Developer creates endless Wikipedia feed to fight algorithm addiction (arstechnica.com)
from amon@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 19:12
https://lemmy.world/post/25361497

#technology

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ristoril_zip@lemmy.zip on 09 Feb 2025 19:58 next collapse

wikitok.vercel.app

WikiTok

Not sure if there’s an app yet, I found one on the Android store by Arakassia…

theorychapter@sh.itjust.works on 09 Feb 2025 20:24 next collapse

Seems to work fine as a PWA-esque shortcut on iOS for the time being

BaroqueInMind@lemmy.one on 09 Feb 2025 20:36 next collapse

Most “apps” are just http web hooks to a regular website backend with extra tracking telemetry. So a website working as a PWA should be enough for everyone.

I hate how everything has to be a fucking app, because it doesn’t need to be.

AstralPath@lemmy.ca on 09 Feb 2025 23:04 collapse

If phone OSes made it so there’s less friction to save a web page as an icon on your desktop it would help to resolve that issue I think.

Dampyr@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 23:34 next collapse

I think that’s only partly true as companies, especially big ones, want the telemetry and control of a native app instead of just a web page

Hazor@lemmy.world on 12 Feb 04:38 collapse

They also want the ability to make you agree to a TOS with an arbitration clause so you can’t sue them when your wife dies because they screwed up her food.

kiagam@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 00:57 next collapse

Proper PWA websites save very well to phone home screens (like voyager for Lemmy!)

uis@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 01:11 next collapse

It’s just two taps in browser to get it on home screen.

flames5123@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 08:06 next collapse

It’s so easy, even on iOS. Just tap share and add to Home Screen. It’s probably just as easy on android.

ALiteralCabbage@feddit.uk on 10 Feb 2025 09:08 next collapse

It’s very easy.

Chrome let’s you do “install” websites to home screen, Firefox allows saving shortcuts to home screen.

The annoying thing is that you can’t save them to the app drawer (at least on vanilla android), so if you have a clean home screen you have to sacrifice that.

AstralPath@lemmy.ca on 10 Feb 2025 14:43 collapse

Yep, you’re 100% right. Not sure why I thought it was high friction. I feel like I confused trying to put an icon for an image on my home screen (gym app’s sign in QR code) with sending a web page to the home screen.

Naia@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 11 Feb 2025 18:36 collapse

At least on android I was able to just add a link to the home screen in Firefox.

MrSilkworm@lemmy.ml on 09 Feb 2025 21:04 next collapse

On android:

  1. Open link in Firefox.
  2. Tap the three dots.
  3. Tap “add to start screen”

There’s your app!

LucidNightmare@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 05:29 collapse

On iOS through Safari:
Tap the Share icon
Scroll down a little.
Add to Home Screen.
Profit?

melroy@kbin.melroy.org on 09 Feb 2025 21:40 collapse

I'm still scrolling. Will it ever stop?????

help me.

pelespirit@sh.itjust.works on 09 Feb 2025 19:59 next collapse

This is pretty awesome. I do see the need to be able to add categories of interest. Like follow history, the arts, etc. Cool regardless.

misterdoctor@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 20:32 next collapse

“I have had plenty of people message me and even make issues on my GitHub asking for some insane crazy WikiTok algorithm,” Gemal told Ars. “And I had to put my foot down and say something along the lines that we’re already ruled by ruthless, opaque algorithms in our everyday life; why can’t we just have one little corner in the world without them?”

The developer seems staunchly anti-algorithm but I feel like some sort of filter system would work well. I know nothing about development but the same level of randomosity (it’s a word don’t look it up) but for specific topics would be amazing.

auraithx@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 09 Feb 2025 23:11 collapse

;/

Algorithms themselves are fine. It’s wikipedia. I’d actually use it if it brought me to interesting pages based on a recommender algorithm.

Graphy@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 04:25 collapse

Yeah this is just the wiki random button with a simplified TikTok gui.

Pretty much a useless site which is a shame since I was excited about it.

[deleted] on 11 Feb 2025 13:49 collapse

.

artificialfish@programming.dev on 09 Feb 2025 23:18 collapse

It needs the TikTok algorithm

KeraKali@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 20:17 next collapse

Just found this article that for some reason has me dying of laughter: ICBM address

ininewcrow@lemmy.ca on 09 Feb 2025 21:03 next collapse

That’s hilarious

skulblaka@sh.itjust.works on 09 Feb 2025 22:46 next collapse

If you enjoy this, have a peek at The Jargon File. Classic hacker slang is something else.

