Technically it possible with using windows server edition ,clean no bloatware ,minimum processes
Legally cost a lot not available for usual users only in crack way
omgboom@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 07 Oct 00:29
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While yes, licensing them is a bitch, but a terminal server is a viable option
Honestly I’m using Windows Enterprise. Local accounts, GPOs to get rid of all the telemetry and other bullshit. Never seen an ad in the start menu or any other place. Just nice clean windows. Basically it’s what companies use so that Microsoft doesn’t piss them off.
DarkSirrush@piefed.ca
on 07 Oct 04:02
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I wish the IT company we work with used enterprise edition, instead I have to deal with a ton of fuckery that is professional edition in an org with 50 employees, and I do not have the schooling necessary to take over fully.
Really wish we could just ditch windows altogether every time I find another computer that is using a local login instead of an AD login because they couldn’t be bothered to set shit up properly
Well I tried exactly server edition and for me it would be the best one edition comparing with all modern windows very few network requests only security updates ,predictable behavior of system,start up and shut down of system during 6 seconds.I tested on thinkpad t430 windown server 2025 ,CPU literally chilling 0-5% usage in idle
The Enterprise/IoT SKUs, which of course include LTSC, still let you use a local account, for now…
I won’t be surprised if they plug that at some point way down the line too though given they’re already playing with Windows on the Cloud in the enterprise sector.
I would be surprised if they force the requirement on LTSC.
I could believe they force it into enterprise licensing, but LTSC’s whole deal is that the environment doesn’t change and only gets security patches. It’s made to be used in kiosks, CNC controllers and the like. Machines that are supposed perform one task reliably.
This is also the reason it’s the best version of Windows for the desktop, and why Microsoft makes it so challenging to acquire licences.
gh0stcassette@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 09 Oct 02:10
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Who gives a shit about Windows licenses though, windows is obscenely easy to pirate
In OOBE, go through MS account creation. Tell it you were born today. It’ll let you set a password for the MS account before rejecting you due to COPA requirements. At this point, you can make an offline account without having even created an MS account, let alone having to use one.
This will not go away - it’s a legal thing. MS doesn’t want to deal with COPA stuff for very young kids, so this flow exists. Enjoy.
If that actually becomes a thing people do, that could prompt MS to start to require either submitting to a face scan or showing some government ID just to install Windows, though, if the way Google’s handling KYC on YT if your account gets flagged as underage, and soon Android app dev, as well as KYC going out across other sites, is any indication.
I’m pretty sure having to KYC just to install an OS is the last thing people want right now.
Let them. The entire world is slowly migrating to Mac and Linux. I haven’t even had the option of windows at my last 3 jobs. (To be fair, I’ve never had the option of desktop Linux, but this last one said pick a computer—I’m not positive that they would’ve balked at Linux.) That said, idk what’s so great about Mac over Linux, but I guess it’s not corporate friendly.
I’m trying to think of which MS products we even have in our ecosystem. Office, I guess. Corporate world will never wean themselves off of Excel.
CatsGoMOW@lemmy.world
on 08 Oct 00:54
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“The entire world” lol. I applaud your optimism.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:15
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The entire world is slowly migrating to Mac and Linux.
have a look at the steam hardware survey results or basically any other statistics and see that it’s not the case.
There are plenty that will boot/install Linux just fine but won’t do a nice clean install of Windows 11.
Modern Thinkpad E16 (AMD) is one of them, a clean USB won’t work, it will always stick at not finding required drivers.
You need to inevitably create a USB install from the MS USB Media Creation tool, running on the machine itself from the included crapware Windows - to get an installer USB that will work.
Different if you’re just pushing a wim over the network from endpoint/scm, but it’s basically broken for local users.
I would still get a ThinkPad, but then, I would never be putting Windows on it anyway.
anamethatisnt@sopuli.xyz
on 07 Oct 05:02
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Do you have more info regarding that ThinkPad E16?
I’m mostly working with T series laptops and haven’t had the problem, but always good to know if or when an E16 shows up.
Usually all ThinkPads work mostly the same regarding Linux support (bar the usual Nvidia driver shenanigans if you ever trip that), but I’d be concerned about the E-series themselves. If you want a cheaper than T-series ThinkPad you should get an L-series one. Not as expensive as the T-ones, but still retains some usable chassis durability, double replaceable memory slots, replaceable keyboard, etc.
I’ve started calling the E-series as E-waste.
jodanlime@midwest.social
on 07 Oct 11:52
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I had this issue at work, I was able to fix it by using the windows media creation tool instead of just writing the iso to the drive. Not sure why that worked, but it has every time so far.
gh0stcassette@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 09 Oct 01:58
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Just install it in a VM. I’ve done this before to force Windows 10 to install on a USB stick, you can pass a VM an entire physical drive to use instead of a virtual hard disk and install to that SSD directly from the VM (just kill the VM and reboot into the windows partition when the VM tries to reboot to the windows installation). I’m sure if you passed the VM a USB created with Rufus you could install from that as well.
What if they just ask your age as step 1 of the setup?
TachyonTele@piefed.social
on 07 Oct 02:18
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Same thing, that doesn’t change anything.
Lyra_Lycan@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 07 Oct 03:24
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This is the rule for any account or mobile game, too - if it asks your age before asking for consent to farm, put any age below 13. It’ll either not farm you because it’s illegal or it’ll kick you out. If the latter, good riddance really
FordBeeblebrox@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 05:43
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I’ve always done 1/1/1984 for obvious reasons but this is a good tip
My go to is to pop open the console and run “ipconfig /release” right before you create an account. Win 11 will have you set up a local account if you don’t have a network connection.
OOBE\BYPASSNRO has been off and on for me, but so far nuking the network connection has always worked for me. I’m setting up a few new computers tomorrow, it will be interesting to see what tricks still work.
Inconclusive. Re-used machines instead of new computers. Systems did have Windows 11 on them. OOBE\BypassNRO worked, but they may have pending updates.
Edit: one machine would not let me skip MS account sign in with OOBE\BypassNRO. IPConfig /Release immediately let me set up a local account.
