more qualified than a black lesbian woman, then nothing is stopping them from going with the white dude. DEI is only meant to come into play when the candidates are equal in all other aspects.
If you’ve experienced it done wrong, that’s a bummer… Doesn’t mean we should do away with it completely. Worst case, we end up erring on the side of having more diversity. Oh no. How awful.
The current and historical framework has meant that straight, white, dudes are the default. So if we’re “accidentally” going the other way sometimes, then I can live with that. I say this as a straight, white, male.
The 1950s boom was built on two things. Subsidizing a middle class instead of corporate (awesome). And the notion that a mediocre white male was more valuable in any job role than a woman or a non-white male.
The 1950s was, in part, built on the backs of women sent home from jobs after the war to have those jobs taken by folks who may or may not have been less qualified, as it was based entirely on gender, and to lesser extent, color.
Woman’s minds were squandered. I encourage you to ask about grandma back in the day. How mean was she? How mentally I’ll was she? How many suicides or addictions occurred? The mean stories abound at this time for a reason. Alternatively there’s the paper thin personality-less woman who avoids anything even remotely confrontational.
Ask your family.
Equality before the law is introduced and a subset of men who don’t have coping skills for not having power over other human beings, lack capacity to stand as an individual, lose their collective shit.
faythofdragons@slrpnk.net
on 15 Feb 00:49
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Three things, don’t forget that American companies got a lot of European contracts to help rebuild after WWII. There’s too many people out there that ignore that influx of money and try to say the economic boom of the 50s was because misogyny and racism worked.
Good point, saying the quiet part out loud. There will always be That Guy from the low coping skills set who will try to make that argument.
zarathustra0@lemmy.world
on 14 Feb 17:52
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I find this opposition to DEI somewhat perverse since to my mind it has mostly been a tool to add some limited legitimacy to a cruel system devoid of humanity; it was there to wash away the more obvious biases of an unjust system.
To my mind to remove DEI is to accelerate the collapse of the West. It seems counterintuitive to me that the people who are pushing for this seem to be the ones with the most to lose from it.
Infynis@midwest.social
on 14 Feb 19:52
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That’s the republican playbook. Do everything you can to destroy the government, and then point at the rotting corpse that’s left as evidence that government doesn’t work
I find this opposition to DEI somewhat perverse since to my mind it has mostly been a tool to add some limited legitimacy to a cruel system devoid of humanity; it was there to wash away the more obvious biases of an unjust system.
A Band-Aid solution to a complicate problem. They’re removing the band-aid and letting an open wound.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 15:16
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To my mind to remove DEI is to accelerate the collapse of the West. It seems counterintuitive to me that the people who are pushing for this seem to be the ones with the most to lose from it.
They’re bigots. Bigots often shoot themselves in the foot.
It’s the feel-good story that Republicans talk about when they say “pull yourself up by your bootstrap” but they’re upset because that’s only supposed to work for white men.
minyakcurry@monyet.cc
on 14 Feb 23:01
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While all this is going on, I’d also like to point out that grants are being flagged for being “woke” by this anti-DEI nonsense. Grants that have to do with cancer, physics, eclipses, and so on.
billwashere@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 00:21
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So how much longer before we get pissed enough to start doing something about it? I’m a white CIS heterosexual male and this is infuriating to me. This isn’t correction of DEI policies. This is blatant sexism and racism. Fuck these nazis.
Well let’s see… This country has been dealing with these issues for the entirety of its existence, so the time to start doing something about it has long passed.
hitmyspot@aussie.zone
on 15 Feb 01:56
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It’s also now. Now is the time. The best time was before. The next best time is now.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de
on 15 Feb 09:31
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right, let’s just lie down and die then, fucking brilliant reasoning there
I never seem to succeed, but if I ever do I’ll let you know how it is.
Robust_Mirror@aussie.zone
on 15 Feb 01:40
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So how much longer before we get pissed enough to start doing something about it?
Says the guy making no note of anything he is doing about it.
The people in power aren’t going to do anything about it because they want it this way.
Half the regular people also want it this way
Of the people left, somewhere around 50% don’t care either way.
And of the last people left who do care, probably at least half of those aren’t doing anything < this is presumably where you are.
You can’t just sit around and expect everyone else to be as angry or angrier than you and expect everything to work out because THEY’LL do something about it.
billwashere@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 02:00
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I said “we” dumbass.
StarlightDust@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 15 Feb 02:04
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You can’t really assume people aren’t organizing themselves just from a post like that. Its also bad for opsec to just post what you are up to online. Plenty of people are, there just aren’t enough people as people are stuck in the mindset that the systems haven’t collapsed yet so there is no need to build up a safety net.
Sauerkraut@discuss.tchncs.de
on 15 Feb 02:25
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Half the regular people also want it this way
Only 28% of adults voted for this and lots of Trump voters just wanted the cheaper groceries that Trump promised them (he lied).
So please don’t spread the lie that Trump has majority support or any kind of mandate. He doesn’t. Over a 100 million people didn’t bother to vote because they have no faith or hope that voting can improve their lives. They aren’t wrong. At best, electing Democrats is just a stay of execution.
Uh, isn’t that how American elections work? It’s decided based on the proportion of people who voted, not on the proportion of all adults. Trump won the popular vote 49.9% to 48.3% with the second highest number of votes in U.S. history. I don’t think any democracy divides votes by the total number of adults. How would that even work?
It does mean that not much more than 28% of the adult population support him though.
So he’s enacting all these democracy eroding changes for techno-authoitirians/fuedalists off of less than 1/3rd of the US’s population’s support.
Elections don’t care, nor does policy. But it is closer to 1/4 than 1/2 of people who can even begin to be said as his supporters. Despite what the media cycle might imply.
Sauerkraut@discuss.tchncs.de
on 15 Feb 02:17
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If someone starts a revolution I’d join the fight. “And just because he’s a worker,
no class can free him but his own.
The emancipation of the working class
is the task of the worker alone.”
Isn’t that part of the problem? Everyone is waiting for the revolution to start. Everyone is waiting for the next Luigi. Everyone is waiting.
Nothing’s getting better, but someone will come and fix all these problems any time now and I’ll be on their side!
NikkiDimes@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 09:52
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Are you volunteering? 😅
That’s the thing, though. As long as most people can comfortably skate by, that’s exactly what they’ll do. But, push come to shove, should things get bad enough, that’s when revolt happens.
No, I’m not volunteering because I don’t think either thing will work. But the people calling for those things to happen are waiting for someone else to do it.
Also, how are things not bad enough right now? They’re sending people to Gitmo. Trump and Musk fired people who are responsible for safeguarding our nuclear weapons because they didn’t know what they did. People didn’t even notice despite it being all over the news. Or at least they didn’t notice enough to pick up their torches and pitchforks.
And that’s just the latest horrific thing he’s done in the past three weeks.
It’s going to take a direct impact on peoples’ lives. If the average person can continue to go to work, get a paycheck, and overpay for but afford groceries for their family, that’s what they’re going to do.
Remember when I said he was a leader? Because I don’t.
OneTwoThree@mander.xyz
on 15 Feb 02:51
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I watched AOC’s “What’s Happening & How You Can Take Action” video and thought it was really impactful, so much so I decided to write up a summary of the insights, copy pasted below.
TL;TR for what you can do about it:
Know your rights and teach other people their rights
If something like war ever breaks out, engage in simple sabotage when you can. Short preview of link: “Whenever possible, arrange to have the fire start after you have gone away. Use a candle and paper, combination, setting it as close as possible to the inflammable material you want to burn”
However, we’re not currently there yet. We don’t need to wait until things get impossibly bad before taking action. If you think all that stuff like “contacting representatives” & “organizing for elections” will do is slow our collective downfall, then realize that a slowed downfall means more time to organize a resistance and more time for vulnerable groups to escape the country.
Also, feel free to copy-paste this excerpt anywhere if you’d like!
Executive Orders are not that powerful:
For all the Executive Orders being signed, know that they’re not actually as powerful as they might seem. Congress can block Executive Orders, courts can block Executive Orders (you might have heard of this being done for the EO ending birthright citizenship), and they’re essentially more limited in scope/permanence than actually signed laws. In fact, much of the EOs Trump has signed are meaningless or completely unconstitutional, which is not a pointless distinction, because as mentioned before, courts are blocking these EOs.
Fascist dictators thrive on perceived power instead of actual power. They want to “flood the zone,” pump out so much terrible nonsense the populace becomes overwhelmed and docile. Don’t believe them, don’t become docile and don’t consent in advance. The reason Trump is using Executive Orders instead of actual laws is because he knows he only has a slim majority in the House (218R-215D, ie 2R’s could flip a vote, 2 vacancies in FL to be voted on 4/1, 1 R departure in NY-21 to be up for another special election)/Senate (53R-47D/I, ie 4R’s could flip a vote), and he doesn’t want his perceived power to crumble, such as when 3 GOP Senators John McCain, Susan Collins, and Lisa Murkowski blocked an Obamacare Repeal Bill “Health Care Freedom Act” from going through in 2017.
(In this case, by erasing this womans history NASA is doing a little thing called complying in advance.)
Action Being Done by Democrats:
Apparently Trump did a bunch of stuff while Congress was on recess, and they only got back in session Feb 5th, which was why there hasn’t been much news from democrats. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries recently released a 10 objectives plan for House Democrats to obstruct the administration
What You Can Do:
While I’m sure we’re all positively exhausted with everything going on, at a minimum, you can know your rights regarding ICE Raids: Don’t let them in without a Judicial warrant signed by a Judge, don’t answer their questions even if you are a citizen, don’t talk to them without a lawyer. If you have extra energy, you can:
Contact your Representatives urging them to obstruct Trump nominees while Elon is invading the Treasury
Help Organize for the Florida special elections 4/1 for the House of Representatives. While it would be difficult for these +30R seats to flip (Note in the Jan 29th Iowa special election for Senate (a state Trump won by +21) actually flipped to Democrats), even switching a +30R district to a +10R district lets Republicans
I would say AOC has a very emphasized presence in media that often allows her to break through into headlines despite corporate media’s tendency to never cover anything good a Democrat does ever and instead push this narrative that ‘if Democrats can’t manage to pass some legislation it’s Democrats fault for not doing enough and if Republicans do something awful it’s Democrats fault for not stopping them.’ The stereotype goes if Democrats hold rallies across all 50 states it’s radio silence, but if Trump breathes it gets 24/7 news coverage at work to normalize him, etc.
