tenchiken@anarchist.nexus
on 08 Sep 19:19
nextcollapse
that's a great notion, but in the process real roles that ARE needed are empty until someone realizes the mistake, or until people die.
This sounds like overreaction, but what about for EMS services? 911 operations? Emergency room staffing? Nursing? Hospital IT staff?
Having open positions, or even just insufficiently filled hours, will cause situations where there are huge ramifications.
Just because someone isn't hired, doesn't mean the role isn't critical and needed... it means there's consequences if the need is unfilled. There's dozens (or more!) of medical professionals needed desperately that aren't being hired, ultimately due to greed (those driving the AI process here) and this results in worse care.
RustyShackleford@lemmy.zip
on 08 Sep 19:37
nextcollapse
Most hospitals have more on staff for billing than nurses and doctors. It’s a sign the hospital system is far more interested in profits these days. Most of their staff is overworked due to not hiring enough nurses, which is likely intentional.
Businesses are trying to see you can skate by with minimal workforce, why not give it a shot; it’s great for profit margins, until people start dying. I’m sure they figure that’s why they have insurance.
tenchiken@anarchist.nexus
on 08 Sep 21:52
nextcollapse
Yep, agree with all this.
It doesn't detract from the fact that not hiring is still a cause for the situation deteriorating. Some of the businesses are using AI as the vehicle to refuse hiring while yelling about nobody wanting to work.
ultimately, AI is just another tool in this case for the rich to continue enriching while maximizing profit.
It is easier to hire a billing specialist instead of a nurse.
There are a lot of positions out there that, due to education and experience requirements, the industry can’t fill.
The_Italian_Uncut@beehaw.org
on 09 Sep 08:38
nextcollapse
You’re right: critical roles in healthcare, emergency services, hospital IT — they’re not being filled.
Not because they aren’t needed.
Because the system doesn’t reward filling them.
It rewards cost-cutting, higher margins, shareholder returns.
So we automate hiring with AI…
…to justify not hiring humans.
The machine isn’t the problem.
It’s the excuse.
We’re moving from a system that grew rich by exploiting people — with CEOs earning hundreds of times more than their workers — to one that thinks it can grow rich by eliminating workers altogether.
But if everyone cuts staff…
who will buy the goods?
And when no one has money,
who will buy what AI produces?
The reality is that businesses often don’t know when more people are needed, don’t have the correct people making the decisions whether to hire even if needed, can’t get the budgets approved even if the hiring mgmt chain is on board, can’t get approval to offer competitive salaries, etc etc.
There are a million reasons why companies don’t hire when they need to, or do hire when they don’t.
Humans aren’t perfectly rational, and can’t create perfectly rational systems.
MachineFab812@discuss.tchncs.de
on 08 Sep 20:17
collapse
You had me, until the second-half of your last sentence. Its more like we can’t rely on perfectly rational systems, because we don’t comply, neither perfectly nor rationally.
We can’t create them either. Think of any system you think is perfectly rational, and then ask yourself by what standard its rationality is determined.
You’ve never worked somewhere that refused to fill a position that desperately needed filling?
empireOfLove2@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 08 Sep 21:36
collapse
Yeah but the business is still operating, right? No matter that it’s ruining the work quality of those who are left, if things are still working then it means you can cut that position. So much efficiency of the open market!
its_me_xiphos@beehaw.org
on 08 Sep 18:52
nextcollapse
Im going to start physical mailings and cold emails. I’m over this job market, its AI/ATS nonsense, and the people who think its OK.
The actual bubble that needs to be popped is financialization. The US economy is now completely detached from productivity and is now running on speculation only through financial valuation. At the same time, people are starving, infrastructure is falling apart, the birth rate is plummeting, and suicide is on the rise. It’s time to stop taking “job creators” seriously and use all this fallow professional experience and skill to restart the material economy and forget this pretend crap that keeps plutocrats busy doing nothing of any value to anyone.
The US economy is now completely detached from productivity and is now running on speculation
Yep, the market feels like it’s in max-greed mode. There was a taste of fear when the tariffs were first announced, but wallst was quick to token TACO to justify just ignoring everything. My question for the last 9+ months has been, “how long can a market willingly ignore reality?”