“While these mechanisms were often used to bypass Microsoft account setup, they also inadvertently skip critical setup screens, potentially causing users to exit OOBE with a device that is not fully configured for use.”
Lol sure. If that was the real reason they’d simply let you create a local account. The audacious lying is just insulting.
cley_faye@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 07:50
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potentially causing users to exit OOBE with a device that is not fully configured for use
Oh no, onedrive not working or the office nagging screen missing in the start menu, how will we cope.
How will I survive without my doom dark ages ad in start menu and lock screen?
Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 07 Oct 12:35
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It’s not lying if what they mean by “not fully configured for use” is that the private data being captured and sent to their servers is not fully matched to a personal identity in their systems.
After all, they didn’t say whose “use” that device would not be configured for.
Still, if they were actually being honest, this would be easily solved if they showed those “critical setup screens” BEFORE asking to create the account, and based on what the user selected then they would allow (or not) the creation of a local account…
In theory Pluton enforcement platform-wide, which also includes forced SecureBoot without the ability to install user-signed keys, as well as OTA updates for that super-TPM, could block alt OSes on PC though.
Fortunately, Pluton never caught on and that hasn’t happened so far.
I’m gonna need an explanation how anything could prevent me from just formatting the drive and doing what I want, barring the use of proprietary hardware.
Forced SecureBoot with only MS keys and no way to install user-signed keys and no Linux shim would block non-Windows OSes from booting.
Basically, Pluton functions similar to how mobile devices function in terms of locked bootloaders.
AFAIK the only devices currently produced which actually use Pluton are Surface devices though, and if it’s not being implemented as intended, it’s just seen as a generic TPM by other OSes.
cley_faye@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 07:53
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Proprietary hardware, like opaque bioses that can only be updated with signed, proprietary blobs? The bios that’s in charge of picking something to boot from from storage? The bios that can decide which bootloader is allowed through digital signatures? The signatures that are only valid if their public key is registered in the bios? The proprietary, opaque bios that decide which bootloader’s signature is valid through keys it can restrict?
Yeah, it’s all coming together. Always has been. Joking aside, I’m still surprised this whole “fully locked bios” didn’t take off. And I’m glad for it.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:24
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I’m pretty sure that unless you use some unusual SBC, all your computer parts are proprietary hardware.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:27
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Fortunately, Pluton never caught on and that hasn’t happened so far.
I’m confused. don’t all recent AMD and intel CPUs have pluton included? I remember such an AMD announcement from ryzen 6000 and onwards, and for intel too
just give 'em time. it’s still a bit early in the game for that play
DoucheBagMcSwag@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 08 Oct 02:12
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In a few years If authoritarian shitholes keep fucking getting their way I can see using an “unverified/ untraceable OS” to be a “national security violation”
goatinspace@feddit.org
on 07 Oct 00:25
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It’s not really a big deal, unless you’re used to the freedom of Linux, which comes with it’s own issues. If M$ ever truly forces me into a corner, I’m out. And they won’t. Like Adobe allowing low-key piracy, they know they need the vast user base to remain relevant.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:28
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it is a big deal, because they are deceiving and taking advantage of so many people
What classes require windows? You can run most things in Linux. And for the cases where my classes had instructions on how to set up something on Windows, for Linux and MacOS they just had a foot note saying “You are on your own”. But nothing was mandatory.
Darkcoffee@sh.itjust.works
on 07 Oct 01:58
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“It would bypass critical steps…”
Which step is that, data collection? Shoving OneDrive down my throat by putting my Desktop in it with no way to easily remove it?
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
on 07 Oct 06:33
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collecting data, and training AI of course.
ImgurRefugee114@reddthat.com
on 07 Oct 02:14
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Switched to Linux full time at the start of 2025 and haven’t looked back. I fully intend to go the rest of my life without using windows again.
Same, I made the switch about 9 years ago when I was self-employed. Then I took a job with a small company running windows and it sucked. Now I’m 6 years in with my current, a mega corp, and they are all in on Microsoft. I’ve been so aggravated with the limitations of Microsoft products when I could get things done with a FOSS product in no time. Of course IT blocks FOSS installs because of corporate policy…🤬
ShutUp10 is awesome. I have sent them dog treats (donations) multiple times.
LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 07 Oct 03:06
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I despise that I have to use this OS at work. I would never run windows on my own computer again. Its just insanity. Next they’ll require a credit card to make a Microsoft account.
I could see them requiring government-issued ID. The age verification laws coming into effect in various states and countries make this a logical step for Microsoft. They might even start their own age verification service where you give them your ID and they vouch for your age with the sites you visit in Edge. Of course it would have the totally accidental side effect that everything you do on your computer could be monitored and legally tied to your identity.
I can add that in my experience, switching to Linux tends to have a positive impact on performance and keep the laptop usable for longer, I highly recommend you try it with your current laptop.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works
on 07 Oct 07:47
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I’ve got machines that are obsolete for even Windows 10 that run Linux just fine. The best time to start is now.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:01
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what desktop environment do you run there? I guess that machine does not have much ram, so it must be something memory efficient
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works
on 08 Oct 04:46
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I’ve got an old desktop with a Core I7 with a 3 digit model number and 12GB of DDR3 RAM, it’s running Mint Cinnamon. I’ve got a Lenovo x86 tablet thing with 8GB of RAM and a Pentium processor, it’s currently running Fedora GNOME. I’ve run Ubuntu MATE on a Pi 4 as a desktop PC for about a year.
Most distros of Linux will run very well on a machine that ever ran Windows 7 acceptably. Prior to that, you start running into the “we’re discontinuing 32-bit support” problem.
WhyJiffie@sh.itjust.works
on 09 Oct 01:42
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well I assumed your devices have 4 and such GB of RAM, but yeah at 8 GB memory efficiency is not a pressing problem.
like I have a laptop with 2 GB that runs windows 10 acceptably, there was a time when that was my main on-the-go setup. that memory is almost completely used up by just logging in to kde plasma. memory compression is of course not a choice with the cpu it has though
Im running cosmic desktop on arch, its actually very good! I have enabled automatic tiling of windows and its just super convenient. Like a tiling window manager but with all the stuff most people want built-in (top bar, notifications, screenshots, screen sharing etc).
