EU Chat Control: Germany's position has been reverted to UNDECIDED (mastodon.social)
from floofloof@lemmy.ca to technology@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 11:18
https://lemmy.ca/post/51766273

cross-posted from: lemmy.bestiver.se/post/622792

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#technology

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Der_Fossyler@feddit.org on 17 Sep 11:43 next collapse

digitalcourage.social/…/115214436150954844

artiman@piefed.social on 17 Sep 12:06 next collapse

isn't the september 12 deadline over

Barbarian@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 12:32 collapse

That was for tabling the vote, actual vote is happening on the 14th of October

Kyrgizion@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 12:07 next collapse

This shit is happening no matter who votes what. It’s been voted on how many times in the past decade? 5+? It’ll always keep coming back until it passes. Might as well do it now rather than later. Same with online ID verification. Just bite the pillow while they’re going in dry, it’s the shortest pain.

Rappe@sopuli.xyz on 17 Sep 12:16 next collapse

I hope you take this in the spirit in which it was meant: fuck you and your defeatist edgy apathy. Refuse and resist until the bitter end.

Kyrgizion@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 12:26 collapse

Spoken like someone who hasn’t been fighting for 15+ years with NOTHING to show for it.

I’m just tired. People don’t give a fuck anyway. May it all burn down in nuclear fire soon.

Barbarian@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 12:34 next collapse

Like sysiphus, we must continue pushing up the hill, forever. There is no final victory. If you’re tired, trust in others to continue pushing, very understandable. Just don’t piss on the people continuing where you left off.

Rappe@sopuli.xyz on 18 Sep 05:52 collapse

You have a way with words, this was a beautiful way of putting my feelings into words. I will use this rhetoric going forward in your honor. Thank you.

felbane@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 12:37 next collapse

I’m not sorry. We had it coming. A surge of white-hot atonement will be our wake up call. Hope for our future is now a stillborn dream.

Rappe@sopuli.xyz on 17 Sep 12:42 collapse

I mean, 19 years as an active member of EFF, but sure. You do you.

khapyman@sopuli.xyz on 17 Sep 12:42 collapse

If this comes to pass I’ll just revert to ways of my youth. I’ll spend more times with books and there is no such thing as online communication or SMS or anything.

I do what I can to not have that future.

DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 15:33 next collapse

One Time Pad Lmao

What’s the government gonna do? Ban numbers?

Barbarian@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 15:51 next collapse

Wouldn’t be the first time a government banned a number

DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 16:07 collapse

Lol just add 1 to every digit, voila, its no longer the same number.

Or use words to code numbers.

Like the using the first letter of a word to denote a 0/1 bit, and length of the word to denote a second 0/1 bit.

6 bits is enough to depict 64 latin/roman based characters (I mean like A-Z), plus symbols and numbers

3 words is 6 bits

3x5 is 15 words, 15 words is enough to say “hello”

you could further increase the bits per word by also factoring in the last letter of the word

Keep doing that and you’ll have steganography hidden in words.

Are they gonna ban… writing words?

No worries, just encode it in music.

You cannot ban everything, you can hide 1 and 0s anywhere lol.

Like they’ll need a money system (assuming they remain capitalist). Don’t worry big brother, I’m just sending my friend a 89 Euros and 64 cents and saying in the memo “Remember Our Anniversary”, nothing to see here… (8964 = 1989, month 6, day 4, aka: Tiananmen Square Massacre).

Is that number banned? Oops, sorry, I’ll just send my friend 78 Euros and 53 cents (caesar shift of -1). (As an example, of couse actual encryption should be more complex)

The only way they can stop all of it is to jail everyone in vibration-proof/soundproof rooms.

AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 16:13 collapse

<img alt="" src="https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/security.png">

DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 16:32 collapse

They can snatch a few people, but what if everyone starts doing that?

Well designed steganography would not be easy to detect if the authorities don’t know what they are looking for. Do they just beat random people to find out if they are sending hidden messages?

Okay you caught the person, so what?

XCGHJ DFVBN TYGBJ

With OTP, it could either be

KILL THE EMPEROR

or it could be

Bring the Condom (something that’s embarassing and plausible to want to hide, but not overthrowing the government)

or it could be any 15 character value, just think of any plausible thing you could possibly hide, to downplay what the real message is.

qwerty@discuss.tchncs.de on 17 Sep 16:53 next collapse

Inb4 I get arrested for butt texting.