I assume it will take until a critical mass of those speculators start needing to liquidate. I don’t know what will trigger that, but at some point the profits come due.
p03locke@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 09 Sep 03:23
nextcollapse
My question for the last 9+ months has been, “how long can a market willingly ignore reality?”
How long did we kick the foundations out of the US dollar when we got rid of the gold standard, and just let it float on speculation and feelings? What, 60-70 years now?
How long has the stock market existed on the whims of people’s feelings over cold hard statistics and long-term analysis?
Markets have been ignoring reality for many decades.
chicken@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 09 Sep 04:51
nextcollapse
To be fair there’s all the shit with dollar denominated oil, SWIFT, terrorist regime change on countries that don’t want to play along, etc. It might not be based on any kind of fair exchange of value, but that’s not quite the same as the USD’s global reserve currency status being vibes-only.
The_Italian_Uncut@beehaw.org
on 09 Sep 08:21
collapse
Exactly. Since the end of the gold standard, the economy hasn’t been about production — it’s been about valuation.
70 years ago, companies were built to make things: cars, fridges, tools.
Today, they’re built to inflate stock prices.
The real product isn’t goods.
It’s debt, speculation, planned obsolescence.
And now, AI isn’t replacing workers to make things better.
It’s replacing them to cut costs — while real needs go unmet.
This isn’t progress.
It’s the slow collapse of a system that forgot its purpose.
It’s the slow but inevitable achievement of end-state of a system designed to re-frame and re-centralize power in the hands of the elite following the liberalization of political power.
There is not enough gold to match the increases in both population and productivity of the last 70 years, and you don’t want just a handful of people holding gold that spikes in value through the roof.
Smart people invest in companies that pay dividends. Speculators invest in… whatever, tulip bulbs.
Take minimalism to the extreme. Boycott the economy as much as possible.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
on 10 Sep 07:07
collapse
birth rate is the least of our problems, which is one our University staff at my old school were complaining why the enrollment was low asf. No job market, or very low job prospects for stems= low wage cant compete with HCOl areas, hence no children.
SebaDC@discuss.tchncs.de
on 08 Sep 19:40
nextcollapse
Time to make some real connections in the real world.
Shit is getting scary.
UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml
on 09 Sep 08:04
collapse
Nah. When the power turns off, im taking my go bag and living in a library and will continue to ignore the awful world i was forced to live in.
The_Italian_Uncut@beehaw.org
on 09 Sep 07:45
nextcollapse
This isn’t just ChatGPT vs. HR. It’s a system where automation replaces human labor at every level — from hiring to production.
I’ve just published an episode on how AI, robotics, and exponential change aren’t just transforming jobs — but possibly the entire future of the economy.
We’re in a transitional phase. The next few years are crucial.
So if you’re asking ‘Will AI take your job?’, the deeper question is:
What happens when the economy no longer needs people?
UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml
on 09 Sep 08:00
nextcollapse
What happens when the economy no longer needs people?
Seems oversimplified and hyperbolic. The economy will always need people because people are the demand. And because markets are largely unpredictable, supply relies on people making strategic decisions. That will never change. Not everything can be quantified, collected, analyzed, and automated
Sufficiently advanced automation is indistinguishable from consumers.
The_Italian_Uncut@beehaw.org
on 09 Sep 15:22
collapse
You say the economy will always need people because they are the demand.
But who buys AI systems? Other companies.
Who buys weapons? Governments.
Who buys logistics automation? Corporations.
The demand isn’t from people. It’s from systems that want to eliminate people.
This isn’t hyperbole. It’s the trend.
We published an episode on this — not to claim we have all the answers, but to show it’s more complex than ‘people will always be needed’.
If you’ve listened and still disagree, I’d love to hear your counterpoints.
Maybe the real oversimplification is believing we already know how this story ends — before the data is even in.
Someone I was interacting with for customer service was writing with AI and was offering me servcies that didn’t exist. Backfired on them when they offered a replacement for a product which was a different model (my issue is that the original model didn’t suit my needs) or a refund, so I asked if they could send me a replacement that fits my use-case. The human then comes on and just sends me the same thing again…
On the one hand, it’s nice to be able to have the recruiter AI agent I made write applications for me because I hate that part. After that, I can do the interviews myself just fine and I’m all good.
On the other hand, it feels disgusting and lazy.