To be honest I’m a bit guilty of this too. I don’t actively search for what members of Congress are saying/doing, and I originally only watched AOC’s video because it was being shared around on social media. That being said, I decided to search around a bit to see what members of Congress are saying:
Here’s Bernie Sander’s YouTube, he’s been talking about oligarchs lately
Ilhan Omar saying Trumps executive orders don’t have support from GOP in Congress on CBS News
Plently of complaining from inside the halls of Congress like from Greg Casar
TL;DR: I would say AOC is probably the best at messaging directly to the people, and perhaps other members of Congress aren’t quite as effective as her, but a lot of them are still doing something even if we don’t always hear about it
Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world
on 16 Feb 10:56
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Thanks for doing the legwork!
Yamainwitch@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 11:50
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Fascist dictators thrive on perceived power instead of actual power. They want to “flood the zone,” pump out so much terrible nonsense the populace becomes overwhelmed and docile. Don’t believe them, don’t become docile and don’t consent in advance.
Well said
psyklax@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 15 Feb 04:42
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The problem is, where do we start? We’ve been, er, “taking the L” for so long, when are we going to start giving the L?
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 14:17
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Drop the Democrats and support the Green Party.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 15 Feb 15:41
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No. Fuck the Green Party. They’ve disappeared immediately after the election like they always do, and we will not hear about them again for another four years.
They are not a real party.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 18:21
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We haven’t disappeared. The media only covers us when we’re running presidential candidates.
CarbonBasedNPU@lemm.ee
on 16 Feb 07:47
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What positions have the green party been elected to? I don’t mean nationally I mean state side.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 16 Feb 19:22
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Here you go. Currently, 161 Greens hold office in the United States.
Oh cool, then I’m sure you guys will start campaigning right away with some new, serious, progressive faces to go against democrats in primary elections?
Well until we get rid of first past the post, they have zero chance as a third party. Their only real chance would be to primary with the major party that they most align with.
Also, just because you can find one or two examples of green party candidates, does not mean that they are a real party. There is more to a political party than just allowing a person to use your party’s name while campaigning.
We need a real, grassroots, progressive party. The Green Party could clean up their act and become a serious party, and they’d still be shit because the name carries so much baggage. There are a whole lot of people who have been burned and will never vote Green Party again for the rest of their lives. Everyone would be better off with a new party.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 16 Feb 21:36
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Cool. Let me know when this new party of yours is bigger than the Greens, and I’ll join it. I’m only a Green because they’re the best party out there. If something better comes along, I’m there.
Can someone explain why all this hatred for the green party? I don’t know anything about them but I wouldn’t be surprised if the reason for that is active silencing.
They exist merely to help an incumbent conservative president win by siphoning votes away from disgruntled progressives. They come out of the dark at election time, then disappear after the election, like demented cicadas.
Hahahah ok I understand how that is what practically happens, but where do they stand politically?
What I mean is, this time we saw Harris support fracking and guns, having a lackluster response to Israeli aggression - to say the least - buddying up with Liz Cheney etc etc. Do people who are disappointed by this right turn have any reason to turn to the greens? If not, is there anyone else?
They are a fake party that comes out every four years (after primary season, when they could have become an actual viable candidate in our broken two-party system), to be a spoiler candidate that siphons votes from the Democratic party.
Every time.
Then they disappear for four years, and re-appear again at the same time during the next presidential election cycle and do it all again. They are not a serious party. If they were, they would have actual candidates running at state and local levels. They would participate in the primary process and/or campaign to switch away from First Past the Post system.
PSL is the only actual revolutionary party in America that I know of right now. The green party is a joke.
NostraDavid@programming.dev
on 15 Feb 13:52
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Fuck these nazis.
Are you going to storm the Capitol like your granddads stormed the beaches of Normandy? Are you going to only bitch about it on the internet, or are you actually going to do something about it - storming the Capitol not necessarily has to be a part of it - you can plan a better alternative.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 14:15
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Storming the Capitol is what the MAGA morons did. I hope the left is smarter than that.
Yeah me too. Storming anything is not likely the solution. If we get to the point of all out violence a lot can be lost in a short amount of time. But organizing protests or work stoppages can and do work with enough participation. But there’s the problem, enough participation. I don’t really know what the solution is but I am willing to participate even if it hurts. This shit ain’t right.
The original comment is a dumb way to say it. But fascism doesn’t let you vote it out of power. Fascism doesn’t respond peacefully to peaceful protest either. Organized resistance will require violence in response to the inevitable violence of the state. The key word here being organized. The time for peaceful organization and voting has passed. Once fascist are in power the only thing to be done in the political arena is meant to delay while an organized resistance force can be formed. I highly doubt that will happen. But history tells us that this is the only viable option. All other efforts are only meant to delay. But if you’re only delaying and not organizing actual armed resistance than your delay is without purpose.
Storming the capital is dumb. Hardening your local neighborhood with an armed resistance and safe harbor for the targets of the fascist is where efforts should be put. This is about saving lives and building allies locally. It’s the best place to put effort right now to protect the first targets of the fascist. Right now that is undocumented people. But they won’t stop there. They never do.
GrumpyDuckling@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 14:58
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You have to figure out how to reach people and get them off of the social media and bullshit news.
Someone like that I would say, “who told you that? Mark Zuckerburg? That guys a fuckin’ greedy little creep. Fuck that guy.”
But you can’t be too much of an asshole, you have to “rib” them and act like it’s kind of funny.
Typical American response. Yeehaw you gonna kill some people er what!?
Attacking each other is not going to solve this problem because the wealthy have been pitting us against each other for a long time now. It was the wealthy that caused WWII and every other major war where everyone but them ends up dying.
I agree there are better alternatives.
NostraDavid@programming.dev
on 21 Feb 21:39
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Typical American response.
Alright, calm down, no need to insult me like that!
I’m just getting sick of the keyboard warriors that bitch and moan on the internet about the situation, yet have exactly zero plans to do literally anything about it. They could write to their representatives, they could work towards Dems winning local elections, they could become politically active by demonstrating, etc.
But all I see are online complaints; no plans. Storming the Capitol should be option Z, but maybe Americans can start with Plan A, eh?
I think the issue is the US was founded by the wealthy for the wealthy. The solution is more than just writing your representatives, demonstrating, and getting involved with local politics. All these things can help the situation, but they won’t solve the problem.
We really need a new constitution that protects our rights. We need to be able to say everyone is guaranteed access to housing, medical care, education, work, and privacy. We need to state that governments and corporations cannot manipulate people anymore. They are using the best of psychology and sociology science against us, this is unacceptable.
We have to ensure resources are fairly distributed, that wealth is spread out, and that our political institutions are designed to resist corruption. We have to look past popular vote for representation along with all the other systems we use that trap us in this never ending cycle of pitting people against each other for political gain. We need to move beyond having the government be an abusive entity representing monied interests.
Until we get these things we will never be able to move on. We will forever be trapped in a system that only values how much it can extract from us.
Look into your local PSL or DSA. Us socialist are on the top of the leaderboard for Nazi killing and it’s not even close. Join the SRA too. This shits not going away with votes. Fascism doesn’t let you vote it out of power.
Why couldn’t it be? Why shouldn’t there be a section for “people”, to serve as motivation for whomever wants to follow their footsteps and work at NASA?
And also, supposedly, only women’s info were removed. Did they also remove the bio of men?
mineralfellow@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 11:49
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It is pretty standard practice. For one, it helps people who read or review your work know who they are dealing with. For another, it helps the general public understand who scientists are. Part of the mission is to make sure that the next generation carries the work on, and by emphasizing the human aspect of the science, young people can actually imagine themselves getting to that point some day.
Kalkarino@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 12:26
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I thought my dad would have come around by now with everything going on. Last night he was gloating about how much work is getting done in the White House and how everything’s about to get a lot cheaper.
Insanity.
BrokenGlepnir@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 14:06
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I mean, that’s the real trump derangement syndrome. People who are outside of reality because of their support of the man.
BrokenGlepnir@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 23:20
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Absolutely. In 2020 I asked the biggest trump supporter I know if he was better off then or four years ago. It’s not the fairest question, but I knew that then. There’s a lot of circumstances that effect it.
In 2020 he had no job (for years), was living with his mother, and swore he was keeping track of his “debt” with her that totalled in the tens of thousands. In 2016 he had a job, and had his own apartment. He said he was doing better in 2020.
In 2024 he had a higher paying job than he ever had before, and had bought a house. I didn’t ask him the question though. I was pretty sure I knew what he would say. He did say he was glad RFK would make us label our food … As he was drinking a soda that had the ingredients labeled, like most of our food.(Oh or is it the “natural and artificial ingredient” secret recipe crap that’s killing us that you still can see on the label and avoid, and not the high fructose corn syrup with 120 percent your daily allotment?)
I’d say that’s detaching from reality when politics get concerned.
stephen01king@lemmy.zip
on 15 Feb 14:38
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Then, you should challenge him and make him set a deadline for when everything is supposed to be a lot cheaper. When people starts to get sidetracked from thinking critically, that’s when you need to make them set an ultimatum that either forces them to think critically, or make them set their own limit that you can then point back to later.
His only concern is himself, he thinks he’ll benefit so everyone else can suffer as far as he is concerned. This is the broad motivation of the entire movement. As if America first didn’t make it obvious enough, it was really “me first”. What they don’t understand is how the me in that is entirely relative and they quickly become expendable.
KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 16 Feb 03:07
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maybe if you explain to him the cause of the great depression being isolationist economic policy hitting everyone really hard, meanwhile japan with its keynesian policy managed to do pretty well, even in the face of global economic downturn.
Some people find facts more reasonable, ironically, even if they will cognitively dissonant themselves from them.
LeninOnAPrayer@lemm.ee
on 15 Feb 18:31
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Same with my Mom. I told her “yeah, Mussolini did a good job making the trains run on time”. She never responded.
(Beside the point, but Mussolini totally did not run an efficient train network, it was a cluster fuck like everything else he did)
KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 16 Feb 03:05
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im pretty sure that’s the exact implication being made lol
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social
on 16 Feb 06:48
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Yeah but if they knew enough to know that they wouldn’t be voting Republican.
KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 17 Feb 03:13
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evidently they still did, cognitive dissonance is a hell of a thing.
KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 16 Feb 03:05
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wait until everything gets a lot more expensive, and then ask him what happened lmao
lightsblinken@lemmy.world
on 16 Feb 05:17
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make it real for your dad - every chance you get, capture the price of a few things and chart it out over time… actual real evidence that you collected yourself is harder to refute than a graph produced by anonymous sources online.
TheWolfOfSouthEnd@lemmygrad.ml
on 16 Feb 19:59
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Ask your dad why the GOP needs to raise the Debt Ceiling by $4 Trillion in their budget bill, and how many of the now dozens of lawsuits Trump might win based on his performance in 2020 when he lost almost every single court case, even when Trump appointed the judges himself.