Quetzalcutlass@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 17:00 collapse

Deniable encryption like that will be a lifesaver if things get bad enough. Though I’m thinking more the kind where the encrypted content on a computer disk is indistinguishable from free space, and you have multiple passwords that decrypt different parts of the filesystem. That way you can be interrogated and/or beaten, “give up” and unlock your computer (using the decoy password), and still hide any incriminating evidence since those files remain hidden with no way for adversaries to even detect that they exist.

explodicle@sh.itjust.works on 18 Sep 00:41 collapse

They’ll put the burden of decryption on you. You’d need to bet your freedom on steganography.

DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works on 18 Sep 01:34 collapse

I thought about it again for a bit. I checked the frequency of english letters as the first letter. There’s way to make two groups of letters so that 13 of them would represent a “0” bit if you see them appear as the first letter and if you see the other set of 13 characters, you’d interpret it as a “1” bit. And the letters in both groups would each collectively add up to 50%. This make it a bit harder to do frequency analysis.

Then for coded text:

You’d use 6 bits per character. So every 6 word you write on the steganograph/ciphertext, you get back 6 bits, aka 1 character (6 words to hide 1 character is a lot of work I know). 6 bits represent 64 characters. 26 is enough for one character-set of a-z, but the remaining characters can be used to make frequency analysis harder, for example, the binary that denotes “27” could be used to represent another letter “e” since “e” is the most common letter in the alphabet, so now both “05” and “27” both represent e. Do the same with all the other frequenly appearing letters, these are “Etaoin Shrdlu”(I actually memorized it on the top of my head since I was obsessed with the idea of ciphers as a kid and I looked it up on wikipedia about cryptanalysis a few years ago)

Of course, these are just examples, don’t make your “e” = “05”, they could be e=61 e=53 e=23 t=2 t=4 etc…, so basically, one letter has multiple ways to be represented, especially the more frequent letters should be represented more times until you get a more even distribution.

(I’m not an expert tho, in a post-chat-control world, maybe you can email some cryptography/steganography expert and ask for better advice.)

anon5621@lemmy.ml on 17 Sep 19:19 collapse

No actually ,only self host is solution actually and phones with not installed spyware ,so currently for now phone with lineage os,graphenos or post market is,for desktop is linux distros or haiku or BSD based systems.as tool for communication self host matrix,xmpp,irc,email server

vithigar@lemmy.ca on 17 Sep 19:50 collapse

I’m sorry, did you just “no actually” someone who was espousing books as disconnected entertainment?

anon5621@lemmy.ml on 17 Sep 21:40 collapse

I meant only from point that there is alternative way for commutation ,I didn’t mean anything bad about reading books

krebssteven@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 12:36 next collapse

I am so happy to see my little luxembourg oppose this authoritarian power grab.

NarrativeBear@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 15:50 next collapse

I am surprised by Sweden and Denmark being in favor.

mienshao@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 15:53 next collapse

Norway isn’t on this map

hamsterkill@lemmy.sdf.org on 17 Sep 16:10 collapse

Norway is not EU

migo@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 17 Sep 19:28 next collapse

They’ve been reverting a lot of that Nordic socialism due to the usual anti-immigrant rhetoric

CosmoNova@lemmy.world on 17 Sep 23:24 collapse

I‘m not surprised in the slightest given who governs these countries nowadays. They‘re far more right than your average EU country.

pineapplelover@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 17 Sep 16:25 next collapse

Ima be honest, things don’t look good. Europe is our last hope before this shit comes over to America

DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works on 17 Sep 19:46 next collapse

Meshtastic is not included in chat control, right?

(Inb4 they ban that too lol)

HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 17 Sep 19:57 collapse

It already has yo, just on a state level.

njordomir@lemmy.world on 18 Sep 06:25 collapse

The wildest part of this to me is the politicians exempting themselves. It may be different in Europe, but in the US, the politicians are often the child predators this legislation claims to protect against.

The politicians claim “professional secrecy”, but shouldn’t you be increasingly auditable the more power you are given. Private individuals should have an expectation of privacy. Politicians, and those with power and influence should live in the open to protect from abuses of that power.