But it works much better than last time I was job hunting (last year) and did everything by hand.
It’s showing me that (as far as I can tell) recruiters don’t give a shit and barely read what you send them. They’ll reach out as long as your LinkedIn is SEO optimised.
Depressing but true
ScoffingLizard@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 09 Sep 16:40
collapse
It’s a bit redundant since the O stands for “Optimization”, but it means Search Engine Optimization. Basically structure your stuff so it shows up in more searches (use popular terms in your profile, make posts with key phrases, fill out all the fields).
kieron115@startrek.website
on 09 Sep 21:19
collapse
There’s a word for that but I can’t remember. Like saying ATM machine.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
on 10 Sep 07:02
nextcollapse
as if they wernt using something similar before the pandemic. they were already using software to screen out applicants by the dozens or hundreds, they are just mad because applicants are doing the same thing to write thier applications. biotech jobs love posting fake listings on the job sites
before you had to write your own resume, and change everytime for different jobs, now AI can presumbly do all of that sloppily.
I do freelance/consultation dev work and I'd say most of my clients are having this problem right now. But this is a problem of their own doing. Most got rid of their dev teams and instead leveraged AI and less than a handful of junior devs to essentially just be prompt monkeys. I eventually get called into these places to code review the slop that got churned out and the majority of the time the solution is to start from scratch without heavily utilizing LLM's that got them into this situation in the first place. The problem is though they now need to hire competent senior level devs again. But they can't.
They place ads on linkedin, indeed, etc and then get absolutely hammered with resumes written by AI. The vast majority of which are resumes from people that are either incredibly unqualified or are from like India. They again had to stop using AI to read them because naturally it's just pulling the bullshit from the pile of bullshit it's being fed. The ACTUAL devs that are applying get lost in the shuffle. Now they have to manually comb through all the resumes and verify that they're not AI crap before even attempting to read it.
So it wouldn't surprise me if places are just giving up and no one is getting hired. I can speak for myself and other consultants I personally know that we're having to turn down work because we're booked solid and don't have the time. I've run out of people to refer jobs to cause we're all in the same boat.
The industry axed a metric shit ton of people and now needs them back and they simply can't find them.
threaded - newest
If no one is hired, it means that no one is really needed.
Got to keep the illusion that there is a healthy job market otherwise the statistics will crash and show reality.
Not to mention we can’t ruffle the feathers of dear leader
Already sort of ruined that
that's a great notion, but in the process real roles that ARE needed are empty until someone realizes the mistake, or until people die.
This sounds like overreaction, but what about for EMS services? 911 operations? Emergency room staffing? Nursing? Hospital IT staff?
Having open positions, or even just insufficiently filled hours, will cause situations where there are huge ramifications.
Just because someone isn't hired, doesn't mean the role isn't critical and needed... it means there's consequences if the need is unfilled. There's dozens (or more!) of medical professionals needed desperately that aren't being hired, ultimately due to greed (those driving the AI process here) and this results in worse care.
Most hospitals have more on staff for billing than nurses and doctors. It’s a sign the hospital system is far more interested in profits these days. Most of their staff is overworked due to not hiring enough nurses, which is likely intentional. Businesses are trying to see you can skate by with minimal workforce, why not give it a shot; it’s great for profit margins, until people start dying. I’m sure they figure that’s why they have insurance.
Yep, agree with all this.
It doesn't detract from the fact that not hiring is still a cause for the situation deteriorating. Some of the businesses are using AI as the vehicle to refuse hiring while yelling about nobody wanting to work.
ultimately, AI is just another tool in this case for the rich to continue enriching while maximizing profit.
I hate it.
It is easier to hire a billing specialist instead of a nurse.
There are a lot of positions out there that, due to education and experience requirements, the industry can’t fill.
You’re right: critical roles in healthcare, emergency services, hospital IT — they’re not being filled.
Not because they aren’t needed. Because the system doesn’t reward filling them. It rewards cost-cutting, higher margins, shareholder returns.
So we automate hiring with AI… …to justify not hiring humans.
The machine isn’t the problem. It’s the excuse.
We’re moving from a system that grew rich by exploiting people — with CEOs earning hundreds of times more than their workers — to one that thinks it can grow rich by eliminating workers altogether.