You cant customize it as much as a real tiling window manager but if all you want is for your windows to tile, its awesome.
Not OP, but I have to keep one Windows PC around. My favorite mod for my favorite 20 year old 4x game will not run on Linux, even though the game itself will.
The rest of my PCs are running either Mint or Xubuntu.
far_university1990@reddthat.com
on 07 Oct 20:23
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Qemu vm not option? Try virt-manager or similar. If 20 year old game performance impact probably not bad.
far_university1990@reddthat.com
on 08 Oct 13:33
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Proton not virtual machine. Virtual machine emulate hardware for os to run like on pc. That also cause performance loss, but for 20 yo game probably not important.
I’m waiting for actual fire to start in my laptop before switching. I’ve had to do so many tricks to keep Win 7 going that I’m invested in keeping this thing going as long as possible. Plus all my porn is on it.
I doubt they’ll risk alienating their enterprise costumers, but sure, they could make IoT account-only.
In that case just switch to Linux already.
lazynooblet@lazysoci.al
on 07 Oct 05:53
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Is this about Windows Home edition? I don’t need to do anything hacky to get a local account but I also don’t use Home edition.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 06:01
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I installed windows 11 a dozen time at work (never at home) and I just click on “domain login”, it just creates a local account and then after the install I have to manually join the domain. No Microsoft account enforcement at all.
It’s regular Windows 11, not Enterprise, we are a small company.
But I’m wondering, this bypass is too easy, is it because it sees that the DNS server is also an active directory server, so it allows that, or the trick is that you tell him you want to join a domain?
Or maybe it’s a domain enrollment bug because we’re using samba 4 under Debian as active directory server and not Windows server/entra id/whatever they call it this month?
purplemonkeymad@programming.dev
on 07 Oct 06:35
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I don’t think they ever said they plan to require it for Windows Pro or above skus. It’s only home (you know the one business shouldn’t be using anyway) that they said they wanted to enforce it on.
They actually did a lot of mess with Pro as well. There has been a “watering down” of Pro since Windows 10 to make sure that they can still do their anticonsumer crap to users. I imagine they also are trying to push businesses to get Enterprise instead of picking up relatively easy/inexpensive Pro licenses.
ReallyActuallyFrankenstein@lemmynsfw.com
on 07 Oct 12:19
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I don’t know why it was so easy for you, but the last four Windows 11 machines I set up over the last two years definitely required increasingly complicated hacks just to not create an online account.
You need to have 11 Pro or better to domain join a computer.
Your computer would also need to be joined to your domain to allow the login, so there is definitely some config going on that is not available to the typical home user.
abbiistabbii@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 07 Oct 12:09
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This “subscription” mentality is ruining value for a lot of society but, holy shit, do you ever rake in those huge amounts of monthly cash, for very little work.
vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org
on 07 Oct 14:35
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It’s not our mentality, it’s their strategy.
Wars breed new strategies.
Sometimes it’s free trade as a carrot and embargo as a stick, like with, well, one can try to nail it to Napoleonic wars, but as old as life. Sometimes it’s mass production and standardization and ergonomics and scientific industrial design, one can try to nail these to WWII, but also as old as life. And sometimes it’s controlled escalation as a way to reach your goals without triggering nuclear response, which one can nail to the Cold War.
American strategy of the Cold War is being used against world markets, ladies and gentlemen. Together with the previous two strategies mentioned.
The Soviet one was the opposite, to try to make even the smallest transgression cause firmly the same response, so that controlled escalation wouldn’t work, but unfortunately one is founded in human psychology (plus game theory) and the other in rational knowledge (just game theory), the latter always loses. It was called scientific-technical revolution and meant literally its name - instead of gradual escalation, which favors the stronger side, you should create technical means to punch a fatal wound, nothing gradual.
So - the subscriptions themselves matter very little, they are just slowly transitioning everything big to dependence upon remote components available over the Internet.
It’s funny, actually, so much gradual work, and in the end it’ll be just wasted time - even making computers is not magic. State of the art processes could as well be that for most of humanity, but for many purposes Pentium MMX is a good enough computer, and such are not magic.
And especially making computer software of the kind that’s being “metropolized” like this is not magic. Most of it is complex simply because of legacy, backwards compatibility and as a barrier for competitors making alternative implementations.
I am horrified by what computers have become, from expensive magical tools to solve real problems, to ubiquitous shit-shoveling malware appliances controlled by some of the worst elements of society.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 07 Oct 16:49
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Those kinds of computers still exist, it’s called Linux.
tiramichu@sh.itjust.works
on 07 Oct 17:09
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I’ve never been more appreciative than I am now of the decades of effort that have gone into building this free and open-source operating system.
Imagine if we were here in 2025, with all the incumbent operating systems going to shit, but in a world where Linux didn’t exist and there was no alternative that wasn’t owned by a tech giant.
The alternative alternative existed before Linux and still exists today: BSD
In a world without Linus Torvalds, all those people who have devoted time and effort into Linux might well have found themselves working / hobbying in the BSD ecosystems instead.
I think it's almost certain that Linux's niche would have been taken by it. It worked for Apple, after all.
Or, who knows, maybe GNU Hurd might have become viable.
dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 18:51
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I find this alternate timeline incredibly likely. I had a friend in college who was all about SCO Unix back before they went evil, even when Slackware was the go-to distro. We would have a lot more BSD forks out here now, although NextStep (and maybe even OSX) would probably still emerge as one of the better commercial ones.
As an aside: what I find amusing is that Homebrew is basically BSD Ports, served from a git repo. In 2025, it’s a completely insane way to ship OS software to a single platform, but it does work.
tiramichu@sh.itjust.works
on 07 Oct 19:02
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Sure, if it wasn’t Linux then another project may have got the love and attention.
I’m not glad it was Linux specifically, just glad there is a credible FOSS alternative of some kind, and in our universe that’s Linux.
