Oh this can absolutely happen at the less luxurious positions. For instance, FAANG (the big 5 tech companies, if you don’t work tech like 3/4 of the Fediverse) can afford to pay salaries well above any other employers. We’re talking 200k-400k here, not obscene billionaire-class stuff. Once they grab you, they can treat you worse once you get adjusted to the salary that no one else can match. I’ve seen it happen to a lot of people who end up miserable until they leave and have to go through the readjustment period.
massive_bereavement@kbin.social
on 25 Mar 2024 13:43
nextcollapse
The issue in this instance was not screwing things well enough.
ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 13:51
nextcollapse
He’s gonna need a parachute if he flies home on one of his planes.
dutchkimble@lemy.lol
on 26 Mar 2024 18:13
collapse
In this particular case a parachute is probably for the best
nondescripthandle@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 25 Mar 2024 12:54
nextcollapse
Nothing but a scapegoat if they replace him with another accountant instead of an engineer.
bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
on 25 Mar 2024 13:07
nextcollapse
It doesn’t matter if the CEO was an engineer or not in a previous life. The job of a CEO doesn’t change and he did exactly what he was supposed to do: made shortsighted decisions that maximised profit and took the fall for it when the short-sightedness of those decisions blew up in their faces.
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 13:23
collapse
Until the merger, Boeing was engineer-driven. They were well known for safety first and design over cost.
That doesn’t change what I said. He did exactly what all boards expect their CEOs to do nowadays. No board of directors expects their CEO to have actual product knowledge.
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 13:59
collapse
That isn’t true at all. Intel has a history of it, Boeing, Tesla, etc.
Many companies have a history of having a CEO who has product knowledge.
bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
on 25 Mar 2024 14:43
nextcollapse
I’m not talking about history. I’m talking about the climate of capitalism in America right now
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 14:46
collapse
It’s some weird rant that Isn’t relevant or accurate. The comment was they need to hire an engineer. That’s what Boeing use to do. That’s what many successful companies do that make products.
barryamelton@lemmy.ml
on 25 Mar 2024 14:53
collapse
Elon Musk is a brilliant inventor nonpareil. He invented tunnels, rockets, electric cars, and now Twitter.
5C5C5C@programming.dev
on 25 Mar 2024 13:08
nextcollapse
By all credible accounts the systemic issues at Boeing predate this CEO by probably 2 decades. Dave Calhoun seems to specialize in “troubled companies”, i.e. he has never been anything more than a professional scape goat.
Edit: I didn’t do enough research, he hasn’t really been CEO at many places, just upper positions like director and board member. Still, the companies he specializes in seem to be the ones with reputations to cannibalize for money by cutting quality and screwing consumers, like GE.
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 13:28
collapse
They need to get back to the engineering mindset. This is why I think CEO bonuses on things like EPS are BS. It should be tied to things like engineering, safety, etc.
It should be something that must be returned if there’s a severe fuckup within five years or something. Also they shouldn’t be getting bonuses, they are already massively overpaid.
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 14:06
collapse
For most CEO, Bonuses and stock options are the bulk of their pay.
I have no issues with either or even their pay, but I have no issues with regulations around it since they are public companies. I do have issues with a product that should be safe with any bonus tied to profitability. It should be tied to safety.
I think they’re more in a “hire a hit man to kill whistleblowers” mindset. Not the sort to suddenly turn about and become engineering do-gooders.
Haagel@lemmings.world
on 25 Mar 2024 12:59
nextcollapse
Probably stepping down to sit on the board instead.
Binthinkin@kbin.social
on 25 Mar 2024 13:11
nextcollapse
That’s not enough. We want investigations that bring consequences.
Edit: the people who are commenting below about how “we have no control” etc etc, I just want to say, “Shut the fuck up.” Nobody wants you around anymore. Just because YOU have been a weak POS your entire life spouting off weak, sad bullshit trying to divert REAL change doesn’t mean that the rest of the country is like you. Go back to your holes because I promise if you don’t and you keep acting up, we will put you there in finality. The public isn’t stupid, and they aren’t weak. It’s scumbags within the wealth class that are protected by losers like you all naysayers and class traitors who try to make it seem that way. Trump and Biden is a symptom of class traitors turning on the public, not a show of force by the elites. Best recognize.
Nudding@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 13:28
nextcollapse
What we want, and what happens in reality, have absolutely no connection. Money is what makes the world go around. Money is the only thing that matters to our society.
some_designer_dude@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 13:32
nextcollapse
No, it’s the only thing that matters to our current leadership. That can be changed. Either by changing their minds, or by removing and replacing them.