BaroqueInMind@lemmy.one on 11 Feb 2025 18:21 collapse

Thank you for this. Very interesting read about hacker speak.

BaroqueInMind@lemmy.one on 11 Feb 2025 18:05 collapse

I love this. ICBM address is a very clever joke.

GBU_28@lemm.ee on 09 Feb 2025 20:23 next collapse

My God my general but shallow knowledge of many things will grow more powerful

Cad@lemmy.today on 09 Feb 2025 20:29 next collapse

Wikipedia already has a “random article” function. I guess the tiktok ui is nice for some folks.

webghost0101@sopuli.xyz on 09 Feb 2025 20:31 next collapse

Does it have an algorithm of some kind?

I usually hate them but for something safe like wikipedia i would love to have it tailored to my interests.

RmDebArc_5@sh.itjust.works on 09 Feb 2025 20:50 next collapse

Apparently not:

“I have had plenty of people message me and even make issues on my GitHub asking for some insane crazy WikiTok algorithm,” Gemal told Ars. “And I had to put my foot down and say something along the lines that we’re already ruled by ruthless, opaque algorithms in our everyday life; why can’t we just have one little corner in the world without them?”

webghost0101@sopuli.xyz on 09 Feb 2025 20:56 collapse

I understand their stance but it is a bit sad because if i could tailor it to my interests i absolutely would use it all the time.

Wikipedia is massive there is way more that i don’t want to read then there is that i do.

Personally i think there is roam for a “not insane, Fully transparent and user controlled” algorithm but also that would take a lot of developer effort.

TachyonTele@lemm.ee on 09 Feb 2025 20:54 collapse

Are you asking if the app made specifically without an algorithm has an algorithm?

webghost0101@sopuli.xyz on 09 Feb 2025 21:03 collapse

Its not presented as being specifically made without.

There is plenty of room for more ethical algorithms and to get technical. It definitely does have a algorithm.

A very basic formula that simulates randomness to pick one Wikipedia page after the other.

I just wish i could customize that to my interests. So for example it favors articles tagged as ancient mythology and minimizes politicians from the 90s

TachyonTele@lemm.ee on 09 Feb 2025 21:11 collapse

Its not presented as being specifically made without? Wat

Developer creates endless Wikipedia feed to fight algorithm addiction

and spend spare moments of boredom without reaching for an algorithmically addictive social media app.

without an invasive algorithm tracking you and pushing you toward the lowest-common-denominator content.

Gemal is currently resisting calls to automatically tailor the stream of articles to the user’s interests based on what they express interest in.

“I have had plenty of people message me and even make issues on my GitHub asking for some insane crazy WikiTok algorithm,” Gemal told Ars. “And I had to put my foot down and say something along the lines that we’re already ruled by ruthless, opaque algorithms in our everyday life; why can’t we just have one little corner in the world without them?”

“I have no grand plans for some sort of insane monetized hyper-calculating TikTok algorithm,” Gemal told us. “It is anti-algorithmic, if anything.”

Ill just repeat that last line again for you:

“It is anti-algorithmic, if anything.”

The code is on github, go for it.
Also, read the article for once. Jesus.

webghost0101@sopuli.xyz on 09 Feb 2025 22:16 collapse

There is no need to communicate like this. I actually had already learned about this app and checked it out yesterday on a different community with way less people and there was no article there. I just saw the opportunity of this post as way to discuss it.

I like to make a few things clear that seem to cause confusion.

  1. I made my post in full understanding that it probably does not feature a “preference based algorithm”, trying it out did not gave it the impression it did. But i want to be more sure there is nothing along those lines included and tried to engage in discussion about the need for preferential settings. Its somewhere between a genuine and rhetoric question.

  2. Call me pedantric, trough i prefer autistic but “algoritm” has like i explained a specific meaning to me. Its mathematical formula for a specific purpose. The app in question is code, code is math. Randomizing code (which are never truly random btw) uses an algorithm. You can not tell me that the app uses NO algorithm, well oc you can but to my brain that does not compute. Any form of customizing the feed, even a hack, would be algorithmic in nature.

  3. I disagree this (and many things) require a full fledged article, just a clear few line description or like including those quotes you put up here would do for me. I know the internet likes to make everything into “news” but i don’t have to like or partake in that. I prefer to spend my time engaging on lemmy about the topic directly because that (this diverted discussion included) helps it grow.