I tried that with someone on facebook. They retreated back to “we have to get federal spending under control.” Maybe so, but this group isn’t doing that.
I can’t wait to talk to my parents. Lifelong republicans (though not specifically trump fans, just voting R), so it’s extremely likely they voted for this.
I’m a federal employee. They voted to put my job (and my wife’s job) in jeopardy. They voted for this. They voted to hurt us.
Anegro_Montoya@sh.itjust.works
on 15 Feb 15:00
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I will feel mad as fuck for you and use this as evidence when people say these EOs aren’t hurting anyone other than illegal immigrants.
TonyTonyChopper@mander.xyz
on 15 Feb 16:52
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This isn’t a science meme
ThUSSBongwater@lemmings.world
on 15 Feb 17:36
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You shouldn’t care and want justice instead
CastorSulMush@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 17:29
nextcollapse
They want something not that different from the Taliban. Subservient women existing only to make and raise kids.
To get people trested equally, you need to apply positive bias towards women whom would otherwise be treated unfairly by the current systemic biases.
ohshittheyknow@lemmynsfw.com
on 15 Feb 18:41
nextcollapse
Oh geez that would be great wouldn’t it. But it sounds like you’ve never had some tell you that you can’t do something because of your sex. Highlighting successful minorities in a field inspires and encourages others in their same position.
CallMeButtLove@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 18:44
nextcollapse
She does not sound sexist. She sounds justifiably upset that the organization she works for and clearly loves is trying to erase her her involvement in it just because she is a woman.
TowardsTheFuture@lemmy.zip
on 15 Feb 19:02
nextcollapse
I’m sorry… she sounds sexist because when she talked about the article on her at nasa she mentioned… her dreams… her being raised poor… her being homeless… and… her getting a job at Nasa despite all that. Huh oh wait weird I missed the part where she made it all about her being a woman? because… she didn’t even do that? She wasn’t even highlighting that she is important as a role model to women in STEM. Didn’t even mention it in the part discussing the article that was erased. She was highlighting being a role model of achieving her dream job even though she was poor and homeless at one point. And was simply pointing out that it is being erased BECAUSE she is a woman. and you are calling HER sexist? Are you high? Can you read? You just enter a fugue state when you see the word women and make shit up that didn’t happen so you can feel better about yourself? Cuz I’m super confused how you can get sexist from what she said without just assuming she’s sexist because she is a woman.
You have so consistently dehumanized the women in your life that this statement actually makes sense to you? Like, it’s pretty well known that women are a minority in STEM fields. What the hell you so afraid of, that celebrating a woman’s accomplishments offense you so???
Maybe stop trying to gain power over other human beings. Cause the path you’re currently on? You fucking know where it leads. And no, dragging others down will never change the hellscape of fear and paranoia you have found. You have to walk out of the valley of despair; there is no other escape.
Gods, this old chestnut… Hey, on behalf of the Trans-Non-binary community can we retire this please? Not because it’s offensive, it isn’t, we just heard it more on average and it was always just bland weak sause shit. Reseting the clock on this boring ass joke from reddit five years ago is cringe. You wanna troll somebody at least make an effort greater than “I know you are but what am I?!”
houstoneulers@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 19:35
nextcollapse
Wait, I can’t find the order that says to do this. Can someone please link me?
Retrograde@lemmy.world
on 16 Feb 01:54
nextcollapse
A lot of this was internal and will only be seen in documentaries down the road… if there will even be a road
The order to end dei in government positions. Women are included in diversity equity and inclusion. Nasa is a government agency, so it makes sense. Is it good? Absolutely not, just the wacky world we have to live in.
MacNCheezus@lemmy.today
on 15 Feb 19:40
nextcollapse
Cancel culture ain’t so much fun when it happens to you, is it.
Bamboodpanda@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 19:56
nextcollapse
Actually, this situation isn’t about cancel culture at all. Cancel culture typically refers to public backlash resulting in personal or professional consequences for offensive or harmful behavior. What happened here seems to be a systemic decision to remove content highlighting women in STEM at NASA.
This isn’t driven by public outcry or social pressure; it’s a form of institutional erasure. There’s a big difference between being held accountable for harmful actions and having your achievements wiped out due to a policy change.
I think you are misinformed about the nature of cancel culture — it was always a government program. Those mass account purges on Twitter over COVID “misinformation”, for instance, happened explicitly at the behest of the Biden administration. It was not at all the result of public outcry.
Also, many of the claims that were made (such as the lab leak theory) did, in fact, turn out to be true.
On Cancel Culture: The term “cancel culture” typically refers to public backlash leading to personal or professional consequences for perceived offensive behavior. In the case of the NASA bio removal, it appears to be an internal policy decision, not a result of public outcry.
On Government Influence and Social Media: While there have been instances where government entities have interacted with social media platforms regarding content moderation—such as the Biden administration’s efforts to curb COVID-19 misinformation—this differs from “cancel culture.” These actions involve governmental attempts to manage public health information, which has sparked debates about free speech and censorship.
On the Lab Leak Theory: The origins of COVID-19 have been extensively debated. Agencies like the FBI and the Department of Energy have assessed, with varying degrees of confidence, that a lab leak is a plausible origin. However, this remains a separate issue from the NASA bio removal and the broader discussion of cancel culture.
Bringing up these points seems to divert from the initial discussion about the removal of a NASA bio highlighting a woman’s achievements in STEM. It’s essential to distinguish between institutional decisions, public backlash, and government policies.
dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
on 15 Feb 20:13
nextcollapse
Take your weak attempt at trolling somewhere else.
Sadly, that stooge isn’t even self aware enough to realize it’s trolling. Which makes feeding trolls so, just, tedious these days. No fun in it at all!! 😡
Huh. The only possible reason to conflate cancel culture with erasure is if you’re such a shit person with truly deplorable views that being forced to just fucking be polite feels like an attack on your person.
Everyone knows the dog whistle involved here, buddy.
I don’t think I follow that train of thought. What do you think cancel culture was except the systematic erasure of people with “undesirable” viewpoints?
Duh. Not being allowed to do offensive shit without consequence is obviously upsetting to you. So, yeah, of course you didn’t follow a train of thought that includes common decency.
What do you think cancel culture was except the systematic erasure of people with “undesirable” viewpoints?
I think actions have consequences. I think a person who has any actual courage will accept that fact. What, do you think bigotry and prejudice shouldn’t be “undesirable”? What, you afraid of just…not being an ass???
Okay, so instead of focusing on making solid arguments, you been spending much of your time on name calling and insulting my intelligence instead. Is that what you consider common decency? Or should there be consequences for that?
Seems like a clear violation of rule 1 of this forum: “Don’t throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.”
Yeah, no shit I’m not “debating in good faith”. Duh. Why the fuck would I bother?? Like, seriously, there’s nothing clever in that “asking questions” approach.
And, if you’re gonna cry about ‘solid arguments’, fund one yourself. Facts don’t care about your feelings, remember???
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world
on 16 Feb 00:03
nextcollapse
Deleting the record of a women’s scientific achievements isn’t the same as firing (or declining to renew a contract) of someone who’s falsifying test results or just being an ass.
I wonder which person you’re actually referring to. Have a few names we can “peer review”?
Indeed, firing someone seems like a much more drastic measure, and as far as we can tell from the OP, Rose still has her job.
Also, this page about Women at NASA, which contains literally hundreds of articles about female scientists’ achievements there has apparently not been deleted, so this doesn’t look like some sort of systemic erasure to me. Perhaps her profile was simply deleted by mistake?
I tried clicking a bunch of them just to make sure they’re not all dead links, and so far I haven’t hit any 404s.
threaded - newest
Gets an article about them removed
Completely erased as a person
Try to avoid writing any songs or singing, I fear you may be tone deaf.
Even besides that, having an article about you and your work published by fucking NASA is some of the biggest flexes you can have on your resume
If I had that happen to me I think it would destroy me. I thought of NASA as the one good thing still in the government. The fact that they are just letting it happen is weirdly depressing. I know I should have expected it but somehow it feels very final.
For this community yes, but I think the over-dramatising works against the wider acceptance of DEI practices. Most people have never even had an article written about them, those people still have personhood, so does this lady. From that perspective it comes off as entitled and decoupled from reality. Who wants to listen to someone acting unhinged on social media?
Obviously, removing the section is wrong, and we should have these articles to highlight the achievements of women in male dominated fields. Plus highlighting that it’s been removed by the vile actions of the trump administration is important
Lucky for you, you’ll never experience erasure. Because you’ll never matter.
Lucky for me, I don’t value my entire existence on random people knowing my sad origin story.
😂
hey maybe accept that you will never achieve as much as this person. Don’t pretend that a NASA article about you won’t make you feel successful.
Haven’t you read her post? Her entire work was erased alongside herself… I’m already miles ahead.
Reading comprehension -20, but I guess that explains why you’d drink up this drivel
if you can’t understand why it is important to have NASA of all people mention you by name, you’re naive, ignorant or just a child who thinks it’s cool to diss people for wanting recognition.
Please stop being an edgelord for a moment and think about the humans in the situation.
your holier than thou attitude only reeks of loneliness and ineptitude to put yourself in the shoes of others.
Maybe they value what they achieved despite having said origin story. I certainly consider that a value.
Maybe you don’t have such amazing achievements in your own life?
But that’s not what the post is about. It’s specifically about new people on threads not being able to read her origin story.
Yes, because it can inspire people. It’s a very inspiring story. People can be motivated to do things with their own lives by listening to it. I’m amazed this has to be explained to you why removing it is a bad thing.
Did I comment at any point on whether the article removal was good or bad?
Okay, then what was your point?
You should feel like erasing the people that tried to erase you.
I prefer them in the light of justice rather than scurrying around with the darkness.
Unless the darkness is a really deep pit in some cave and their legs are broken.
Like Riddler “bring him into the light”?
Justice in the united states? where? how?
We tried that.
Nah.
I’d rather they see that we have a common enemy in the fascists and extend a hand of solidarity before I run out of the means to survive in a few weeks.
DEI is bad! Treat everyone based on their merits! Remove the bio pages for anyone not white and male!
... ?
Diversity, equity, and inclusion get in the way of their nepotism and cronyism hiring. If they were hiring based on merit alone there would be no problem being transparent and publishing their hiring decisions.
It’s been said better by other people but the general understanding of the right’s use of “DEI” is as a convenient blanket slur.
It’s typically used against Black and Hispanic people the most, followed by trans people, but any/all women are convenient extra padding under the bus tires of their bigotry and insecurity.
Remember that their fascism is based in feelings of superiority in addition to fear. Use that against the cowardly bastards. They can’t stand to see someone “undeserving” do as well as or better than them, so they try to mow it down.
Fuck ‘em.