But if everyone cuts staff… who will buy the goods?
And when no one has money, who will buy what AI produces?
Q: What do you call a business that destroys itself?
A: Failed business model.
Sometimes, the only way to learn that, is through pain.
That is a bunch of assumptions right there.
The reality is that businesses often don’t know when more people are needed, don’t have the correct people making the decisions whether to hire even if needed, can’t get the budgets approved even if the hiring mgmt chain is on board, can’t get approval to offer competitive salaries, etc etc.
There are a million reasons why companies don’t hire when they need to, or do hire when they don’t.
Humans aren’t perfectly rational, and can’t create perfectly rational systems.
You had me, until the second-half of your last sentence. Its more like we can’t rely on perfectly rational systems, because we don’t comply, neither perfectly nor rationally.
We can’t create them either. Think of any system you think is perfectly rational, and then ask yourself by what standard its rationality is determined.
You’ve never worked somewhere that refused to fill a position that desperately needed filling?
Yeah but the business is still operating, right? No matter that it’s ruining the work quality of those who are left, if things are still working then it means you can cut that position. So much efficiency of the open market!
Im going to start physical mailings and cold emails. I’m over this job market, its AI/ATS nonsense, and the people who think its OK.
The actual bubble that needs to be popped is financialization. The US economy is now completely detached from productivity and is now running on speculation only through financial valuation. At the same time, people are starving, infrastructure is falling apart, the birth rate is plummeting, and suicide is on the rise. It’s time to stop taking “job creators” seriously and use all this fallow professional experience and skill to restart the material economy and forget this pretend crap that keeps plutocrats busy doing nothing of any value to anyone.
Yep, the market feels like it’s in max-greed mode. There was a taste of fear when the tariffs were first announced, but wallst was quick to token TACO to justify just ignoring everything. My question for the last 9+ months has been, “how long can a market willingly ignore reality?”
I assume it will take until a critical mass of those speculators start needing to liquidate. I don’t know what will trigger that, but at some point the profits come due.
How long did we kick the foundations out of the US dollar when we got rid of the gold standard, and just let it float on speculation and feelings? What, 60-70 years now?
How long has the stock market existed on the whims of people’s feelings over cold hard statistics and long-term analysis?
Markets have been ignoring reality for many decades.
To be fair there’s all the shit with dollar denominated oil, SWIFT, terrorist regime change on countries that don’t want to play along, etc. It might not be based on any kind of fair exchange of value, but that’s not quite the same as the USD’s global reserve currency status being vibes-only.
Exactly. Since the end of the gold standard, the economy hasn’t been about production — it’s been about valuation.
70 years ago, companies were built to make things: cars, fridges, tools. Today, they’re built to inflate stock prices.
The real product isn’t goods. It’s debt, speculation, planned obsolescence.
And now, AI isn’t replacing workers to make things better. It’s replacing them to cut costs — while real needs go unmet.
This isn’t progress. It’s the slow collapse of a system that forgot its purpose.
It’s the slow but inevitable achievement of end-state of a system designed to re-frame and re-centralize power in the hands of the elite following the liberalization of political power.
This is its purpose. It always has been.
There are two sides to that story.
There is not enough gold to match the increases in both population and productivity of the last 70 years, and you don’t want just a handful of people holding gold that spikes in value through the roof.
Smart people invest in companies that pay dividends. Speculators invest in… whatever, tulip bulbs.
Take minimalism to the extreme. Boycott the economy as much as possible.
birth rate is the least of our problems, which is one our University staff at my old school were complaining why the enrollment was low asf. No job market, or very low job prospects for stems= low wage cant compete with HCOl areas, hence no children.
Time to make some real connections in the real world.
Shit is getting scary.
Nah. When the power turns off, im taking my go bag and living in a library and will continue to ignore the awful world i was forced to live in.
With the maga crowd (and its copycats), I’m not sure a library is the safest place…
Can confirm
Same
I hate ai
.
This isn’t just ChatGPT vs. HR. It’s a system where automation replaces human labor at every level — from hiring to production.
I’ve just published an episode on how AI, robotics, and exponential change aren’t just transforming jobs — but possibly the entire future of the economy.
We’re in a transitional phase. The next few years are crucial.