You might think there’s no such world where we wouldn’t have had some credible alternative, and as reasonable as that is - because freedom and independence are things people intrinsically want - I’m sure if you flap the butterfly wings enough times there’d be a universe where we all just collectively decided that commercial operating systems were the answer.
Glad I don’t live there.
WhiskyTangoFoxtrot@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 21:12
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Yeah. Look at the shitheap we had to settle with when Reddit enshittified beyond redemption. We’re really lucky to have such a well-polished alternative to Windows right now, and I think a lot of it boils down to the fact that Windows was awful from the beginning. If a halfway-decent operating system like OS/2 had become the default then we might be really scrambling right now.
gh0stcassette@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 09 Oct 01:53
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I mean, we already do live in that universe, just for the mobile space.
Well I paid for what I have, and no one is allowed to rob me of what I pay for so I’m good. Sorry Microsoft you don’t get to rob people any more than the rest of us. All it does is send people elsewhere.
FreeMindFreeAss@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 17:37
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All Microsoft had to do for Windows to remain the most popular home and office OS in the world for decades to come, was to just not fucking suck.
FreeMindFreeAss@lemmy.world
on 08 Oct 11:09
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Woahwoahwoah, let’s not be unrealistic here.
But honestly I’m happy for the final push to Linux. I’ve been telling myself to make the change for a few years now but what’s happening with AI training and side-loading / complete loss of privacy / general horrible vibes in the closed-source tech-sector… Linux it is. I’m even ready for the learning curve. I grew up on dos, I’m sure I can find my way around it.
boogiebored@lemmy.world
on 07 Oct 17:38
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Lol it’s been great getting off of Windows over the last few months.
I thought I would miss it, but Proton in Steam has been amazing on Ubuntu, with some exceptions (Stupid EA crap from skate. 2025).
Dual booting for now is OK, but gaming is pretty garbage anyway, so I will probably abandon Windows entirely soon. Definitely my last version of it. Feel so liberated having hobbies off computer anyway, and now using my computers with Ubuntu is actually enjoyable again instead of driving an expensive spy machine.
It shows as installable on Ubuntu in Steam, so I hilariously found out after installing Ubuntu and skate on my gf’s computer only to not be able to play it 😆
upgraded to 11 for free from win2k? dual boot linux and just running updates and rebooting the win11 every few months. paid $100 for win2k a long time ago. stupid giant passkey license, no thanks. got a free account and switched to digital at some point.
The workarounds people come up with to not make an MS account seem crazy to me. What difference does it really make if its a local account or not? You are still using windows so clearly you are ok with everything else, but the account is too much?
n1ck_n4m3@lemmy.world
on 08 Oct 14:53
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Using a Microsoft cloud account to log into my local computer means Microsoft owns credentials to a device in my house, and if they get hacked (which they do, all the fucking time), my device is less secure because of it and my data is less secure because of it.
There’s absolutely no need for my copy of Windows to require me to login using a cloud-based account.
You can use all manner of apps to disable the telemetry and privacy nonsense that people have issues with Windows about (and I similarly find Microsoft’s privacy-last approach to be tedious), but if your computer requires you to use a cloud account to log in, then your computer is susceptible to that cloud account being hijacked or hacked and Microsoft has given absolutely no good reason for this to be the case.
Logging in to a Microsoft account doesn’t provide any real benefit to the user at all, the best you can say is that you’re not prompted to log in again if you run the Microsoft Store or the Xbox app, and that’s not a compelling benefit.
JackbyDev@programming.dev
on 08 Oct 17:59
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Well, at least in 10, the username is something dumb and you can’t change it during creation (or everywhere easily after creation) when doing an online account. But linking after you create your account let you set it to whatever. So there may be people who are fine with online accounts but just want to set their usernames to whatever.
yukijoou@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 08 Oct 21:10
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I don’t have a personal Microsoft account, and have no desire to create one more account, but am required by my organisation to use 1 Windows-only software for 2 hours every week. As such, I run that in a Windows VM on my computer, and this doesn’t seem like it’d be worth the effort of making a MS account
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world
on 08 Oct 21:17
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I shouldn’t need to have an internet connection to login to my desktop.
threaded - newest
Don’t plug to many, otherwise people might start jumping ship!
just making it easier to act like they don’t even exist. I’ll never, EVER get an account for MY computer.
There’s no online accounts needed for Linux.
exactly
Same, I refuse to have my OS linked to anything other then a local account.
Especially since most email accounts now need cell phone numbers, and home addresses.
If I was still a solo sysadmin, today I would be reevaluating the feasibility of dumping Windows altogether.
Technically it possible with using windows server edition ,clean no bloatware ,minimum processes Legally cost a lot not available for usual users only in crack way
While yes, licensing them is a bitch, but a terminal server is a viable option
Honestly I’m using Windows Enterprise. Local accounts, GPOs to get rid of all the telemetry and other bullshit. Never seen an ad in the start menu or any other place. Just nice clean windows. Basically it’s what companies use so that Microsoft doesn’t piss them off.
I wish the IT company we work with used enterprise edition, instead I have to deal with a ton of fuckery that is professional edition in an org with 50 employees, and I do not have the schooling necessary to take over fully.
Really wish we could just ditch windows altogether every time I find another computer that is using a local login instead of an AD login because they couldn’t be bothered to set shit up properly
Well I tried exactly server edition and for me it would be the best one edition comparing with all modern windows very few network requests only security updates ,predictable behavior of system,start up and shut down of system during 6 seconds.I tested on thinkpad t430 windown server 2025 ,CPU literally chilling 0-5% usage in idle
One option is to install an older version and update after.
A better one is not use it because it’s trash.
The Enterprise/IoT SKUs, which of course include LTSC, still let you use a local account, for now…
I won’t be surprised if they plug that at some point way down the line too though given they’re already playing with Windows on the Cloud in the enterprise sector.
I would be surprised if they force the requirement on LTSC.
I could believe they force it into enterprise licensing, but LTSC’s whole deal is that the environment doesn’t change and only gets security patches. It’s made to be used in kiosks, CNC controllers and the like. Machines that are supposed perform one task reliably.