EDIT: It seems like Rose Ferreira is of Hispanic descent, hailing initially from the Dominican Republic then moved to NY and eventually secured an internship at NASA, and is now an astronomer and aerospace engineer. It seems like her NASA page got reinstated, maybe after backlash. She’s awesome. Hell yeah for the Streisand effect.
Oh absolutely. Anyone who rails against "DEI" is by definition a white supremacist.
Not necessarily. They might be a misogynist, a militant christian or some other form of bigot as well. That’s the beauty of it, you can be “against DEI” as well as a woman or someone with more melanin than the “default” and you get to imagine they don’t hate you, just all those other people.
Also just fucking stupid ignorant assholes who know absolutely nothing other than the TV and their pastor and their radio tell them everyday that DEI is bad.
Just because you're not white doesn't mean you can't be a white supremacist.
Case in point: Mark Robinson
Wonder what ol’ Dooky Chute is up to these days.
See also
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Lee_Peterson
just like women can be enforcers of patriarchy, and the poor engines of capitalism
This is such a backwards take. “DEI” could always only end in misery, because it pulls people ahead of the line in a time when the working people are already having a hard time. “Is that person hired because of the colour of their skin or the sex of their body, or have they been hired because they’re actually good?”. It could only make a large part of the population feeling left behind because of their sex or race. What do you think that does to the social foundation of a nation?
Alas, I have no idea what a good alternative would be, but I always recognized “DEI” as a bad idea. I don’t have to be a chef to be able to tell that this dish tastes like ass, even if I can’t cook for shit myself.
That does not make me (or anyone else who thinks DEI is ass) a white supremacist “by definition”.
At the end of the day, it’s the ultrarich hoarding all the money that’s the actual issue - an economy that’s not fair to the citizens of the nation. The top 3 wealthiest persons in the USA have the same amount of money as the bottom 50%.
Careful now thats a nuanced opinion that doesn’t stroke my victim complex or reductively imply anyone who disagrees with me on complex systemic social issues is a nazi supremacist.
Prepare to be downvoted and hit with five paragraph essay replies picking apart everything you just said. You racist, mysoginistic, hateful, privileged, homophobic, transphobic, double checks progressive slurs & insults 101 field guide uhh third Reich bringing supremacist scum.
Everyone seems to forget that DEI as a name for these programs started during the first Trump admin.
DEI has always been a ruse.
They “embraced” these concepts to get all of the existing programs to label themselves as such.
They let Biden “extend” these programs so that anything supporting non-white-males would group together under the same banner.
Now they are “extinguishing” the whole lot of them now that it’s nice and easy and their targets have huddled together and identified themselves.
There was a complex network of programs doing these jobs before DEI existed. DEI was a ruse to centralize them so they could be extinguished.
They built the barrel, then used fascist rhetoric to get all the fish to group together in the barrel. Now they’re shooting the fish in the barrel.
I’d love to believe it.
I can’t find anything backing this up.
The has become a wall of text. Sorry.
1st half of this post is refuting “trump defined DEI”. I would live to be proved wrong on this, but it seems like something that happened during trump and was defined by Biden.
2nd half is more positive.
1st half…
Mostly sourced from …wikipedia.org/…/Diversity,_equity,_and_inclusion (
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity,_equity,_and_inclusion
incase the commas fuck up formatting).I don’t know when DEI actually became the official term. Probably during the Biden administration .
According to wiki, however, DEI has been around since the 60s, in principle.
Executive Orders that first mention “equity” along side diversity and inclusion seems to be en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13583 an Obama EO.
The best I can find relating to what you say is along the lines of this:
britannica.com/…/diversity-equity-and-inclusion-p…
Basically, government bodies using their autonomy to enact DEI policies in response to #MeToo, #BlackLivesMatter, George Floyd, and lots of other public sentiment & unrest. However nothing official at the government level of “DEI”.
Essentially, trump was asleep at the wheel with COVID and civil unrest, did fuck all (or encouraged civil unrest), and government bodies (which still had autonomy) enacted policies inline with the population.
So, what constitutes DEI?
What the right is defining it as? What it has been since the 60s? What Biden enacted? What the government bodies enacted during sleepy trump?
The 2nd half:
Being against DEI is like being against Antifa, or declaring Antifa a terrorist organisation. It’s not really a thing.
DEI is the awareness that previous centuries of discrimination no longer applies.
DEI isn’t a tangible thing. It’s humanity.
It didn’t happen during trump’s first term. But it did progress.
It didn’t happen during Bidens term. But it did progress.
That is humanity. Humanity progresses. Humanity is love, equality and freedom for all.
And a bit more ideologically…
Progress in the next 4 years is gonna be slow.
But everyone has worked on this before. It’s a hiatus. It will come back, and will be easier and more streamlined than before. Loads of people are backing up data, so it can be (relatively) easily restored. None of this has to be worked out again, nothing shared on the internet can truly die, ideas can’t be killed.
It’s gonna be 4 years of shit.
Hopefully Americans learn, and don’t vote in more conservatives.
…
…
Hopefully Americans get a chance to vote in another party.
Edit: typo, equality not equity
Thank you so much for your work on this.
My post that you are replying to is mostly a tongue-in-cheek commentary on how programs that have existed for decades self-labeled as something that the right was able to rally against, thereby making themselves a single large target instead of a decentralized force distributed across agencies.
I just know that I first started seeing “DEI” as a label pop up in the first Trump admin. Frankly, in 2018, it was called “Climate and Diversity” in my local environment. Shortly thereafter it got relabeled.
Yup! Remember how I said that before it was labeled there was a complex network of programs doing this job? DEI is more of a label than a program. I fully agree.
It’s not well defined! It’s a scare word. It’s a label that we lined up behind that unintentionally made it easy for antiracist programs to be identified and targeted.
I can’t agree more! The label of DEI just makes these programs easier to find. This us true both for people seeking assistance from these programs and for people seeking to dismantle them. Such identification is a double-edged sword, and that’s what my depressed brain was trying to communicate.
I love you. Thank you for this message of hope. I’m sorry to qualify it by saying: just because data can be restored, doesn’t mean that people or careers can be.
Nice.
With the tongue in cheek context, I understand your comment more: DEI (as an idea & movement) blossomed under trumps first term, because of the bullshit he caused and the reaction of the public.
The government had actual civil servants (as opposed to appointed oppressors or whatever), and reacted in a sensible way.
But yeh, the damage being done to people is unimaginable. People’s entire careers are being deleted from public records because they are a woman in STEM, or because they are the wrong colour, or because they don’t fit Christians opinion of normal. It’s fucked up
I don’t have to imagine it. Part of why I’m grumpy and bitching on the internet is that I’ve found myself unemployed with a deleted career and an almost-finished phd. I’m kind of at a loss for what to do or what comes next or how I’ll pay rent in two weeks. I’m scared and I was victim blaming myself. Thanks for helping to contextualize my pain and pull me back to reality. I’m doing a lot better now after talking to people on lemmy than I was last night or even this morning.
Yeh, venting on the internet helps. And it’s always great when you actually connect with someone.
I always wish I’d learned a trade. Electrician, plumber or tiler. Get an apprenticeship, learn a trade, be a sole trader, do something physical that’s always in demand.
Plenty out there to do, and it’s ok to mourn your last job (being a student/doctorate is a job).
Connect with old friends and family. Meet some new people. Somebody will be looking for someone smart and compassionate
You mentioned space science, right? I’m an engineer at an aerospace company, feel free to message me if you want to chat about the industry, I’d love to help if I can.
As I keep telling people, they keep saying “DEI” because even most Bible belt folks get uncomfortable when you drop the hard R they really want to say.
in australia and new zealand we have a concept called “tall poppy syndrome” (people who stand out from the crowd, who promote themselves excessively and publicly) and the reaction to that: “cutting down the tall poppy”. cutting down the tall poppy originally meant just bringing them back down to earth, but kinda morphed into simply criticising anyone that does well
we tend to have a relatively strong egalitarian streak, and perhaps that change was tearing people down rather than distributing their success to equalise
anyway, related: tearing down the tall poppy, ie pulling down anyone that stands out
Hi, it’s me, I’m the “well akshuslly” guy today. Fascism (and the whole right-wing mindset) is based on fear, primarily fear that they, personally and individually, are interior. That’s why they need the constant and over-the-top demonstrations of dominance and claims of superiority—to drown out those fears.
I appreciate where you’re coming from. I said it the way I did because for some, at least from my observation, there is a sick sadism to it rather than fear alone.
Academic definitions would agree with you and it does hold true for the general populace; however I wanted to add the caveat so as not to mistakenly give the impression that fascists should be pitied, in any capacity.
Women and visible minorities are often given the absolute worst conditions for getting out of the shit cycle started by white dudes. This can mean that they don’t have great scores on tests and stuff and that can look like they are, by default, not as smart if you’re the kind of person whose brain is barely firing enough to allow you to breathe.
So you extend that out and suddenly it’s “wait if they get hired at all and they’re not as smart that means they don’t deserve it!”. DEI does, I’m sure, bring some people in that might not be the best candidates but it never brings in people who are unqualified for the job like the racists believe, and the even the metric for “best” on paper is clouded by the aforementioned lack of support.
They’re connected because these people believe that there’s no way a straight white male would ever lose to a minority or a woman despite the fact that most of the people who believe it are huge losers barely stumbling through life while ignoring the fact that they are supported by everyone else.
I’m a straight, white dude whose parents can financially support me when I need it shit’s hard enough as-is. To act like I don’t have serious privilege and like so many people don’t have it even worse than me…god I can’t even fathom that level of self-centered egotism.
I’ve got cousins who live in a house purchased by my grandparents. Pretty sure my uncle has always lived in places they’ve bought? His kids, college age, told me that they aren’t privileged…
Apparently they’re fucking stupid.
Man, why is it so common to find those people among the group that is so clearly privileged even compared to poor people that are otherwise exactly like them?
I mean, I’m sure it’s because we fetishize hardship and idiots feel like they aren’t of value unless they’ve had some kind of major setback so having privilege makes them feel like they didn’t still earn whatever it was just because doing it didn’t come with a heap of other issues but fuck.
If someone hired someone provably less qualified that would be easy grounds for a discrimination lawsuit. The problem is actually usually the opposite. People from disadvantaged groups often have to work way harder and be way more qualified just to be treated equally in society.
DEI isn’t about who we hire and fire specifically but about how we as a society of institutions act overall. People in DEI might review the hiring and firing practices more holistically as one part of their job. Possibly focusing on recruiting practices including all communities (who are you advertising the job to?), job descriptions being simplified and more honest to what is actually required (broadening who qualifies), training hiring and firing authorities about unconscious bias, etc. That enables them to follow the eeoc laws and truly hire people that are most qualified while having a more representative candidate pool, resulting in a more representative group of employees. When you’re correcting your hiring practices to be more equitable, you don’t need to hire people less qualified.