Lol, who chose Biden VS trump, the American people? Please.
some_designer_dude@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 17:27
collapse
Oh I’m not assuming the system isn’t owned by the rich. But the people in power can still be removed and replaced, even if the methods in place aren’t setup for it. The French are pretty good at it, for example.
RageAgainstTheRich@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 19:59
collapse
Just wanted to say your edit is awesome ✊
itsgroundhogdayagain@lemmy.ml
on 25 Mar 2024 13:39
nextcollapse
Bring back the dude who married his first cousin!
SamsonSeinfelder@feddit.de
on 25 Mar 2024 13:58
collapse
Rudy Giuliani?
ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 13:50
nextcollapse
Don’t let the door hit you on the—oh shit, the door!
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Mar 2024 14:39
nextcollapse
In Soviet Russia America, the door hits you on it’s way out.
billiam0202@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 17:24
collapse
Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
No, not that door- the one from your shitty plane flying overhead.
knova@infosec.pub
on 25 Mar 2024 14:00
nextcollapse
Culture change takes a while; I feel like even if they replaced everyone at the top with safety minded engineers to run the company, it would be some time before they dig themselves out of the hole they created for themselves.
Fedizen@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 14:15
nextcollapse
Just going to state the obvious here: Boards of directors of large public company should have a % of the board elected by company workers and another % appointed by elected politicians. The problem here is corporate boards entirely run by investors.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Mar 2024 14:37
nextcollapse
I’m just flabbergasted it took this long. It’s COMICALLY obvious that this is the result of a decades-long legacy of technical leadership failures and safety-incompatible profit fixation.
simplejack@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 14:47
nextcollapse
So what about his seat on the board and what about the Director of the board, Bradway?
At the end of the day, it’s the board that’s signing off on the high level strategy. They need to be held accountable too. The CEO isn’t the top of the pyramid. The board is.
Thank you! Folks around here are always baggin’ on CEOs like they’re the top dogs. Nope. The Board often orders them to do stupid shit, and sometimes they’re brought on to do stupid shit. Hence the golden parachute thing. Damn straight I want paid if you fire me for doing what I was told.
Jode@midwest.social
on 25 Mar 2024 14:59
nextcollapse
Are we all forgetting that Boeing most likely had a witness testifying them executed in a parking lot a few weeks ago?
corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
on 25 Mar 2024 16:36
nextcollapse
You a word, there.
MyNamesNotRobert@lemmynsfw.com
on 25 Mar 2024 18:32
collapse
John Barnett didn’t kill himself and they’re doing a damn good job of sweeping it under the rug. It barely got mentioned in by any mainstream news outlets. Even Epstien got more media coverage than this.
wintermute_oregon@lemm.ee
on 25 Mar 2024 15:23
nextcollapse
Now, I am a fan of this in general. I think unions should get a seat at the table.
PrincessLeiasCat@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Mar 2024 17:44
nextcollapse
Highly recommend the book ‘Flying Blind’ by Peter Robison on Boeing and the decline of its safety culture after the merger with McDonnell Douglas. That’s when the “business” types who ran the former company into the ground took over both and we see the same results here.
Before the merger, the engineers were in charge and safety was taken seriously. Now, it’s more about stock, etc.
applebusch@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 23:51
nextcollapse
Long ago the four nations lived in harmony. But everything changed when the business nation attacked. Only the regulations could stop them, but when the world needed them most, they vanished.
afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world
on 27 Mar 2024 01:20
collapse
We should make a movie about this. The last regulator. The fans will love it
SkyeStarfall@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 26 Mar 2024 10:52
collapse
I feel like I hear this story repeated over and over and over and over and over… everywhere.
At what point will we stop letting the business types degrade our human civilization for their egoistic short-term gains?
Blank@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 18:46
nextcollapse
When capitalism is no longer propped up by the government, masquerading as democracy, so that they, too, can greedily profiteer on the short term gains of a quality product that has been ran into the ground for the sake of a bigger personal estate.
afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world
on 27 Mar 2024 01:18
collapse
Maybe just learning to live with it would be better. It’s cliche at this point. Company thinks big, takes big risks, makes shitton of money and shitton of mistakes. Wall Street takes over and the company circles the drain. We all know it’s going to happen. That uniqueness will converge, or made to converge to the mean, and given enough time every company will be an also-ran.
I got into Soylent when it first came out. It said proudly made with GMOs on the label. The recipe was open source and a revision number on it. The inventor was conducting medical tests on himself as a test subject and tweaking the nutrition balance and it was all made by one facility. Now, the proudly made with GMOs is gone, it is closed source, the recipe seems to never change, the supply of bottled comes from a different facility each time I order it. What happened? The company was sold to an established player and they made it just yet another meal replacement drink.