This is also the reason it’s the best version of Windows for the desktop, and why Microsoft makes it so challenging to acquire licences.
Who gives a shit about Windows licenses though, windows is obscenely easy to pirate
How would they force that on IoT installs? You think people would be happy to have online-only creds set up on kiosks, terminals and parking meters?
You think people are happy with the current situation either?
Here’s your bypass:
In OOBE, go through MS account creation. Tell it you were born today. It’ll let you set a password for the MS account before rejecting you due to COPA requirements. At this point, you can make an offline account without having even created an MS account, let alone having to use one.
This will not go away - it’s a legal thing. MS doesn’t want to deal with COPA stuff for very young kids, so this flow exists. Enjoy.
If that actually becomes a thing people do, that could prompt MS to start to require either submitting to a face scan or showing some government ID just to install Windows, though, if the way Google’s handling KYC on YT if your account gets flagged as underage, and soon Android app dev, as well as KYC going out across other sites, is any indication.
I’m pretty sure having to KYC just to install an OS is the last thing people want right now.
Let them. The entire world is slowly migrating to Mac and Linux. I haven’t even had the option of windows at my last 3 jobs. (To be fair, I’ve never had the option of desktop Linux, but this last one said pick a computer—I’m not positive that they would’ve balked at Linux.) That said, idk what’s so great about Mac over Linux, but I guess it’s not corporate friendly.
I’m trying to think of which MS products we even have in our ecosystem. Office, I guess. Corporate world will never wean themselves off of Excel.
“The entire world” lol. I applaud your optimism.
have a look at the steam hardware survey results or basically any other statistics and see that it’s not the case.
Rufus can be used to disable account creation along with other settings.
rufus doesn’t help with preloads that you don’t want to or can’t, for whatever reason, overwrite with a ‘clean’ install.
If os can’t be installed off a usb then that means linux can’t either, which makes it a pretty sad machine to spend money on.
So it must be a work or school device then? Which users wouldn’t be installing OS on anyways with it being handled through IT.
There are plenty that will boot/install Linux just fine but won’t do a nice clean install of Windows 11.
Modern Thinkpad E16 (AMD) is one of them, a clean USB won’t work, it will always stick at not finding required drivers.
You need to inevitably create a USB install from the MS USB Media Creation tool, running on the machine itself from the included crapware Windows - to get an installer USB that will work.
Different if you’re just pushing a wim over the network from endpoint/scm, but it’s basically broken for local users.
That’s unfortunate. Looks like thinkpads aren’t worth getting. I generally do not trust manfucturer preinstalled OS.
Only if you want to run Windows on that model I guess. My kid has an E16 AMD and installed Fedora Linux from a USB no problem.
Especially pertinent for Lenovo.
I would still get a ThinkPad, but then, I would never be putting Windows on it anyway.
Do you have more info regarding that ThinkPad E16?
I’m mostly working with T series laptops and haven’t had the problem, but always good to know if or when an E16 shows up.
Usually all ThinkPads work mostly the same regarding Linux support (bar the usual Nvidia driver shenanigans if you ever trip that), but I’d be concerned about the E-series themselves. If you want a cheaper than T-series ThinkPad you should get an L-series one. Not as expensive as the T-ones, but still retains some usable chassis durability, double replaceable memory slots, replaceable keyboard, etc.
I’ve started calling the E-series as E-waste.
I had this issue at work, I was able to fix it by using the windows media creation tool instead of just writing the iso to the drive. Not sure why that worked, but it has every time so far.
Just install it in a VM. I’ve done this before to force Windows 10 to install on a USB stick, you can pass a VM an entire physical drive to use instead of a virtual hard disk and install to that SSD directly from the VM (just kill the VM and reboot into the windows partition when the VM tries to reboot to the windows installation). I’m sure if you passed the VM a USB created with Rufus you could install from that as well.
What if they just ask your age as step 1 of the setup?
Same thing, that doesn’t change anything.
This is the rule for any account or mobile game, too - if it asks your age before asking for consent to farm, put any age below 13. It’ll either not farm you because it’s illegal or it’ll kick you out. If the latter, good riddance really
I’ve always done 1/1/1984 for obvious reasons but this is a good tip
I’ve used 1/1/70 since it’s the unix epoc, what’s 1/1/84?
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four
Thank you both for telling me the answers to your security questions.
Back in my day, we had to make ourselves looks older online to get things, not younger! hehe
My go to is to pop open the console and run “ipconfig /release” right before you create an account. Win 11 will have you set up a local account if you don’t have a network connection.
Doesnt work on these newest versions anymore.
OOBE\BYPASSNRO has been off and on for me, but so far nuking the network connection has always worked for me. I’m setting up a few new computers tomorrow, it will be interesting to see what tricks still work.
Yes please let us know. Wont know till we order another batch of newer computers in a few weeks.
I guess i could download the latest test build on a test machine and reset it and try.
Inconclusive. Re-used machines instead of new computers. Systems did have Windows 11 on them. OOBE\BypassNRO worked, but they may have pending updates.
Edit: one machine would not let me skip MS account sign in with OOBE\BypassNRO. IPConfig /Release immediately let me set up a local account.
Do you normally connect your machines to the internet during setup? Or is this solely without any connection?
Avoid it like the plague. Once you admit you have Internet, Microsoft never forgets.
Dump windows. These megacorps need to fail.
Tbh I’m hoping the AI crash permanently kills most of the larger tech corps.
Lol sure. If that was the real reason they’d simply let you create a local account. The audacious lying is just insulting.
Oh no, onedrive not working or the office nagging screen missing in the start menu, how will we cope.
How will I survive without my doom dark ages ad in start menu and lock screen?
It’s not lying if what they mean by “not fully configured for use” is that the private data being captured and sent to their servers is not fully matched to a personal identity in their systems.
After all, they didn’t say whose “use” that device would not be configured for.
Still, if they were actually being honest, this would be easily solved if they showed those “critical setup screens” BEFORE asking to create the account, and based on what the user selected then they would allow (or not) the creation of a local account…
The hole they will never plug: Not using Windows.