DEI would also be how they are treated once there, how the organization treats their staff in a fair and equitable manner. How current policies and processes can be changed to remove structural bias. How to best utilize a broad range of perspectives to improve your organization. For business often how you can include a broader range of targets to market to, etc. Analyzing the structure as a whole for institutional bias. That’s all DEI.
The right has perverted the concept of DEI to make people believe unqualified people are landing positions when that’s not what DEI is even there for.
I think the justification for things like this is that they don’t feel like they got there on their merits in the first place
The current admin cabinet hires are completely based on DEI. What other companies would hire such a diverse cadre of alcoholics, rapists, and idiots, while most companies tend to hire on merit.
I like to think these ones self select.
It happened to me in October 2018 and again in April 2024. Erasure by DEI programs and of the people supported by them kills a part of you.
You never really know how to feel. You just get increasingly dead inside.
At least I have two weeks of food left.
Erasure of DEI programs? DEI doesn’t erase I just wanna make sure I’m understanding you properly.
DEI programs absolutely erased people.
They erased me for being intersex and not conforming to their stereotypes of gender diversity / transness.
Oh, who did they erase?
Me. Your reply came in while I was adding my edit.
I think they’re clarifying that the removal of the DEI program erased you, not the DEI program itself. It’s a small nit to pick, but then you confirmed it, so I think they just got confused. Words are hard sometimes
No, the DEI program erased me.
So the DEI program wasn’t inclusive enough? Would the situation have been better without the DEI program? Just trying to understand the issue, typically DEI has the effect of increasing visibility but it sounds like you had the opposite experience.
The DEI program (at least the one that interfaced with me) excluded and erased anyone who didn’t fit their prescribed notions of diversity.
I had a bad experience with an advisor in 2018. She invited me to her home, and asked me to bring food. We ate dinner. After, she put on netflix and started rubbing her butt on me. I ate her out, giving her my virginity. I quickly switched advisors. I had a swarm of “feminists” come down on me to cancel me for daring to eat out my female boss. Because I have something like a penis, it must be my fault, workplace hierarchies be damned.
I was kicked out of space sciences, and clawed my way back over a several year long struggle. In the meantime, I decided to transition to female. I am intersex, and hoped that it would help me avoid harassment. I cannot go on HRT because it would kill me. I try to qualify and push back against the HRT worship performed by mainstream trans culture. Trans people try to cancel me for speaking to my life experience and for pointing out that there are negative medical consequences of HRT that needs to be a part of the discussion. HRT should not be pushed as the default or only way to be trans. This and lingering animosity from the 2018 incident caused me to get kicked out a second time.
DEI, as it was implemented, was as much about reaching out to marginalized communities as it was about enforcing that everyone in the workplace hold the same beliefs. It was as much about bringing in new faces as it was about silencing even moderately dissenting voices. It was about supporting a diversity of identities, while also silencing a diversity of thought. I believe that the exclusive and inequitable implementation of DEI is a major driver of many people’s animosity towards it.
My situation would have been better without the DEI program. I would have my PhD by now, and I would probably not be unemployed. I recognize that for others the program was a foot in the door. That does not change the fact that for many like me, it was a boot in the ass.
Edited to put the story in chronological order.
I hope you realize how bad this entire chain sounds, and that is WITH your one sided account that’s clearly skimming over things you did, especially the second time you were kicked out.
I do not, and I would LOVE for you to tell me what I did wrong.
No one else will give me that courtesy.
All I tried to do was live my life and do my work. I didn’t even try to go after my former advisor. I repeatedly said that she wasn’t a monster. I just tried to move on after learning the hard way about how workplace hierarchies make relationships toxic.
And you’re right, I did skim over details for space. I was also sexually assaulted by that former advisor AFTER I split with her personally and professionally. Even then, I refused to go after her for her actions because I just wanted to move on.
Tell me what I did wrong. I really, honestly, do not see it.
I cannot, as you clearly aren’t telling the whole story. All I can tell is that you’re telling a very biased story, and you’re blaming DEI for… squints hiring women? Hiring feminists? It’s hard to tell who exactly you’re blaming for fucking your advisor and not getting abackslap and cigar.
Which is… Well, right up the alley of someone wanting rid of DEI I guess.
I have no problem with DEI hiring. I love that part of it!
I have a problem with the rape apologists masquerading as feminists populating DEI committees to powertrip over prosecuting wrongthink, and the cops that they use to harass people.
I don’t want any positive recognition for my mistake of eating out my boss after her advances towards her employee. I only wanted the drama and bullshit to end so I could focus on Saturn.
Where does rape apology come into it?
And that’s not a problem with DEI, that’s a problem with academic politics, which is what it sounds to me like you got slapped with, in the best case.
In the future, in academics you have to remember that the squeaky wheel does NOT get the grease, it’s considered a problem, annoying, distracting, and it gets removed so it goes away. You have to work bottom-up, not top-down. Top down is only an option when youre good friends with someone above them, or several someone on the same rung as them.
tl;dr: DEI sn’t the problem, the problem is a toxic workplace. DEI or no DEI, toxic employees will find SOME kind of structure to exert their will. Throwing away good structures because bad people abuse them is active harm.
It was the DEI committee doing the slapping.
The DEI committee was the top-down instrument coming after me and others for wrongthink.
I firmly believe in bottom-up approaches, and that’s what I tried to implement. Unfortunately those at the top were too powerful, and those at the bottom too scared to speak out in my favor.
I was not the wheel that was squeaking. I was desperately trying to move on from the drama. It was the DEI committee that couldn’t stop squeaking. They got the grease of getting me kicked out twice.
… See, now I’m just starting to think this whole thing is simply made up.
I work in academia. A DEI committee is a specific thing that has specific duties, and they wouldnt even be involved in this sort of thing. No one is being hired, no one is lacking an accomodation or opportunity, no one is being excluded. "DEI Committee"is certainly a big Republican Boogeyman dogwhistle though. So I think I’m just done here.
Well, that’s been my life for the past seven years.
I really wish it weren’t true.
I went all-in on a reboot and second chance only to get shat on again.
I really don’t have anything else to live for at this point and I don’t know what to do other than to speak my truth and hope that the next attempts at something like DEI can learn from it.
I got raped by my advisor, then sexually assaulted, then tried to move on without rocking the boat.
The DEI committee decided to go out of their way to defend the rapist and remove me. That is what I am charitably calling rape apology.
Now, to respond to your edit/tl;dr:
I didn’t want the DEI hiring baby thrown out with the bathwater. DEI structures were overpowered and centralized and enabled these toxic dynamics. I am only saying that this poor implementation is what led to animosity against DEI programs. Most people don’t see the hiring, but they do see the drama and firing and abuses of power. This feeds into the fascist agenda and pushes people away from progressive causes.
tl;dr: this is how we got people willing to vote for Trump
.
As a trans woman, I don’t see HRT being pushed as the only way to be trans. I think the vast majority of us recognize that there are many different paths people take. I have a friend who can’t take HRT because of blood clotting issues they have, and they are still 100% valid. Even if someone’s health doesn’t prevent them from taking HRT and they just don’t want it, they are still valid as well. The people saying that HRT is necessary to be trans are known as transmedicalists and they are cringe.
Edit: This got double posted somehow, so I deleted the first one.
Thank you. I wish that the world had more people with compassion like you.
Moving my reply to the non-deleted duplicate :)
Thanks for answering, and I’m sorry about the creep in the replies downplaying your advisor raping you. I believe you, and I know it can be especially difficult for people who are perceived as “masculine” to get support when they come forward about being assaulted. Many self-proclaimed feminists still uphold the patriarchy by embracing gender essentialism bullshit. All I can say is, people are imperfect, biases are tough to unlearn, and living up to our ideals is a constant battle against complacency. I still value those ideals (diversity, equity, and inclusion), and I’m sorry the so-called DEI committee at your university failed to embody them.
Thank you.
I also still value those ideals. I wish that we as a society could do a better job of embodying them.
You should explain in more detail how that can possibly be the case. What other extenuating circumstances were there? What community or region did this occur in? I’m sorry if this is a hurt you didn’t want to discuss but this makes no sense in the context of DEI programs and their intention.
I just responded to another comment asking questions in the same spirit. Please see my answer there.
Now I’m confused, what does DEI stand for? I thought it meant Diversity, Equity and Inclusion.
That’s what it claims to mean, but that’s frankly not how it was implemented.
Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion are fabulous ideals that result in better science that improves the lives of more people. If properly implemented, they create a better workplace ecosystem that better serves its employees and our nation/planet/community.
I wish that DEI programs didn’t stand for Demonization, Exclusion, and Inequity.
I’ve been reading the whole thread and it looks like you’re blaming an entire program for the bad experience you had with a particular group of people.
A particular group of people… who ran the program and used it as a tool of oppression.
Because of this, I think that it’s valid that I direct my criticisms towards the program. Would you rather I start rattling off names? Or should I focus on the structural inequities that enabled and rewarded these bad actors?
I suspect that these overreaches of power contributed to the rampant public animosity towards these programs and enabled fascism.
I hope that someone learns from my criticisms so that we can prevent what happened last year from happening again.
That is exactly the incel mentality. These people did me wrong so I will blame the entirety of what, in my eyes, they represent.
No, it’s not incel mentality.
It’s the mentality of addressing structural issues and inequities instead of symptomatic bad actors.
It’s the mentality of trying to fix broken systems that wronged me.
Inequality is structural and needs to be addressed structurally if we want to solve it.
Blaming people and trying to get revenge by punishing them is the mentality that created the problematic structures that I’m trying to address.
Can you give me a few solid examples or some slides that they shared for your specific DEI program? I’ve done two and it’s some of the most boring and dry shit that I’ve ever listened to.
For ours, it was mainly that you can get talent from anywhere. It wasn’t about hating white men or nothing. I mean, at least it wasn’t for the ones that I’ve attended?
Still on Threads, supporting billionaire owned platforms.
Break the cycle of abuse already.
Complaining about the platform she used completely misses the point.
Do you suppose they would have received fewer downvotes if they rephrased their comment such that the first part conveys empathy and the second part recommends to try other platforms?
They intentionally missed the point
Seriously though. Publicity doesn’t make you a person. You know who else thinks it does. Trump. And thinking that way gets us more people in control who care more about image than doing anything. A better ending to that post would have focused on the accomplishments, not the person. Like noting that it was that easy to make womens accomplishments dissapear or something like that.