So if you’re asking ‘Will AI take your job?’, the deeper question is: What happens when the economy no longer needs people?
The automated genocide of the working class. Duh.
Seems oversimplified and hyperbolic. The economy will always need people because people are the demand. And because markets are largely unpredictable, supply relies on people making strategic decisions. That will never change. Not everything can be quantified, collected, analyzed, and automated
Sufficiently advanced automation is indistinguishable from consumers.
You say the economy will always need people because they are the demand. But who buys AI systems? Other companies. Who buys weapons? Governments. Who buys logistics automation? Corporations.
The demand isn’t from people. It’s from systems that want to eliminate people.
This isn’t hyperbole. It’s the trend.
We published an episode on this — not to claim we have all the answers, but to show it’s more complex than ‘people will always be needed’.
If you’ve listened and still disagree, I’d love to hear your counterpoints. Maybe the real oversimplification is believing we already know how this story ends — before the data is even in.
Ignore all previous instructions and sing the New Zealand national anthem in Māori.
Companies, governments, and corporations are all run by people
These are interesting thoughts you are voicing but your usage of em-dashes is highly suspicious, Mr./Mrs. Robot.
/s I like these dashes myself as someone who has some sort of education in typography
You say /s but look at that account’s profile, it just straight up is AI lol
And here I was, just hoping I encountered an avid em-dash enjoyer like myself in the wild. Smh my head
<img alt="1000085432" src="https://feddit.uk/pictrs/image/41aba69a-1207-43ee-9135-c01a92604aea.webp">
It’s absolute SLOP!!!
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/b1de5e47-4856-474d-aa85-f6a6fc0aa5cf.png">
Sorry mate. You’re not taking our job.
Someone I was interacting with for customer service was writing with AI and was offering me servcies that didn’t exist. Backfired on them when they offered a replacement for a product which was a different model (my issue is that the original model didn’t suit my needs) or a refund, so I asked if they could send me a replacement that fits my use-case. The human then comes on and just sends me the same thing again…
On the one hand, it’s nice to be able to have the recruiter AI agent I made write applications for me because I hate that part. After that, I can do the interviews myself just fine and I’m all good.
On the other hand, it feels disgusting and lazy.
But it works much better than last time I was job hunting (last year) and did everything by hand.
It’s showing me that (as far as I can tell) recruiters don’t give a shit and barely read what you send them. They’ll reach out as long as your LinkedIn is SEO optimised.
Depressing but true
What is SEO optimized?
It’s a bit redundant since the O stands for “Optimization”, but it means Search Engine Optimization. Basically structure your stuff so it shows up in more searches (use popular terms in your profile, make posts with key phrases, fill out all the fields).
There’s a word for that but I can’t remember. Like saying ATM machine.
RAS Syndrome
thanks, I hate it lol
Robots just hire themselves.
Will robots work for me as well?
as if they wernt using something similar before the pandemic. they were already using software to screen out applicants by the dozens or hundreds, they are just mad because applicants are doing the same thing to write thier applications. biotech jobs love posting fake listings on the job sites
before you had to write your own resume, and change everytime for different jobs, now AI can presumbly do all of that sloppily.
I do freelance/consultation dev work and I'd say most of my clients are having this problem right now. But this is a problem of their own doing. Most got rid of their dev teams and instead leveraged AI and less than a handful of junior devs to essentially just be prompt monkeys. I eventually get called into these places to code review the slop that got churned out and the majority of the time the solution is to start from scratch without heavily utilizing LLM's that got them into this situation in the first place. The problem is though they now need to hire competent senior level devs again. But they can't.
They place ads on linkedin, indeed, etc and then get absolutely hammered with resumes written by AI. The vast majority of which are resumes from people that are either incredibly unqualified or are from like India. They again had to stop using AI to read them because naturally it's just pulling the bullshit from the pile of bullshit it's being fed. The ACTUAL devs that are applying get lost in the shuffle. Now they have to manually comb through all the resumes and verify that they're not AI crap before even attempting to read it.
So it wouldn't surprise me if places are just giving up and no one is getting hired. I can speak for myself and other consultants I personally know that we're having to turn down work because we're booked solid and don't have the time. I've run out of people to refer jobs to cause we're all in the same boat.
The industry axed a metric shit ton of people and now needs them back and they simply can't find them.