I guess what I am saying is it is probably just easier to accept that this is going to happen. The craftsman of your grandfather is the cheap junk of today.
Treczoks@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 18:35
nextcollapse
How many millions fat will his golden parachute be for sending hundreds of passengers to death?
Seaguy05@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 18:52
collapse
15 million in stocks that vest in 3 years plus his 1.4 million in base salary plus plus his 22 million in stock, which has admittedly taken a beating as of late.
Treczoks@lemmy.world
on 25 Mar 2024 19:59
collapse
Nice payout for a complete failure on the job.
Maggoty@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 00:44
nextcollapse
Cool. Now arrest him for criminal negligence.
notannpc@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 18:08
nextcollapse
The shareholders get their fall guy, cool, but what about the entire leaderships criminal negligence? Because you can’t convince me that the CEO was single-handedly making the call to cut corners.
Everythingispenguins@lemmy.world
on 27 Mar 2024 03:46
collapse
He was the guy not putting the bolts in. Boeing is actually a pretty small shop
/s
SankaraStone@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 18:14
nextcollapse
He should required to be up there to answer questions from congress and the Feds.
Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 19:52
collapse
Don’t be silly. He’ll commit suicide with two shots to the back of the head before that happens.
KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml
on 26 Mar 2024 18:56
nextcollapse
“I’m gonna step down because I failed this clown car of a company…btw i’m keeping my golden parachute”
BeautifulMind@lemmy.world
on 26 Mar 2024 19:44
nextcollapse
When you have financial engineers overriding the decisions of mechanical engineers, you get crashy airplanes and eventually, caught up murdering people that might talk to investigators in order to defend those juicy profits
…sort of like how when administrators and insurance folk and lawyers and judges override the decisions of doctors and nurses, you end up with highly profitable hospitals and people dying for it
…all a bit like when the bean counters run your software company, layoffs designed to boost stock price by showing investors ‘fiscal discipline’ leaves your engineering teams shorthanded and forces them to de-prioritize bug fixes and dealing with technical debt and rigorous testing and you end up shipping lots of bugs when you release your product
Don’t blame accountants. They don’t make any decisions, and they don’t have the technical expertise to know what is dangerous.
The CEO is a good start. I bet the COO and head of engineering are also at fault. People signed off on these planes without doing the required installation of the door. If it’s a systemic issue, the quality control team is to blame.
Aviation is a regulated industry, right? I expect the FAA to get to the bottom, if not lawsuits.
FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today
on 26 Mar 2024 20:39
collapse
Not good enough, I want more than just a change of leadership. I want federal oversight at every Boeing Facility. I want the FAA to have a new office funded by Washington to scrutinize this company. I want Boeing Employees purged from the FAA.
cryostars@lemmyf.uk
on 27 Mar 2024 01:27
nextcollapse
Funded by Washington who get the money from higher taxes on these fucks
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 27 Mar 2024 04:30
collapse
threaded - newest
I wonder what his golden handshake (parachute? What’s the difference?) is, for screwing things up so badly?
Golden handshake is coming in, golden handcuffs to keep you there, and golden parachute for your exit.
One golden anything please
Best I can do is a golden shower
Yummy!
Jeez, I just can’t win in this timeline
Careful what you wish for! 🤣
People need to remember that these only apply to high leadership. For us peons it usually is a Golden Shower.
Oh this can absolutely happen at the less luxurious positions. For instance, FAANG (the big 5 tech companies, if you don’t work tech like 3/4 of the Fediverse) can afford to pay salaries well above any other employers. We’re talking 200k-400k here, not obscene billionaire-class stuff. Once they grab you, they can treat you worse once you get adjusted to the salary that no one else can match. I’ve seen it happen to a lot of people who end up miserable until they leave and have to go through the readjustment period.
The issue in this instance was not screwing things well enough.
He’s gonna need a parachute if he flies home on one of his planes.
In this particular case a parachute is probably for the best
Nothing but a scapegoat if they replace him with another accountant instead of an engineer.
It doesn’t matter if the CEO was an engineer or not in a previous life. The job of a CEO doesn’t change and he did exactly what he was supposed to do: made shortsighted decisions that maximised profit and took the fall for it when the short-sightedness of those decisions blew up in their faces.
Until the merger, Boeing was engineer-driven. They were well known for safety first and design over cost.
www.cnn.com/2024/01/30/business/…/index.html
There are hundreds of articles on this topic and you rant without knowing the topic.
That doesn’t change what I said. He did exactly what all boards expect their CEOs to do nowadays. No board of directors expects their CEO to have actual product knowledge.