No. She is the one mentioning it, and I don’t understand her point. She complains that no one knows her on Threads, because she moved from Twitter? Then @DarkCloud@lemmy.world 's comment is quite reasonable.
“She should smile more” but for using what it at least not Twitter.
Oh my god shut the fuck up.
Never Compromise With Fascists
Is Archive.org keeping these records? I think they are.
Who is following these orders. They are collaborators. Take their names.
This. We need to all agree to not comply.
Even if you’re against DEI in hiring (which I am), taking down pages of women in STEM is ridiculous. We want to encourage people to know what’s possible and we want them to push for it based on merit.
equity and inclusion in hiring is about confronting biases in the hiring process, it’s good for meritocracy
DEI is an attempt at merit-based hiring. The only difference is what the definition of merit is. The definition that is based on past achievements is biased towards those who have previously had better opportunities, not necessarily better skills. DEI takes a look at the potential of someone in the context of how well they’ve done with respect to what has been available to them.
Someone who has a GED instead of graduating high school on time might have had opportunities closed to them because they had a reason for dropping out of high school (e.x. had to help family by getting a job), so it wouldn’t be equitable to judge them harshly for not having as strong of a resume as someone who had a “conventional” experience and was given more opportunities fresh out of highschool because they could afford to take an unpaid/low pay internship, instead of focusing on taking care of a family.
Nothing about either situation really can tell you about an applicants potential in the field or their work ethic or anything. But 9 times out of 10 the one who was fortunate enough to finish highschool on time will be ahead in the selection process for no reason other than they didn’t have life get in the way of their career.
DEI won’t be able to magically tell you which candidate is better, but it can allow employers to level the playing field and use different metrics to measure merit that might be less biased against people who have had nontraditional lives through no fault of their own.
I just wanna say I appreciate that you went into such detail to explain this. As somebody who’s honestly a little dumb, this has always been something I struggled to understand but could tell I was missing something. It’s nice to finally hear it in a way that makes sense to me.
Why are you against Diversity, Equality, and Inclusion in the hiring process?
The main reason I’m against “Diversity, Equality, and Inclusion in the hiring process” is it makes the average minority at a company worse compared to their white male peers, which is a horrible situation that breeds further racism.
My girlfriend is a visible minority in a STEM field. If people look at her and think “DEI hire”, that’s harmful, not helpful.
They could look at her and potentially think “DEI hire,” or they could not think about her at all because she wasn’t hired due to some factor relating to her racial background. What bass-ackwards logic.
Lmao thanks for implying my girlfriend wouldn’t get a job without being a minority you racist
That’s not how I read it at all. You’re so close to figuring out why POCs need DEI. You GF can’t get a job without DEI because of racism. Regardless of her skill or experience. DEI forces employers to look beyond skin colour.
This guy is desperate for a troll
Are you aware of, like, all of American history?
Your girlfriend works with racists. That’s not the fault of DEI.
How is it racist if the bar is lower for minorities? They will be able to get the job at lower performance
DEI was implemented because without it, equally qualified minorities don’t get hired, there’s been endless studies on this. Stop falling for racist propaganda.
That’s literally not how DEI works. Inform yourself.
?? I’ve worked in hiring and seen a meeting where managers were informed of a new goal to make teams “50% diverse”. You also literally ignored the content of my other comment that included a source.
Unless you can articulate extremely well how DEI works, I’m going to (likely correctly) assume you’re not informed
When faced with two evenly matched employees, choose the one that increases diversity, equity, and inclusion in the workplace.
The candidates are equally qualified… If a straight, white, male candidate is more qualified than a black lesbian woman, then nothing is stopping them from going with the white dude. DEI is only meant to come into play when the candidates are equal in all other aspects.
If you’ve experienced it done wrong, that’s a bummer… Doesn’t mean we should do away with it completely. Worst case, we end up erring on the side of having more diversity. Oh no. How awful.
The current and historical framework has meant that straight, white, dudes are the default. So if we’re “accidentally” going the other way sometimes, then I can live with that. I say this as a straight, white, male.
Tbh I agree with this framework
Congrats, you agree with DEI.
So you think everyone should act in accordance with how while male peers think or act in a way that makes them not think “DEI Hire”.
I have news for you: those people will find excuses to exclude POC regardless of DEI
“Racist people use DEI as an excuse to be racist therefore DEI is bad.”
Makes them worse? What the fuck does that even mean?
I never said it “makes them worse”, read it again
Do you actually know what “DEI in hiring” actually entails?
It varies by company, but it can be up to "an acceptable balance between minority hiring and expected performance”[0]
[0] tracingwoodgrains.com/…/the-full-story-of-the-faa…
Really reaching there, aren’t we?
The 1950s boom was built on two things. Subsidizing a middle class instead of corporate (awesome). And the notion that a mediocre white male was more valuable in any job role than a woman or a non-white male.
The 1950s was, in part, built on the backs of women sent home from jobs after the war to have those jobs taken by folks who may or may not have been less qualified, as it was based entirely on gender, and to lesser extent, color.
Woman’s minds were squandered. I encourage you to ask about grandma back in the day. How mean was she? How mentally I’ll was she? How many suicides or addictions occurred? The mean stories abound at this time for a reason. Alternatively there’s the paper thin personality-less woman who avoids anything even remotely confrontational.
Ask your family.
Equality before the law is introduced and a subset of men who don’t have coping skills for not having power over other human beings, lack capacity to stand as an individual, lose their collective shit.
Three things, don’t forget that American companies got a lot of European contracts to help rebuild after WWII. There’s too many people out there that ignore that influx of money and try to say the economic boom of the 50s was because misogyny and racism worked.
Good point, saying the quiet part out loud. There will always be That Guy from the low coping skills set who will try to make that argument.
I find this opposition to DEI somewhat perverse since to my mind it has mostly been a tool to add some limited legitimacy to a cruel system devoid of humanity; it was there to wash away the more obvious biases of an unjust system.
To my mind to remove DEI is to accelerate the collapse of the West. It seems counterintuitive to me that the people who are pushing for this seem to be the ones with the most to lose from it.
That’s the republican playbook. Do everything you can to destroy the government, and then point at the rotting corpse that’s left as evidence that government doesn’t work
A Band-Aid solution to a complicate problem. They’re removing the band-aid and letting an open wound.
They’re bigots. Bigots often shoot themselves in the foot.
Isn't that the American dream in essence?
It’s the feel-good story that Republicans talk about when they say “pull yourself up by your bootstrap” but they’re upset because that’s only supposed to work for white men.
While all this is going on, I’d also like to point out that grants are being flagged for being “woke” by this anti-DEI nonsense. Grants that have to do with cancer, physics, eclipses, and so on.
DEI is just a dogwhistle.
npr.org/…/sen-ted-cruzs-list-of-woke-science-incl…
So how much longer before we get pissed enough to start doing something about it? I’m a white CIS heterosexual male and this is infuriating to me. This isn’t correction of DEI policies. This is blatant sexism and racism. Fuck these nazis.
Well let’s see… This country has been dealing with these issues for the entirety of its existence, so the time to start doing something about it has long passed.
It’s also now. Now is the time. The best time was before. The next best time is now.
right, let’s just lie down and die then, fucking brilliant reasoning there
Struggle your whole life then see how much of you is left to keep fighting. Death is the only path to peace.
i assume you’re willing to go first, to show how great it is?
I never seem to succeed, but if I ever do I’ll let you know how it is.
Says the guy making no note of anything he is doing about it.
The people in power aren’t going to do anything about it because they want it this way.
Half the regular people also want it this way
Of the people left, somewhere around 50% don’t care either way.
And of the last people left who do care, probably at least half of those aren’t doing anything < this is presumably where you are.
You can’t just sit around and expect everyone else to be as angry or angrier than you and expect everything to work out because THEY’LL do something about it.
I said “we” dumbass.
You can’t really assume people aren’t organizing themselves just from a post like that. Its also bad for opsec to just post what you are up to online. Plenty of people are, there just aren’t enough people as people are stuck in the mindset that the systems haven’t collapsed yet so there is no need to build up a safety net.
Only 28% of adults voted for this and lots of Trump voters just wanted the cheaper groceries that Trump promised them (he lied).
So please don’t spread the lie that Trump has majority support or any kind of mandate. He doesn’t. Over a 100 million people didn’t bother to vote because they have no faith or hope that voting can improve their lives. They aren’t wrong. At best, electing Democrats is just a stay of execution.
Uh, isn’t that how American elections work? It’s decided based on the proportion of people who voted, not on the proportion of all adults. Trump won the popular vote 49.9% to 48.3% with the second highest number of votes in U.S. history. I don’t think any democracy divides votes by the total number of adults. How would that even work?
It does mean that not much more than 28% of the adult population support him though.
So he’s enacting all these democracy eroding changes for techno-authoitirians/fuedalists off of less than 1/3rd of the US’s population’s support.
Elections don’t care, nor does policy. But it is closer to 1/4 than 1/2 of people who can even begin to be said as his supporters. Despite what the media cycle might imply.
If someone starts a revolution I’d join the fight. “And just because he’s a worker, no class can free him but his own. The emancipation of the working class is the task of the worker alone.”
Isn’t that part of the problem? Everyone is waiting for the revolution to start. Everyone is waiting for the next Luigi. Everyone is waiting.
Nothing’s getting better, but someone will come and fix all these problems any time now and I’ll be on their side!
Are you volunteering? 😅
That’s the thing, though. As long as most people can comfortably skate by, that’s exactly what they’ll do. But, push come to shove, should things get bad enough, that’s when revolt happens.
No, I’m not volunteering because I don’t think either thing will work. But the people calling for those things to happen are waiting for someone else to do it.
Also, how are things not bad enough right now? They’re sending people to Gitmo. Trump and Musk fired people who are responsible for safeguarding our nuclear weapons because they didn’t know what they did. People didn’t even notice despite it being all over the news. Or at least they didn’t notice enough to pick up their torches and pitchforks.
And that’s just the latest horrific thing he’s done in the past three weeks.
So what’s it going to take?
~2 days without food, for most people, I assume
Starving people don’t have much energy to violently revolt.
Tell that to the french
Why on Earth do you think the French Revolution happened because of a famine?
Only takes eating one rich person to get them back up though.
It’s going to take a direct impact on peoples’ lives. If the average person can continue to go to work, get a paycheck, and overpay for but afford groceries for their family, that’s what they’re going to do.
And if that never happens? If things get really bad but not that bad for Americans?
Still sounds like waiting for someone else to do it.
You’re not wrong.
What are you talking about? Luigi isn’t a leader. He’s just a guy who snapped.
Remember when I said he was a leader? Because I don’t.
I watched AOC’s “What’s Happening & How You Can Take Action” video and thought it was really impactful, so much so I decided to write up a summary of the insights, copy pasted below.
