avidamoeba@lemmy.ca
on 30 May 2024 07:24
nextcollapse
This road were going down, it doesn’t look good. Putting the content into a black box that rarely links the original source, let alone other sources is worse than Facebook content previews.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 07:43
nextcollapse
This is exactly what people like me warned about. The push for copyright-protections against GenAI is not going to stop GenAI. It’s just going to create a future where only the big players can make AI models because they can pay for “licenses” with those strong enough to threaten them (while scraping everyone else anyway) and just kill open sourced models.
We’re seeing it play it exactly like that. Y’all can’t stop GenAI. You literally don’t have enough power where it counts. The only sane solution is to push that any GenAI model trained on public data must have open weights by default.
flamingos@feddit.uk
on 30 May 2024 08:58
nextcollapse
If we don’t have the power to stop generative AI, then what makes you think we have the power the change copyright law? Generative AI uses up huge amount of power and water to the point of causing issues for national infrastructure. There is a clear climate case to be made against generative AI and unlike copyright law the public actually care about climate change.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 09:09
collapse
You cannot stop GenAI unless you stop sales of all gaming GPUs and recall all sold ones world wide. You just can’t. That cat’s out of the bag. You can try to restrict big corpos like OpenAI, but your politicians and bought already. Therefore adding your voice to trying to “stop GenAI” via copyright laws is just playing yourself. You can try to restrict GenAI via climate protections, but that will go as well as efforts to stop supporting genocides (or as well efforts have gone to protect the climate anyway).
If our politicians are already bought and sold to the point that calling for these industries to be regulated is pointless, then why would politicians listen to our calls for ‘open weights by default’.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 09:25
nextcollapse
They won’t, of course. But they will use the pressure towards copyrights against AI to kill open source GenAI progress. But at least when advocating for Open models, you don’t hurt the people who are doing FOSS.
applepie@kbin.social
on 30 May 2024 13:00
collapse
Bro that OpenAI clown daddy literally went to congress telling them to regulate them straight of Faceberg's playbook. These parasites ask for regulation once they feel good enough about their position.
Regulation entrenches them, after that it is time to harvest profits from captured market and abuse the peasants to Z MAX
applepie@kbin.social
on 30 May 2024 12:55
nextcollapse
Copyright/IP/patent law started as way to allow people to feed themselves off their labour but somehow this shit got turned into corpo fascist regime where "owners" own everything ever created indefinitely and they will use daddy Sam's BBC of laws to fuck any opposition.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 13:51
collapse
Copyright/IP/patent law started as way to allow people to feed themselves off their labour
Check out what happened when copyrights were first enacted. It was another enclosures “gold rush” where scammers went around and copied traditional songs people were using and declated copyrights, then went around and sued those same people.
applepie@kbin.social
on 30 May 2024 13:54
collapse
there is never a shortage of parasitic rent seekers and money changers...
society has yet to find a good way to deal with them but we got this:
Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves. “It is written,” he said to them, “‘My house will be called a house of prayer,’ but you are making it ‘a den of robbers.
kibiz0r@midwest.social
on 30 May 2024 13:40
collapse
Copyright law is broken. But I don’t think that means we have no obligations to each other as human beings when we build on each other’s work.
We had the same argument during the crypto craze. The financial system is broken, but 10 years later I think we all agree that crypto is pretty clearly not the answer.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 13:48
nextcollapse
Copyright law is broken. But I don’t think that means we have no obligations to each other as human beings when we build on each other’s work.
Absolutely! This is why I said anything built on public work, should be public goods as well.
We had the same argument during the crypto craze. The financial system is broken, but 10 years later I think we all agree that crypto is pretty clearly not the answer.
That’s not a good comparison. Crypto was a (bad) solution looking for a problem. GenAI already has use-cases.
kibiz0r@midwest.social
on 30 May 2024 14:04
collapse
This is why I said anything built on public work, should be public goods as well.
What if I don’t want certain people to build on my work, or to constrain the ways in which the build on it? (Non-commercial, share-alike, attribution, etc. clauses) Should I be able to?
That’s not a good comparison. Crypto was a (bad) solution looking for a problem. GenAI already has use-cases.
I didn’t mean to compare the technology – though there are some similar scam vectors, but that’s a different conversation.
I meant that there was a strong contingent of crypto fans back then who were saying – correctly – that “the mainstream system is corrupt and wields legislation as a weapon against consumers”. But their proposed alternative was a system that removed all regulation, including consumer protections.
I worry that there’s a trend in tech circles today that echoes that sentiment when it comes to AI.
I’m also rather disappointed that a substantial group of people who I used to assume I was aligned with – pirates and open-sourcerers – turned out to only be there for the free shit and not for the ethos.
An ethos which, to me, is something like: everyone has a right to participate in culture and be a part of the conversation, and everyone has a duty to acknowledge the work that enabled their own and do their best to be a good custodian of the upstream works.
db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 14:40
collapse
What if I don’t want certain people to build on my work, or to constrain the ways in which the build on it? (Non-commercial, share-alike, attribution, etc. clauses) Should I be able to?