That isn’t true at all. Intel has a history of it, Boeing, Tesla, etc.
Many companies have a history of having a CEO who has product knowledge.
I’m not talking about history. I’m talking about the climate of capitalism in America right now
It’s some weird rant that Isn’t relevant or accurate. The comment was they need to hire an engineer. That’s what Boeing use to do. That’s what many successful companies do that make products.
Tesla 🤣
Elon Musk is a brilliant inventor nonpareil. He invented tunnels, rockets, electric cars, and now Twitter.
By all credible accounts the systemic issues at Boeing predate this CEO by probably 2 decades. Dave Calhoun seems to specialize in “troubled companies”, i.e. he has never been anything more than a professional scape goat.
Edit: I didn’t do enough research, he hasn’t really been CEO at many places, just upper positions like director and board member. Still, the companies he specializes in seem to be the ones with reputations to cannibalize for money by cutting quality and screwing consumers, like GE.
If it comes with golden parachutes it’s all but guaranteed he doesn’t care.
If I got millions of dollars every time a company went down in flames around me, I’d carry around a can of gas and matches.
He was CEO, he could have implemented policies to alleviate these issues. Instead he kept the status quo.
He belongs in jail, not another board room.
Didn’t he hold senior positions in Boeing much longer than he has been CEO?
You’re right, he was there since 2009, so he has probably been helping to design the cannibalization, but it certainly didn’t begin with him.
He was responsible for the figurative nosedive my boss’ previous company did. Now he’s responsible for the literal nosedive of Boeing.
This man is a professional company ruiner, not just a scape goat.
Calhoun’s MCAS might have been set incorrectly 👀
They need to get back to the engineering mindset. This is why I think CEO bonuses on things like EPS are BS. It should be tied to things like engineering, safety, etc.
It should be something that must be returned if there’s a severe fuckup within five years or something. Also they shouldn’t be getting bonuses, they are already massively overpaid.
For most CEO, Bonuses and stock options are the bulk of their pay.
I have no issues with either or even their pay, but I have no issues with regulations around it since they are public companies. I do have issues with a product that should be safe with any bonus tied to profitability. It should be tied to safety.
I think they’re more in a “hire a hit man to kill whistleblowers” mindset. Not the sort to suddenly turn about and become engineering do-gooders.
Probably stepping down to sit on the board instead.
That’s not enough. We want investigations that bring consequences.
Edit: the people who are commenting below about how “we have no control” etc etc, I just want to say, “Shut the fuck up.” Nobody wants you around anymore. Just because YOU have been a weak POS your entire life spouting off weak, sad bullshit trying to divert REAL change doesn’t mean that the rest of the country is like you. Go back to your holes because I promise if you don’t and you keep acting up, we will put you there in finality. The public isn’t stupid, and they aren’t weak. It’s scumbags within the wealth class that are protected by losers like you all naysayers and class traitors who try to make it seem that way. Trump and Biden is a symptom of class traitors turning on the public, not a show of force by the elites. Best recognize.
What we want, and what happens in reality, have absolutely no connection. Money is what makes the world go around. Money is the only thing that matters to our society.
No, it’s the only thing that matters to our current leadership. That can be changed. Either by changing their minds, or by removing and replacing them.
Lol, who chose Biden VS trump, the American people? Please.
Oh I’m not assuming the system isn’t owned by the rich. But the people in power can still be removed and replaced, even if the methods in place aren’t setup for it. The French are pretty good at it, for example.
Americans don’t have the balls Imo, the French are unique in their relationship to the owner class.
You definitely don’t appear to.
You know a lot about balls?
Lol
When are we going to change that? It’s been a while, like 600BC, but we managed just fine for tens of thousands of years before minted coin.
Unfortunately, we aren’t.
Just wanted to say your edit is awesome ✊
Bring back the dude who married his first cousin!
Rudy Giuliani?
Don’t let the door hit you on the—oh shit, the door!
In
Soviet RussiaAmerica, the door hits you on it’s way out.Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
No, not that door- the one from your shitty plane flying overhead.
Culture change takes a while; I feel like even if they replaced everyone at the top with safety minded engineers to run the company, it would be some time before they dig themselves out of the hole they created for themselves.
Just going to state the obvious here: Boards of directors of large public company should have a % of the board elected by company workers and another % appointed by elected politicians. The problem here is corporate boards entirely run by investors.
I’m just flabbergasted it took this long. It’s COMICALLY obvious that this is the result of a decades-long legacy of technical leadership failures and safety-incompatible profit fixation.
So what about his seat on the board and what about the Director of the board, Bradway?