HexadecimalSky@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 21:17 next collapse

As someone who loved the random article feature and will sometimes peruse Wikipedia at random, this is extremely fascinating to me.

PixelatedSaturn@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 21:25 next collapse

I don’t get it, it’s pretty lame. Just a list of articles. This would need some kind of flow. Maybe one that is continued depending on what topic one reads. Something. I think, I’ll try to make this …

crowbar@kbin.earth on 10 Feb 2025 04:45 collapse

also needs a way to integrate ads too, oh and dont forget, AI AI AI AI AI

ALiteralCabbage@feddit.uk on 10 Feb 2025 09:11 collapse

It was built with AI, so articles will scream about it being a triumph of whatever engine made it.

lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org on 09 Feb 2025 23:02 next collapse

endless feed

to fight algorithm addiction

endless

feed

to fight algorithm addiction

Uuuuuh that’s not the way to fight an addiction, right? Who is this person working for, exactly?

Bob_Robertson_IX@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 23:31 next collapse

Think of it as a methadone clinic for doomscrollers.

BeMoreCareful@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 23:53 next collapse

I may have a problem

lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org on 10 Feb 2025 02:31 collapse

We’re here to help! We just need someone to implement doomscroll / infiniscroll into Lemmy, lol.

r4venw@sh.itjust.works on 10 Feb 2025 06:41 next collapse

Honestly the fact that Lemmy doesn’t have infinite scroll (on my UI, at least) has helped me a lot in terms of not wasting hours at a time on my phone

fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world on 11 Feb 2025 00:05 collapse

I’ve got news for you: basically every app I’ve used so far for lemmy has infinite scroll. Currently Thunder previously Sync.

lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org on 11 Feb 2025 17:24 collapse

Oh dear!

chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 00:30 next collapse

More like a brothel for sex addicts.

GaMEChld@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 02:08 collapse

Jesus. Enough hyperbolic nonsense. Browsing Wikipedia is way healthier than doom scrolling.

Jolteon@lemmy.zip on 10 Feb 2025 05:52 collapse

And doomscrolling Wikipedia is still healthier than doomscrolling anything else.

asteriskeverything@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 04:57 collapse

If methadone was also educational 🌈⭐

fox2263@lemmy.world on 09 Feb 2025 23:50 next collapse

I don’t think there’s an algorithm involved actually. Just lovely facts.

Anivia@feddit.org on 10 Feb 2025 14:04 collapse

Well, there has to be some kind of algorithm. Even picking a random Wikipedia article technically is an algorithm, just not one that adapts to the user

Septimaeus@infosec.pub on 10 Feb 2025 17:00 next collapse

True, but outside CS the word has come to refer to a certain brand of complex heuristics or ML inference.

fox2263@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 19:50 next collapse

An algorithm usually involves lots of complex calculations and weights. Picking a number from a pool of numbers at random is as simple as it gets.

b_n@sh.itjust.works on 10 Feb 2025 21:55 collapse

In comsci, there are no real random numbers. They are all seeded psuedo-random number algorithms. (Unless you integrate with some third party random as a service setup)

fox2263@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 22:09 next collapse

Yes but the common interpretation of “the algorithm” is that of the social media and YouTube style one. Recommending items of interest etc but easily manipulated by bad actors.

Wiki random is about as opposite to that as possible.

b_n@sh.itjust.works on 12 Feb 06:11 collapse

The modern interpretation, sure.

And agreed, “random, you might like this” is not as random as “here is a page on red food colouring”

weker01@sh.itjust.works on 10 Feb 2025 22:24 collapse

That’s a common misconception. You can measure a lot of ambient noise and extract entropy. Like time between inputs or how long it took an HDD to seek.

Most modern PC CPUs even have dedicated hardware for generating random numbers from electrical ambient noise. I don’t trust them however.

b_n@sh.itjust.works on 12 Feb 06:08 collapse

That’s why I said seeded. Seeded from noise. The random number generator (function) is still an algorithm…

blind3rdeye@lemm.ee on 11 Feb 2025 17:42 collapse

Right, but in the context of social media feeds, “algorithm” always refers to an algorithm for personalised content.