TL;TR for what you can do about it:
Additional stuff that may be useful eventually:
However, we’re not currently there yet. We don’t need to wait until things get impossibly bad before taking action. If you think all that stuff like “contacting representatives” & “organizing for elections” will do is slow our collective downfall, then realize that a slowed downfall means more time to organize a resistance and more time for vulnerable groups to escape the country.
Also, feel free to copy-paste this excerpt anywhere if you’d like!
TL;TR End
Insights from “What’s Happening & How You Can Take Action” by AOC:
Executive Orders are not that powerful: For all the Executive Orders being signed, know that they’re not actually as powerful as they might seem. Congress can block Executive Orders, courts can block Executive Orders (you might have heard of this being done for the EO ending birthright citizenship), and they’re essentially more limited in scope/permanence than actually signed laws. In fact, much of the EOs Trump has signed are meaningless or completely unconstitutional, which is not a pointless distinction, because as mentioned before, courts are blocking these EOs.
Fascist dictators thrive on perceived power instead of actual power. They want to “flood the zone,” pump out so much terrible nonsense the populace becomes overwhelmed and docile. Don’t believe them, don’t become docile and don’t consent in advance. The reason Trump is using Executive Orders instead of actual laws is because he knows he only has a slim majority in the House (218R-215D, ie 2R’s could flip a vote, 2 vacancies in FL to be voted on 4/1, 1 R departure in NY-21 to be up for another special election)/Senate (53R-47D/I, ie 4R’s could flip a vote), and he doesn’t want his perceived power to crumble, such as when 3 GOP Senators John McCain, Susan Collins, and Lisa Murkowski blocked an Obamacare Repeal Bill “Health Care Freedom Act” from going through in 2017.
(In this case, by erasing this womans history NASA is doing a little thing called complying in advance.)
Action Being Done by Democrats: Apparently Trump did a bunch of stuff while Congress was on recess, and they only got back in session Feb 5th, which was why there hasn’t been much news from democrats. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries recently released a 10 objectives plan for House Democrats to obstruct the administration
What You Can Do: While I’m sure we’re all positively exhausted with everything going on, at a minimum, you can know your rights regarding ICE Raids: Don’t let them in without a Judicial warrant signed by a Judge, don’t answer their questions even if you are a citizen, don’t talk to them without a lawyer. If you have extra energy, you can:
Thank you very much for the effort you put into this post.
Is it only AOC being vocal?
No, she’s just the one with most of the followers
I’ve seen Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders speaking up, too.
I would say AOC has a very emphasized presence in media that often allows her to break through into headlines despite corporate media’s tendency to never cover anything good a Democrat does ever and instead push this narrative that ‘if Democrats can’t manage to pass some legislation it’s Democrats fault for not doing enough and if Republicans do something awful it’s Democrats fault for not stopping them.’ The stereotype goes if Democrats hold rallies across all 50 states it’s radio silence, but if Trump breathes it gets 24/7 news coverage at work to normalize him, etc.
To be honest I’m a bit guilty of this too. I don’t actively search for what members of Congress are saying/doing, and I originally only watched AOC’s video because it was being shared around on social media. That being said, I decided to search around a bit to see what members of Congress are saying:
TL;DR: I would say AOC is probably the best at messaging directly to the people, and perhaps other members of Congress aren’t quite as effective as her, but a lot of them are still doing something even if we don’t always hear about it
Thanks for doing the legwork!
This is incredible, thank you!
Well said
The problem is, where do we start? We’ve been, er, “taking the L” for so long, when are we going to start giving the L?
Drop the Democrats and support the Green Party.
No. Fuck the Green Party. They’ve disappeared immediately after the election like they always do, and we will not hear about them again for another four years.
They are not a real party.
We haven’t disappeared. The media only covers us when we’re running presidential candidates.
What positions have the green party been elected to? I don’t mean nationally I mean state side.
Here you go. Currently, 161 Greens hold office in the United States.
Oh cool, then I’m sure you guys will start campaigning right away with some new, serious, progressive faces to go against democrats in primary elections?
No? You’ll be gone until 2028?
Prove me wrong.
gp.org/help_elect_a_green_to_the_milwaukee_common… Here’s an example of them trying to get someone elected to local office.
Do you mean midterms? Primaries are done within parties.
Again, we are running candidates, but you likely haven’t heard about them because, like I said, we only get coverage during presidential elections.
Well until we get rid of first past the post, they have zero chance as a third party. Their only real chance would be to primary with the major party that they most align with.
Also, just because you can find one or two examples of green party candidates, does not mean that they are a real party. There is more to a political party than just allowing a person to use your party’s name while campaigning.
We need a real, grassroots, progressive party. The Green Party could clean up their act and become a serious party, and they’d still be shit because the name carries so much baggage. There are a whole lot of people who have been burned and will never vote Green Party again for the rest of their lives. Everyone would be better off with a new party.
Cool. Let me know when this new party of yours is bigger than the Greens, and I’ll join it. I’m only a Green because they’re the best party out there. If something better comes along, I’m there.
The green party is nonexistent, any party is bigger than the green party
Can someone explain why all this hatred for the green party? I don’t know anything about them but I wouldn’t be surprised if the reason for that is active silencing.
They exist merely to help an incumbent conservative president win by siphoning votes away from disgruntled progressives. They come out of the dark at election time, then disappear after the election, like demented cicadas.
Hahahah ok I understand how that is what practically happens, but where do they stand politically? What I mean is, this time we saw Harris support fracking and guns, having a lackluster response to Israeli aggression - to say the least - buddying up with Liz Cheney etc etc. Do people who are disappointed by this right turn have any reason to turn to the greens? If not, is there anyone else?
They are a fake party that comes out every four years (after primary season, when they could have become an actual viable candidate in our broken two-party system), to be a spoiler candidate that siphons votes from the Democratic party.
Every time.
Then they disappear for four years, and re-appear again at the same time during the next presidential election cycle and do it all again. They are not a serious party. If they were, they would have actual candidates running at state and local levels. They would participate in the primary process and/or campaign to switch away from First Past the Post system.
But they do none of that.
they don’t disappear. the media doesn’t cover them.
Go piss in the wind! The US Green Party is not the same as the European versions, with exception to the turd and loser, Joschka Fischer.
PSL is the only actual revolutionary party in America that I know of right now. The green party is a joke.
Are you going to storm the Capitol like your granddads stormed the beaches of Normandy? Are you going to only bitch about it on the internet, or are you actually going to do something about it - storming the Capitol not necessarily has to be a part of it - you can plan a better alternative.
Storming the Capitol is what the MAGA morons did. I hope the left is smarter than that.
Yeah me too. Storming anything is not likely the solution. If we get to the point of all out violence a lot can be lost in a short amount of time. But organizing protests or work stoppages can and do work with enough participation. But there’s the problem, enough participation. I don’t really know what the solution is but I am willing to participate even if it hurts. This shit ain’t right.
The original comment is a dumb way to say it. But fascism doesn’t let you vote it out of power. Fascism doesn’t respond peacefully to peaceful protest either. Organized resistance will require violence in response to the inevitable violence of the state. The key word here being organized. The time for peaceful organization and voting has passed. Once fascist are in power the only thing to be done in the political arena is meant to delay while an organized resistance force can be formed. I highly doubt that will happen. But history tells us that this is the only viable option. All other efforts are only meant to delay. But if you’re only delaying and not organizing actual armed resistance than your delay is without purpose.
Storming the capital is dumb. Hardening your local neighborhood with an armed resistance and safe harbor for the targets of the fascist is where efforts should be put. This is about saving lives and building allies locally. It’s the best place to put effort right now to protect the first targets of the fascist. Right now that is undocumented people. But they won’t stop there. They never do.
You have to figure out how to reach people and get them off of the social media and bullshit news.
Someone like that I would say, “who told you that? Mark Zuckerburg? That guys a fuckin’ greedy little creep. Fuck that guy.”
But you can’t be too much of an asshole, you have to “rib” them and act like it’s kind of funny.
Typical American response. Yeehaw you gonna kill some people er what!?
Attacking each other is not going to solve this problem because the wealthy have been pitting us against each other for a long time now. It was the wealthy that caused WWII and every other major war where everyone but them ends up dying.
I agree there are better alternatives.
Alright, calm down, no need to insult me like that!
I’m just getting sick of the keyboard warriors that bitch and moan on the internet about the situation, yet have exactly zero plans to do literally anything about it. They could write to their representatives, they could work towards Dems winning local elections, they could become politically active by demonstrating, etc.
But all I see are online complaints; no plans. Storming the Capitol should be option Z, but maybe Americans can start with Plan A, eh?
I think the issue is the US was founded by the wealthy for the wealthy. The solution is more than just writing your representatives, demonstrating, and getting involved with local politics. All these things can help the situation, but they won’t solve the problem.
We really need a new constitution that protects our rights. We need to be able to say everyone is guaranteed access to housing, medical care, education, work, and privacy. We need to state that governments and corporations cannot manipulate people anymore. They are using the best of psychology and sociology science against us, this is unacceptable.
We have to ensure resources are fairly distributed, that wealth is spread out, and that our political institutions are designed to resist corruption. We have to look past popular vote for representation along with all the other systems we use that trap us in this never ending cycle of pitting people against each other for political gain. We need to move beyond having the government be an abusive entity representing monied interests.
Until we get these things we will never be able to move on. We will forever be trapped in a system that only values how much it can extract from us.
Look into your local PSL or DSA. Us socialist are on the top of the leaderboard for Nazi killing and it’s not even close. Join the SRA too. This shits not going away with votes. Fascism doesn’t let you vote it out of power.
I do not recognize those acronyms, but would like to know more! Can you point me in the right direction?
Party for Socialism and Liberation (Marxist Leninists) Democratic Socialist of America (DemSocs) Socialist Rifle Association (All leftist welcome)
Completely unrelated, book burnings
Why would your bio be on the NASA website? What does that have to do with the exploration of space or technological advancement?
Why couldn’t it be? Why shouldn’t there be a section for “people”, to serve as motivation for whomever wants to follow their footsteps and work at NASA?
And also, supposedly, only women’s info were removed. Did they also remove the bio of men?
It is pretty standard practice. For one, it helps people who read or review your work know who they are dealing with. For another, it helps the general public understand who scientists are. Part of the mission is to make sure that the next generation carries the work on, and by emphasizing the human aspect of the science, young people can actually imagine themselves getting to that point some day.
I thought my dad would have come around by now with everything going on. Last night he was gloating about how much work is getting done in the White House and how everything’s about to get a lot cheaper.
Insanity.
I mean, that’s the real trump derangement syndrome. People who are outside of reality because of their support of the man.