At the end of the day, it’s the board that’s signing off on the high level strategy. They need to be held accountable too. The CEO isn’t the top of the pyramid. The board is.
Thank you! Folks around here are always baggin’ on CEOs like they’re the top dogs. Nope. The Board often orders them to do stupid shit, and sometimes they’re brought on to do stupid shit. Hence the golden parachute thing. Damn straight I want paid if you fire me for doing what I was told.
Are we all forgetting that Boeing most likely had a witness testifying them executed in a parking lot a few weeks ago?
You a word, there.
John Barnett didn’t kill himself and they’re doing a damn good job of sweeping it under the rug. It barely got mentioned in by any mainstream news outlets. Even Epstien got more media coverage than this.
ft.com/…/a8bfd0a3-2904-4b7e-a8e0-b5e04567c980
Now, I am a fan of this in general. I think unions should get a seat at the table.
Highly recommend the book ‘Flying Blind’ by Peter Robison on Boeing and the decline of its safety culture after the merger with McDonnell Douglas. That’s when the “business” types who ran the former company into the ground took over both and we see the same results here.
Before the merger, the engineers were in charge and safety was taken seriously. Now, it’s more about stock, etc.
Long ago the four nations lived in harmony. But everything changed when the business nation attacked. Only the regulations could stop them, but when the world needed them most, they vanished.
We should make a movie about this. The last regulator. The fans will love it
I feel like I hear this story repeated over and over and over and over and over… everywhere.
At what point will we stop letting the business types degrade our human civilization for their egoistic short-term gains?
When capitalism is no longer propped up by the government, masquerading as democracy, so that they, too, can greedily profiteer on the short term gains of a quality product that has been ran into the ground for the sake of a bigger personal estate.
Maybe just learning to live with it would be better. It’s cliche at this point. Company thinks big, takes big risks, makes shitton of money and shitton of mistakes. Wall Street takes over and the company circles the drain. We all know it’s going to happen. That uniqueness will converge, or made to converge to the mean, and given enough time every company will be an also-ran.
I got into Soylent when it first came out. It said proudly made with GMOs on the label. The recipe was open source and a revision number on it. The inventor was conducting medical tests on himself as a test subject and tweaking the nutrition balance and it was all made by one facility. Now, the proudly made with GMOs is gone, it is closed source, the recipe seems to never change, the supply of bottled comes from a different facility each time I order it. What happened? The company was sold to an established player and they made it just yet another meal replacement drink.
I guess what I am saying is it is probably just easier to accept that this is going to happen. The craftsman of your grandfather is the cheap junk of today.
How many millions fat will his golden parachute be for sending hundreds of passengers to death?
15 million in stocks that vest in 3 years plus his 1.4 million in base salary plus plus his 22 million in stock, which has admittedly taken a beating as of late.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Calhoun
Nice payout for a complete failure on the job.
Cool. Now arrest him for criminal negligence.
The shareholders get their fall guy, cool, but what about the entire leaderships criminal negligence? Because you can’t convince me that the CEO was single-handedly making the call to cut corners.
He was the guy not putting the bolts in. Boeing is actually a pretty small shop
/s
He should required to be up there to answer questions from congress and the Feds.
Don’t be silly. He’ll commit suicide with two shots to the back of the head before that happens.
“I’m gonna step down because I failed this clown car of a company…btw i’m keeping my golden parachute”
When you have financial engineers overriding the decisions of mechanical engineers, you get crashy airplanes and eventually, caught up murdering people that might talk to investigators in order to defend those juicy profits
…sort of like how when administrators and insurance folk and lawyers and judges override the decisions of doctors and nurses, you end up with highly profitable hospitals and people dying for it
…all a bit like when the bean counters run your software company, layoffs designed to boost stock price by showing investors ‘fiscal discipline’ leaves your engineering teams shorthanded and forces them to de-prioritize bug fixes and dealing with technical debt and rigorous testing and you end up shipping lots of bugs when you release your product
Don’t blame accountants. They don’t make any decisions, and they don’t have the technical expertise to know what is dangerous.
The CEO is a good start. I bet the COO and head of engineering are also at fault. People signed off on these planes without doing the required installation of the door. If it’s a systemic issue, the quality control team is to blame.
Aviation is a regulated industry, right? I expect the FAA to get to the bottom, if not lawsuits.
Not good enough, I want more than just a change of leadership. I want federal oversight at every Boeing Facility. I want the FAA to have a new office funded by Washington to scrutinize this company. I want Boeing Employees purged from the FAA.
Funded by Washington who get the money from higher taxes on these fucks
Can’t wait to see his golden parachute