In theory Pluton enforcement platform-wide, which also includes forced SecureBoot without the ability to install user-signed keys, as well as OTA updates for that super-TPM, could block alt OSes on PC though.
Fortunately, Pluton never caught on and that hasn’t happened so far.
I’m gonna need an explanation how anything could prevent me from just formatting the drive and doing what I want, barring the use of proprietary hardware.
Forced SecureBoot with only MS keys and no way to install user-signed keys and no Linux shim would block non-Windows OSes from booting.
Basically, Pluton functions similar to how mobile devices function in terms of locked bootloaders.
AFAIK the only devices currently produced which actually use Pluton are Surface devices though, and if it’s not being implemented as intended, it’s just seen as a generic TPM by other OSes.
For anyone wondering what Pluton is: …microsoft.com/…/microsoft-pluton-security-proces…
Pluton as TPM: learn.microsoft.com/en-us/…/pluton-as-tpm
Proprietary hardware, like opaque bioses that can only be updated with signed, proprietary blobs? The bios that’s in charge of picking something to boot from from storage? The bios that can decide which bootloader is allowed through digital signatures? The signatures that are only valid if their public key is registered in the bios? The proprietary, opaque bios that decide which bootloader’s signature is valid through keys it can restrict?
Yeah, it’s all coming together. Always has been. Joking aside, I’m still surprised this whole “fully locked bios” didn’t take off. And I’m glad for it.
I’m pretty sure that unless you use some unusual SBC, all your computer parts are proprietary hardware.
I’m confused. don’t all recent AMD and intel CPUs have pluton included? I remember such an AMD announcement from ryzen 6000 and onwards, and for intel too
It’s not implemented in custom builds and most prebuilts to my knowledge.
just give 'em time. it’s still a bit early in the game for that play
In a few years If authoritarian shitholes keep fucking getting their way I can see using an “unverified/ untraceable OS” to be a “national security violation”
<img alt="" src="https://feddit.org/pictrs/image/cf6d26a1-2ffe-4fb4-b126-64437ffe3cce.webp">
From the other time this was posted:
95 is the stick, and ME is the stick up someone’s butt.
NT?
Solid, for its time but lacking USB support. But that made sense (at the time); a server OS didn’t need ISB support yet.
Win2k?
In my humble opinion that was probably the best windows of its era. Windows XP sp2 was the most important change with its own firewall.
Windows 2000 was the hammer. Windows XP was the hammer dressed as a Teletubby, with a 6-inch chain attaching it to an activation anvil.
Where is Windows ME?
It repeatedly crashed for me.
GoodAwful times.Don’t know. I use Win 9
Doesn’t stop me from using Windows 11 as much as I want.
Which is none.
You’re not required for work? Damn, lucky you
My work offers alternatives.
But even if, my work laptop is just something I remote on from my desktop and switch around seemlessly.
I could probably make more money getting a job where I have to use Windows but honestly it wouldn’t be worth it.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/b23caf9f-35cf-4cd5-8c58-fe5ad3e7c943.png">
Lol.
I remember having to disable internet when installing windows 10 so I’m not forced to make a micro$hit account.
They really don’t care at all about users. It’s all about abuse at this point.
Had to do that with Doom III in 2004. Old news.
It’s not really a big deal, unless you’re used to the freedom of Linux, which comes with it’s own issues. If M$ ever truly forces me into a corner, I’m out. And they won’t. Like Adobe allowing low-key piracy, they know they need the vast user base to remain relevant.
it is a big deal, because they are deceiving and taking advantage of so many people
So I guess Lennox phone and Linux computer as well
Annie?
With the Sweet Dreams OS.
I’m leaving that typo. I love it.
Microsoft have the Simpsons version. “I AM WATCHING, YOU THROUGH A CAMERA!”
Glad I found one and used it. If I didn’t need Windows for my classes, I’d be on Linux already.
I found it because the wifi was stuck off and if I couldn’t turn it on unless I set up windows… Which dumbly requires internet.
So once that comes to pass, someone in my situation would be SOL.
What classes require windows? You can run most things in Linux. And for the cases where my classes had instructions on how to set up something on Windows, for Linux and MacOS they just had a foot note saying “You are on your own”. But nothing was mandatory.
“It would bypass critical steps…”
Which step is that, data collection? Shoving OneDrive down my throat by putting my Desktop in it with no way to easily remove it?
collecting data, and training AI of course.
Switched to Linux full time at the start of 2025 and haven’t looked back. I fully intend to go the rest of my life without using windows again.
I’ve been using Linux exclusively for more than ten years. You’ve made the right choice. As if you needed anyone to tell you 😆
Same, I made the switch about 9 years ago when I was self-employed. Then I took a job with a small company running windows and it sucked. Now I’m 6 years in with my current, a mega corp, and they are all in on Microsoft. I’ve been so aggravated with the limitations of Microsoft products when I could get things done with a FOSS product in no time. Of course IT blocks FOSS installs because of corporate policy…🤬
At this point I just
net user /addit, which just creates the user manually and then you can reboot and just log into it.It’s not like you need anything from the OOBE at all, so might as well just skip it entirely.
I decided to make a customs iso. Not too difficult to do. Just add a unattended.xml file and boot and be done.
Germans got us covered:
https://schneegans.de/windows/unattend-generator/
Some crap I still have a Windows VM. Combine this with ShutUp10 for blocking telemetry.
ShutUp10 is awesome. I have sent them dog treats (donations) multiple times.
I despise that I have to use this OS at work. I would never run windows on my own computer again. Its just insanity. Next they’ll require a credit card to make a Microsoft account.
I could see them requiring government-issued ID. The age verification laws coming into effect in various states and countries make this a logical step for Microsoft. They might even start their own age verification service where you give them your ID and they vouch for your age with the sites you visit in Edge. Of course it would have the totally accidental side effect that everything you do on your computer could be monitored and legally tied to your identity.
The only thing you should give Microsoft is the finger.
The bird bird bird, the bird is the word.
its on our work computers, i believe windows 11 with all the BLOAT too.