Rooty@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 09:16 collapse

Think of it as taking methadone instead of heroin.

higgsboson@dubvee.org on 10 Feb 2025 22:24 collapse

Ironically, my overly chatty doctor was ranting about how methadone is a racket and they string people along for years instead of titrating them off. He prescribes Suboxone, apparently.

x00z@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 00:00 next collapse

Sadly the design is pretty bad on desktop monitors.

fartknocker@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 00:08 next collapse

I can feel my butthole unclenching already 🥲

GluWu@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 00:31 next collapse

Saw this posted in a ADHD com a few days back. Every comment was just like “oh no…”. I opened it and like 20 minutes later realized, oh no. I can and have spent many entire days just reading Wikipedia and following linked subjects. So much so I run out in areas. I can’t handle a lot of visual and audio stimulation, short form content is such a nightmare for me, can’t watch it. But give me pages of the most dense info and I’m hooked. I just need the option to download every paper referenced from every Wikipedia page I visit.

andros_rex@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 00:42 next collapse

Having a real grand time adding a song from any musician I hit to a play list. I fucking love Awaz now.

miscellanii@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 01:24 next collapse

If someone made this for TV Tropes, I would never get anything productive done again

mechoman444@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 01:32 next collapse

Just got the app it’s absolutely fantastic.

LittleRatInALittleHat@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 01:50 next collapse

This is awesome. :3

Gsus4@mander.xyz on 10 Feb 2025 01:58 next collapse

Web 1.0 cures web 2.0 again.

parrhesia@sh.itjust.works on 12 Feb 2025 02:46 collapse

It’s a neat way to stumble upon interesting information randomly Time is a flat circle

58008@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 04:50 next collapse

Would be cool if the official Wikipedia mobile app integrated this functionality! It does have a ‘random articles’ card, but it’s nothing like this.

Not sure ‘addiction’ is being defeated here, though 😆 Like if I’m addicted to sausages, giving me bacon instead isn’t really solving the root of the issue. The issue being those sexy, sexy pigs.

Jolteon@lemmy.zip on 10 Feb 2025 05:51 collapse

The addiction isn’t being defeated, it’s just being redirected from something worthless to something useful. Well, at least less useless.

Kolanaki@pawb.social on 10 Feb 2025 05:00 next collapse

“Some people just wanna watch the world learn.”

pineapplelover@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 05:02 next collapse

Everyday I read wikipedia and everyday, I learn something new. Fucking love this free resource

fishos@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 05:16 next collapse

…so… content filters when? Let me limit it to certain subjects and I don’t need social media anymore 😂

thevoidzero@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 05:31 next collapse

I see the dev don’t want recommendation algorithm. All good to avoid the recommendation bubble, but a category/tags might be nice instead of random everything.

RedSnt@feddit.dk on 10 Feb 2025 07:29 next collapse

That’s actually really cool. I like that the dev has expressed that he doesn’t want to make the algorithm addictive and just keep it random 😅

MCasq_qsaCJ_234@lemmy.zip on 10 Feb 2025 13:02 next collapse

WikiTok > TikTok

Manalith@midwest.social on 10 Feb 2025 15:02 collapse

I know it needs to maintain the Wiki name for branding purposes, but WikTok meshes better.

Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de on 10 Feb 2025 15:53 collapse

Alternatively WikiToko would be cute

suodrazah@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 23:19 collapse

WikiTiki ?

stringere@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 00:35 collapse
AbsoluteChicagoDog@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 14:19 next collapse

This is exactly what I needed

wikitok.vercel.app

IndustryStandard@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 14:58 next collapse

I recall people in the past spending their day reading random Wikipedia trivia. Overal the knowledge is rather useless.

CileTheSane@lemmy.ca on 10 Feb 2025 15:06 next collapse

As opposed to spending the day reading social media where the knowledge is useful?

phoenixz@lemmy.ca on 10 Feb 2025 15:07 next collapse

Still better than endless tiktiok scroll, me thinks

Due to shitty company pokicies where I worked, I once had a 6 month stint of reading Wikipedia 4-6 hours a day out of boredom and fuck yeah did I learn a lot of bew things. Sure, not everything sticks, but it’s enough

CarbonBasedNPU@lemm.ee on 11 Feb 2025 13:52 collapse

Also just getting more word a day is great for your vocabulary. Ive been reading a lot more lately and have noticed that the more I read even relatively simple books that my vocabulary has vastly expanded even in everyday life. Im much less often left searching for a word because I have likely seen it more recently.

Darkhoof@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 15:45 next collapse

Because Tiktok is so much better.

ludrol@bookwormstory.social on 10 Feb 2025 16:26 next collapse

Useless knowledge is still better than tiktok journals.sagepub.com/doi/…/07067437221082854

sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 00:31 collapse

Information > misinformation

Anti_Face_Weapon@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 16:42 next collapse

Useless? Knowledge for its own sake is worth pursuing.