You mean that?
Absolutely. In 2020 I asked the biggest trump supporter I know if he was better off then or four years ago. It’s not the fairest question, but I knew that then. There’s a lot of circumstances that effect it.
In 2020 he had no job (for years), was living with his mother, and swore he was keeping track of his “debt” with her that totalled in the tens of thousands. In 2016 he had a job, and had his own apartment. He said he was doing better in 2020.
In 2024 he had a higher paying job than he ever had before, and had bought a house. I didn’t ask him the question though. I was pretty sure I knew what he would say. He did say he was glad RFK would make us label our food … As he was drinking a soda that had the ingredients labeled, like most of our food.(Oh or is it the “natural and artificial ingredient” secret recipe crap that’s killing us that you still can see on the label and avoid, and not the high fructose corn syrup with 120 percent your daily allotment?)
I’d say that’s detaching from reality when politics get concerned.
Lol. You doubt it?!
Then, you should challenge him and make him set a deadline for when everything is supposed to be a lot cheaper. When people starts to get sidetracked from thinking critically, that’s when you need to make them set an ultimatum that either forces them to think critically, or make them set their own limit that you can then point back to later.
That only works for people who haven’t taught themselves to ignore constant cognitive dissonance.
His only concern is himself, he thinks he’ll benefit so everyone else can suffer as far as he is concerned. This is the broad motivation of the entire movement. As if America first didn’t make it obvious enough, it was really “me first”. What they don’t understand is how the me in that is entirely relative and they quickly become expendable.
maybe if you explain to him the cause of the great depression being isolationist economic policy hitting everyone really hard, meanwhile japan with its keynesian policy managed to do pretty well, even in the face of global economic downturn.
Some people find facts more reasonable, ironically, even if they will cognitively dissonant themselves from them.
Same with my Mom. I told her “yeah, Mussolini did a good job making the trains run on time”. She never responded.
(Beside the point, but Mussolini totally did not run an efficient train network, it was a cluster fuck like everything else he did)
im pretty sure that’s the exact implication being made lol
Yeah but if they knew enough to know that they wouldn’t be voting Republican.
evidently they still did, cognitive dissonance is a hell of a thing.
wait until everything gets a lot more expensive, and then ask him what happened lmao
make it real for your dad - every chance you get, capture the price of a few things and chart it out over time… actual real evidence that you collected yourself is harder to refute than a graph produced by anonymous sources online.
He’ll just deny it and ultimately get angry.
Ask your dad why the GOP needs to raise the Debt Ceiling by $4 Trillion in their budget bill, and how many of the now dozens of lawsuits Trump might win based on his performance in 2020 when he lost almost every single court case, even when Trump appointed the judges himself.
I tried that with someone on facebook. They retreated back to “we have to get federal spending under control.” Maybe so, but this group isn’t doing that.
And we do. Only people unaware of the problem aren’t worked about it.
But these people seem unable to parse tough choices and bad choices.
I can’t wait to talk to my parents. Lifelong republicans (though not specifically trump fans, just voting R), so it’s extremely likely they voted for this.
I’m a federal employee. They voted to put my job (and my wife’s job) in jeopardy. They voted for this. They voted to hurt us.
I will feel mad as fuck for you and use this as evidence when people say these EOs aren’t hurting anyone other than illegal immigrants.
This isn’t a science meme
You shouldn’t care and want justice instead
They want something not that different from the Taliban. Subservient women existing only to make and raise kids.
Americans doing something americanly in america: “what are we, a bunch of asians?”
Project 2025…
2025realitycheck.com - please review, and if you’re able go to the GitHub link at the bottom and help me fill everything out!
She sounds kind of sexist. Why does it matter what sex she is? Shouldn’t everyone be treated equally regardless of sex?
To get people trested equally, you need to apply positive bias towards women whom would otherwise be treated unfairly by the current systemic biases.
Oh geez that would be great wouldn’t it. But it sounds like you’ve never had some tell you that you can’t do something because of your sex. Highlighting successful minorities in a field inspires and encourages others in their same position.
She does not sound sexist. She sounds justifiably upset that the organization she works for and clearly loves is trying to erase her her involvement in it just because she is a woman.
I’m sorry… she sounds sexist because when she talked about the article on her at nasa she mentioned… her dreams… her being raised poor… her being homeless… and… her getting a job at Nasa despite all that. Huh oh wait weird I missed the part where she made it all about her being a woman? because… she didn’t even do that? She wasn’t even highlighting that she is important as a role model to women in STEM. Didn’t even mention it in the part discussing the article that was erased. She was highlighting being a role model of achieving her dream job even though she was poor and homeless at one point. And was simply pointing out that it is being erased BECAUSE she is a woman. and you are calling HER sexist? Are you high? Can you read? You just enter a fugue state when you see the word women and make shit up that didn’t happen so you can feel better about yourself? Cuz I’m super confused how you can get sexist from what she said without just assuming she’s sexist because she is a woman.
Can you please explain what about this sounds kind of sexist to you? We are very confused.
The irony of posting this in the context of someone who had been effaced specifically because of their sex is overpowering.
Wow.
You have so consistently dehumanized the women in your life that this statement actually makes sense to you? Like, it’s pretty well known that women are a minority in STEM fields. What the hell you so afraid of, that celebrating a woman’s accomplishments offense you so???
Maybe stop trying to gain power over other human beings. Cause the path you’re currently on? You fucking know where it leads. And no, dragging others down will never change the hellscape of fear and paranoia you have found. You have to walk out of the valley of despair; there is no other escape.
I hope you aren’t assuming I’m a man, are you misgendering me?
I hope you realize that is irrelevant…?
Like, completely.
lol this is all you have to say for yourself. gtfo
Gods, this old chestnut… Hey, on behalf of the Trans-Non-binary community can we retire this please? Not because it’s offensive, it isn’t, we just heard it more on average and it was always just bland weak sause shit. Reseting the clock on this boring ass joke from reddit five years ago is cringe. You wanna troll somebody at least make an effort greater than “I know you are but what am I?!”
Wait, I can’t find the order that says to do this. Can someone please link me?
A lot of this was internal and will only be seen in documentaries down the road… if there will even be a road
The aliens might make a documentary when they come visit the ruins someday.
The order to end dei in government positions. Women are included in diversity equity and inclusion. Nasa is a government agency, so it makes sense. Is it good? Absolutely not, just the wacky world we have to live in.
Cancel culture ain’t so much fun when it happens to you, is it.
Actually, this situation isn’t about cancel culture at all. Cancel culture typically refers to public backlash resulting in personal or professional consequences for offensive or harmful behavior. What happened here seems to be a systemic decision to remove content highlighting women in STEM at NASA.
This isn’t driven by public outcry or social pressure; it’s a form of institutional erasure. There’s a big difference between being held accountable for harmful actions and having your achievements wiped out due to a policy change.
These two things shouldn’t be conflated.
I think you are misinformed about the nature of cancel culture — it was always a government program. Those mass account purges on Twitter over COVID “misinformation”, for instance, happened explicitly at the behest of the Biden administration. It was not at all the result of public outcry.
Also, many of the claims that were made (such as the lab leak theory) did, in fact, turn out to be true.
On Cancel Culture: The term “cancel culture” typically refers to public backlash leading to personal or professional consequences for perceived offensive behavior. In the case of the NASA bio removal, it appears to be an internal policy decision, not a result of public outcry.
On Government Influence and Social Media: While there have been instances where government entities have interacted with social media platforms regarding content moderation—such as the Biden administration’s efforts to curb COVID-19 misinformation—this differs from “cancel culture.” These actions involve governmental attempts to manage public health information, which has sparked debates about free speech and censorship.
On the Lab Leak Theory: The origins of COVID-19 have been extensively debated. Agencies like the FBI and the Department of Energy have assessed, with varying degrees of confidence, that a lab leak is a plausible origin. However, this remains a separate issue from the NASA bio removal and the broader discussion of cancel culture.
Bringing up these points seems to divert from the initial discussion about the removal of a NASA bio highlighting a woman’s achievements in STEM. It’s essential to distinguish between institutional decisions, public backlash, and government policies.
Take your weak attempt at trolling somewhere else.
Sadly, that stooge isn’t even self aware enough to realize it’s trolling. Which makes feeding trolls so, just, tedious these days. No fun in it at all!! 😡
Huh. The only possible reason to conflate cancel culture with erasure is if you’re such a shit person with truly deplorable views that being forced to just fucking be polite feels like an attack on your person.
Everyone knows the dog whistle involved here, buddy.
I don’t think I follow that train of thought. What do you think cancel culture was except the systematic erasure of people with “undesirable” viewpoints?
Duh. Not being allowed to do offensive shit without consequence is obviously upsetting to you. So, yeah, of course you didn’t follow a train of thought that includes common decency.
I think actions have consequences. I think a person who has any actual courage will accept that fact. What, do you think bigotry and prejudice shouldn’t be “undesirable”? What, you afraid of just…not being an ass???
Okay, so instead of focusing on making solid arguments, you been spending much of your time on name calling and insulting my intelligence instead. Is that what you consider common decency? Or should there be consequences for that?
Seems like a clear violation of rule 1 of this forum: “Don’t throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.”
Oh go cry yourself a river to drown in.
Yeah, no shit I’m not “debating in good faith”. Duh. Why the fuck would I bother?? Like, seriously, there’s nothing clever in that “asking questions” approach.
And, if you’re gonna cry about ‘solid arguments’, fund one yourself. Facts don’t care about your feelings, remember???
Deleting the record of a women’s scientific achievements isn’t the same as firing (or declining to renew a contract) of someone who’s falsifying test results or just being an ass.
I wonder which person you’re actually referring to. Have a few names we can “peer review”?
False equivalence. Firing someone for saying racist shit isnt the same a removing a person from a website because she is a woman.
Indeed, firing someone seems like a much more drastic measure, and as far as we can tell from the OP, Rose still has her job.
Also, this page about Women at NASA, which contains literally hundreds of articles about female scientists’ achievements there has apparently not been deleted, so this doesn’t look like some sort of systemic erasure to me. Perhaps her profile was simply deleted by mistake?
I tried clicking a bunch of them just to make sure they’re not all dead links, and so far I haven’t hit any 404s.
yahoo.com/…/page-page-disappearing-government-mil…
Thousands went offline
abcnews.go.com/…/judge-tells-agencies-restore-web…
They were forced to start bringing some back
this isn’t cancel culture though, this is culling culture.
Get your Gus already guy, what are you waiting for?
I’m sure threads won’t remove your posts
It’s owned by Meta, so it might ¯_(ツ)_/¯
That was the joke.
USPol toxic spill again
Yes, any servant of capital is highly disposable - especially working in the MIC.