I will be switching to Linux once my laptop is obsolete!!! I will only be getting Linux stuff from there on in!!! :-)
If you have a drive where you can back up your stuff before installing a new OS, there’s no need to wait.
I can add that in my experience, switching to Linux tends to have a positive impact on performance and keep the laptop usable for longer, I highly recommend you try it with your current laptop.
I’ve got machines that are obsolete for even Windows 10 that run Linux just fine. The best time to start is now.
what desktop environment do you run there? I guess that machine does not have much ram, so it must be something memory efficient
I’ve got an old desktop with a Core I7 with a 3 digit model number and 12GB of DDR3 RAM, it’s running Mint Cinnamon. I’ve got a Lenovo x86 tablet thing with 8GB of RAM and a Pentium processor, it’s currently running Fedora GNOME. I’ve run Ubuntu MATE on a Pi 4 as a desktop PC for about a year.
Most distros of Linux will run very well on a machine that ever ran Windows 7 acceptably. Prior to that, you start running into the “we’re discontinuing 32-bit support” problem.
well I assumed your devices have 4 and such GB of RAM, but yeah at 8 GB memory efficiency is not a pressing problem.
like I have a laptop with 2 GB that runs windows 10 acceptably, there was a time when that was my main on-the-go setup. that memory is almost completely used up by just logging in to kde plasma. memory compression is of course not a choice with the cpu it has though
Try Pop OS Cosmic (Like MacOS) and Linux Mint Cinnamon (Like Windows) they are both amazing. They are both customizable to look however you want too
Im running cosmic desktop on arch, its actually very good! I have enabled automatic tiling of windows and its just super convenient. Like a tiling window manager but with all the stuff most people want built-in (top bar, notifications, screenshots, screen sharing etc).
You cant customize it as much as a real tiling window manager but if all you want is for your windows to tile, its awesome.
Why wait? Linux Mint will run the shit out of your laptop right now.
Not OP, but I have to keep one Windows PC around. My favorite mod for my favorite 20 year old 4x game will not run on Linux, even though the game itself will.
The rest of my PCs are running either Mint or Xubuntu.
Qemu vm not option? Try virt-manager or similar. If 20 year old game performance impact probably not bad.
You think that will work even if Proton doesn’t?
Proton not virtual machine. Virtual machine emulate hardware for os to run like on pc. That also cause performance loss, but for 20 yo game probably not important.
I’m waiting for actual fire to start in my laptop before switching. I’ve had to do so many tricks to keep Win 7 going that I’m invested in keeping this thing going as long as possible. Plus all my porn is on it.
You’re going to immediately wonder why you waited so long.
Use Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC, problem solved.
Or, you know, that other thing.
He said in response to an article about how they are perpetually reducing the amount of things that work right now
I doubt they’ll risk alienating their enterprise costumers, but sure, they could make IoT account-only.
In that case just switch to Linux already.
Is this about Windows Home edition? I don’t need to do anything hacky to get a local account but I also don’t use Home edition.
I installed windows 11 a dozen time at work (never at home) and I just click on “domain login”, it just creates a local account and then after the install I have to manually join the domain. No Microsoft account enforcement at all.
It’s regular Windows 11, not Enterprise, we are a small company.
But I’m wondering, this bypass is too easy, is it because it sees that the DNS server is also an active directory server, so it allows that, or the trick is that you tell him you want to join a domain?
Or maybe it’s a domain enrollment bug because we’re using samba 4 under Debian as active directory server and not Windows server/entra id/whatever they call it this month?
I don’t think they ever said they plan to require it for Windows Pro or above skus. It’s only home (you know the one business shouldn’t be using anyway) that they said they wanted to enforce it on.
They actually did a lot of mess with Pro as well. There has been a “watering down” of Pro since Windows 10 to make sure that they can still do their anticonsumer crap to users. I imagine they also are trying to push businesses to get Enterprise instead of picking up relatively easy/inexpensive Pro licenses.
I don’t know why it was so easy for you, but the last four Windows 11 machines I set up over the last two years definitely required increasingly complicated hacks just to not create an online account.
You need to have 11 Pro or better to domain join a computer.
Your computer would also need to be joined to your domain to allow the login, so there is definitely some config going on that is not available to the typical home user.
I am never abandoning you, Linux
This “subscription” mentality is ruining value for a lot of society but, holy shit, do you ever rake in those huge amounts of monthly cash, for very little work.
It’s not our mentality, it’s their strategy.
Wars breed new strategies.
Sometimes it’s free trade as a carrot and embargo as a stick, like with, well, one can try to nail it to Napoleonic wars, but as old as life. Sometimes it’s mass production and standardization and ergonomics and scientific industrial design, one can try to nail these to WWII, but also as old as life. And sometimes it’s controlled escalation as a way to reach your goals without triggering nuclear response, which one can nail to the Cold War.
American strategy of the Cold War is being used against world markets, ladies and gentlemen. Together with the previous two strategies mentioned.
The Soviet one was the opposite, to try to make even the smallest transgression cause firmly the same response, so that controlled escalation wouldn’t work, but unfortunately one is founded in human psychology (plus game theory) and the other in rational knowledge (just game theory), the latter always loses. It was called scientific-technical revolution and meant literally its name - instead of gradual escalation, which favors the stronger side, you should create technical means to punch a fatal wound, nothing gradual.
So - the subscriptions themselves matter very little, they are just slowly transitioning everything big to dependence upon remote components available over the Internet.
It’s funny, actually, so much gradual work, and in the end it’ll be just wasted time - even making computers is not magic. State of the art processes could as well be that for most of humanity, but for many purposes Pentium MMX is a good enough computer, and such are not magic.
And especially making computer software of the kind that’s being “metropolized” like this is not magic. Most of it is complex simply because of legacy, backwards compatibility and as a barrier for competitors making alternative implementations.
I am horrified by what computers have become, from expensive magical tools to solve real problems, to ubiquitous shit-shoveling malware appliances controlled by some of the worst elements of society.
Those kinds of computers still exist, it’s called Linux.