IndustryStandard@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 17:32 next collapse

Is it though?

<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/3db0ac0d-978f-46ad-8bd4-16579cf716cc.jpeg">

<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/df68c05b-882d-4328-9fd7-0a853d9c0dbe.jpeg">

ivanafterall@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 18:12 collapse

Depends on what you’re into, what you do, etc… Could be the difference between winning Final Jeopardy and not. Or being able to identify Alessandro Gazzi by name in a police lineup, for example.

sfxrlz@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 18:32 collapse

I mean you can just swipe if it’s not your jam. I think this is a great idea.

[deleted] on 10 Feb 2025 18:44 collapse

.

the_doktor@lemmy.zip on 10 Feb 2025 17:52 collapse

There is no knowledge that is not power.

AbsoluteChicagoDog@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 16:56 next collapse

Knowledge is a good in and of itself

Korhaka@sopuli.xyz on 10 Feb 2025 18:25 collapse

Maybe, but you will win more pub quizzes and it’s better than brainrot content

portuga@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 18:48 next collapse

I too find this such a nice refreshing take on wikipedia. It’s only been a few days, hope the developer improves it further. I realize some kind of recommendation algorithm opens a pandora’s box, but one can dream

comalnik@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 22:16 collapse

One big thing i hope they add is sorting by topic, so i can have a biology feed, a physics feed…

breadcat@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 19:24 collapse

they have this already, at least on the app version

demonsword@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 19:40 next collapse

I’m imagining one of those that feeds you random tvtropes instead

Theonetheycall1845@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 21:28 next collapse

I’ve downloaded the app and left a five star rating. The app works great! Please show support to this developer ❤️

Psythik@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 22:07 next collapse

I just installed it and was immediately annoyed by the auto-scrolling feature being turned on by default. Is that really how TikTok works? How does anyone put up with this shit?

cybercitizen4@lemm.ee on 10 Feb 2025 22:26 next collapse

It’s not. You have to enable autoscrolling on TikTok.

Theonetheycall1845@lemmy.world on 11 Feb 2025 00:13 collapse

Not sure but i support them for trying. Maybe leave a review and ask the dev to change it.

Squizzy@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 23:08 collapse

What app? Isnt just browser bsed?

Theonetheycall1845@lemmy.world on 11 Feb 2025 02:57 collapse

It’s app based. I found it on Google Play.

RedFrank24@lemmy.world on 10 Feb 2025 23:13 next collapse

Does it fight algorithm addiction or does it just utilise existing algorithm addiction to give you something slightly more informative?

grrgyle@slrpnk.net on 10 Feb 2025 23:40 next collapse

It’s like what vaping is to nicotine addiction.

Better than the alternative, buttt

sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 00:25 collapse

Butt nicotine? What kind of weird stuff you into?

RedFrank24@lemmy.world on 11 Feb 2025 11:50 next collapse

I think it’s more “Butt as an alternative to algorithms” which I fully agree with. Butts are better than algorithms

sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 14:49 collapse

Depends on the butt, I’ve seen some nice algorithms.

Overshoot2648@lemm.ee on 11 Feb 2025 19:10 collapse

Blowimg smoke up people’s asses, duh! /s

Hachiman@lemm.ee on 11 Feb 2025 00:39 next collapse

I would disagree on the “slightly more informative” part. I have used it and in my opinion, it’s “highly informative and educational”.

blind3rdeye@lemm.ee on 11 Feb 2025 17:40 collapse

Apparently it doesn’t use a personalised algorithm. So I’d say the first one.

sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works on 11 Feb 2025 00:32 next collapse

I want this, but with high quality news sources. And then sort such that topics are distributed.

cy_narrator@discuss.tchncs.de on 11 Feb 2025 13:32 next collapse

what is the likelihood of it having this or this(Go to Animals section)

Bali@lemmy.world on 11 Feb 2025 14:20 collapse

You are a Sadist Lmfao

dylanjustice@lemmy.ca on 11 Feb 2025 18:55 collapse

This should be gamified. Use an LLM to generate a mini-quiz on the topic to make sure I read it. Give me points for acquiring new useless knowledge, and let me compete with my friends and family.

dependencyinjection@discuss.tchncs.de on 11 Feb 2025 19:10 collapse

I like this idea.

I don’t know if I will do anything with it, but I would like to create something like this. Find it hard to develop when I’m not in work, as it feels like work.

reiterationstation@lemm.ee on 13 Feb 07:06 collapse

Do it!