I’ve never been more appreciative than I am now of the decades of effort that have gone into building this free and open-source operating system.
Imagine if we were here in 2025, with all the incumbent operating systems going to shit, but in a world where Linux didn’t exist and there was no alternative that wasn’t owned by a tech giant.
I don’t even want to imagine.
The alternative alternative existed before Linux and still exists today: BSD
In a world without Linus Torvalds, all those people who have devoted time and effort into Linux might well have found themselves working / hobbying in the BSD ecosystems instead.
I think it's almost certain that Linux's niche would have been taken by it. It worked for Apple, after all.
Or, who knows, maybe GNU Hurd might have become viable.
I find this alternate timeline incredibly likely. I had a friend in college who was all about SCO Unix back before they went evil, even when Slackware was the go-to distro. We would have a lot more BSD forks out here now, although NextStep (and maybe even OSX) would probably still emerge as one of the better commercial ones.
As an aside: what I find amusing is that Homebrew is basically BSD Ports, served from a git repo. In 2025, it’s a completely insane way to ship OS software to a single platform, but it does work.
Sure, if it wasn’t Linux then another project may have got the love and attention.
I’m not glad it was Linux specifically, just glad there is a credible FOSS alternative of some kind, and in our universe that’s Linux.
You might think there’s no such world where we wouldn’t have had some credible alternative, and as reasonable as that is - because freedom and independence are things people intrinsically want - I’m sure if you flap the butterfly wings enough times there’d be a universe where we all just collectively decided that commercial operating systems were the answer.
Glad I don’t live there.
Yeah. Look at the shitheap we had to settle with when Reddit enshittified beyond redemption. We’re really lucky to have such a well-polished alternative to Windows right now, and I think a lot of it boils down to the fact that Windows was awful from the beginning. If a halfway-decent operating system like OS/2 had become the default then we might be really scrambling right now.
I mean, we already do live in that universe, just for the mobile space.
Yes, competition is good.
It is just a problem when the competition is big tech and can ignore everybody else as they get even more money from somewhere else like Azure.
Don’t forget to donate to your favorite distro (and other open source projects) to help them keep the lights on.
Gotta do our part to fight the massive mega corps from devouring every aspect of our lives.
and still expensive
<img alt="" src="https://leminal.space/pictrs/image/624ad055-a8d1-4701-837f-3e8ff494d609.webp">
The future was here, once upon a time.
🎶 The dream of the 90’s is alive in Linux🎶
Where’s the regulation that prevents this? Appalling.
In the US? Basically nonexistent.
Well I paid for what I have, and no one is allowed to rob me of what I pay for so I’m good. Sorry Microsoft you don’t get to rob people any more than the rest of us. All it does is send people elsewhere.
Linux, your time has finally come
All Microsoft had to do for Windows to remain the most popular home and office OS in the world for decades to come, was to just not fucking suck.
Woahwoahwoah, let’s not be unrealistic here.
But honestly I’m happy for the final push to Linux. I’ve been telling myself to make the change for a few years now but what’s happening with AI training and side-loading / complete loss of privacy / general horrible vibes in the closed-source tech-sector… Linux it is. I’m even ready for the learning curve. I grew up on dos, I’m sure I can find my way around it.
Lol it’s been great getting off of Windows over the last few months.
I thought I would miss it, but Proton in Steam has been amazing on Ubuntu, with some exceptions (Stupid EA crap from skate. 2025).
Dual booting for now is OK, but gaming is pretty garbage anyway, so I will probably abandon Windows entirely soon. Definitely my last version of it. Feel so liberated having hobbies off computer anyway, and now using my computers with Ubuntu is actually enjoyable again instead of driving an expensive spy machine.
:)
I had no clue skate didn’t work for Linux until I went to play it :'( it was installed and everything. Bummer.
It shows as installable on Ubuntu in Steam, so I hilariously found out after installing Ubuntu and skate on my gf’s computer only to not be able to play it 😆
That sucks! I wish there was some connection between Steam and areweanticheatyet.com so we could know if it’ll run before we install it
I’m going to give Google money by buying a Pixel to free myself from Google…
Do custom installation (ISO) creation utilities like NTLite still allow you to remove the requirement?
upgraded to 11 for free from win2k? dual boot linux and just running updates and rebooting the win11 every few months. paid $100 for win2k a long time ago. stupid giant passkey license, no thanks. got a free account and switched to digital at some point.
Is this what they mean when they say “stream of consciousness”?
edit: Fix ironic typo.
At this point they’ll restrict access to the registry.
i wonder if they could make a read-only config partition like with macos
The workarounds people come up with to not make an MS account seem crazy to me. What difference does it really make if its a local account or not? You are still using windows so clearly you are ok with everything else, but the account is too much?
Using a Microsoft cloud account to log into my local computer means Microsoft owns credentials to a device in my house, and if they get hacked (which they do, all the fucking time), my device is less secure because of it and my data is less secure because of it.
There’s absolutely no need for my copy of Windows to require me to login using a cloud-based account.
You can use all manner of apps to disable the telemetry and privacy nonsense that people have issues with Windows about (and I similarly find Microsoft’s privacy-last approach to be tedious), but if your computer requires you to use a cloud account to log in, then your computer is susceptible to that cloud account being hijacked or hacked and Microsoft has given absolutely no good reason for this to be the case.
Logging in to a Microsoft account doesn’t provide any real benefit to the user at all, the best you can say is that you’re not prompted to log in again if you run the Microsoft Store or the Xbox app, and that’s not a compelling benefit.
Well, at least in 10, the username is something dumb and you can’t change it during creation (or everywhere easily after creation) when doing an online account. But linking after you create your account let you set it to whatever. So there may be people who are fine with online accounts but just want to set their usernames to whatever.
I don’t have a personal Microsoft account, and have no desire to create one more account, but am required by my organisation to use 1 Windows-only software for 2 hours every week. As such, I run that in a Windows VM on my computer, and this doesn’t seem like it’d be worth the effort of making a MS account
I shouldn’t need to have an internet connection to login to my desktop.