No. The idea that someone should be allowed to control what others do with their expressions and ideas is a very new concept (~100 years) and it has not brought any benefit to society
technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 30 May 2024 15:21
collapse
we all agree that crypto is pretty clearly not the answer.
Tell that to anybody holding crypto as prices hang out around all time high.
Not to mention solving the problem with energy consumption which LLMs are beginning to dwarf.
And if you think state currency is the answer, then I have really bad news about how that’s been going…
RecallMadness@lemmy.nz
on 30 May 2024 10:01
nextcollapse
Alternate headline:
Companies accept money for a thing that will happen anyway, and will be unable to prove if they say no.
GenAi is unfortunately here, and the technocracy wants you to want it so they can farm you for more and more intimate data to leverage and enforce their technocracy.
And the only way they’re going to do it is by keeping the press positive, and feed it more and more data in the hopes it fixes things.
cbarrick@lemmy.world
on 30 May 2024 13:25
nextcollapse
Unfortunately, I think it’s been demonstrated that OpenAI will feed your data into their training pipeline whether you like it or not. They did this with YouTube. And they demonstrated this with Scarlett Johanson. (Even if they used a voice actor instead of actually scraping voice clips of her, it’s still unethical.)
So we knew they’d just scrape these articles anyway. This way, at least the publications get paid.
guacupado@lemmy.world
on 30 May 2024 16:20
collapse
I just saw an Inverse article about Mario Kart that said “could of.”
I can expect random people online to do that dumb shit, but not someone whose job is literally to write things.
threaded - newest
This road were going down, it doesn’t look good. Putting the content into a black box that rarely links the original source, let alone other sources is worse than Facebook content previews.
This is exactly what people like me warned about. The push for copyright-protections against GenAI is not going to stop GenAI. It’s just going to create a future where only the big players can make AI models because they can pay for “licenses” with those strong enough to threaten them (while scraping everyone else anyway) and just kill open sourced models.
We’re seeing it play it exactly like that. Y’all can’t stop GenAI. You literally don’t have enough power where it counts. The only sane solution is to push that any GenAI model trained on public data must have open weights by default.
If we don’t have the power to stop generative AI, then what makes you think we have the power the change copyright law? Generative AI uses up huge amount of power and water to the point of causing issues for national infrastructure. There is a clear climate case to be made against generative AI and unlike copyright law the public actually care about climate change.
You cannot stop GenAI unless you stop sales of all gaming GPUs and recall all sold ones world wide. You just can’t. That cat’s out of the bag. You can try to restrict big corpos like OpenAI, but your politicians and bought already. Therefore adding your voice to trying to “stop GenAI” via copyright laws is just playing yourself. You can try to restrict GenAI via climate protections, but that will go as well as efforts to stop supporting genocides (or as well efforts have gone to protect the climate anyway).
If our politicians are already bought and sold to the point that calling for these industries to be regulated is pointless, then why would politicians listen to our calls for ‘open weights by default’.
They won’t, of course. But they will use the pressure towards copyrights against AI to kill open source GenAI progress. But at least when advocating for Open models, you don’t hurt the people who are doing FOSS.
Bro that OpenAI clown daddy literally went to congress telling them to regulate them straight of Faceberg's playbook. These parasites ask for regulation once they feel good enough about their position.
Regulation entrenches them, after that it is time to harvest profits from captured market and abuse the peasants to Z MAX
Copyright/IP/patent law started as way to allow people to feed themselves off their labour but somehow this shit got turned into corpo fascist regime where "owners" own everything ever created indefinitely and they will use daddy Sam's BBC of laws to fuck any opposition.
Check out what happened when copyrights were first enacted. It was another enclosures “gold rush” where scammers went around and copied traditional songs people were using and declated copyrights, then went around and sued those same people.
there is never a shortage of parasitic rent seekers and money changers...
society has yet to find a good way to deal with them but we got this:
Copyright law is broken. But I don’t think that means we have no obligations to each other as human beings when we build on each other’s work.
We had the same argument during the crypto craze. The financial system is broken, but 10 years later I think we all agree that crypto is pretty clearly not the answer.
Absolutely! This is why I said anything built on public work, should be public goods as well.
That’s not a good comparison. Crypto was a (bad) solution looking for a problem. GenAI already has use-cases.
What if I don’t want certain people to build on my work, or to constrain the ways in which the build on it? (Non-commercial, share-alike, attribution, etc. clauses) Should I be able to?
I didn’t mean to compare the technology – though there are some similar scam vectors, but that’s a different conversation.
I meant that there was a strong contingent of crypto fans back then who were saying – correctly – that “the mainstream system is corrupt and wields legislation as a weapon against consumers”. But their proposed alternative was a system that removed all regulation, including consumer protections.
I worry that there’s a trend in tech circles today that echoes that sentiment when it comes to AI.
I’m also rather disappointed that a substantial group of people who I used to assume I was aligned with – pirates and open-sourcerers – turned out to only be there for the free shit and not for the ethos.
An ethos which, to me, is something like: everyone has a right to participate in culture and be a part of the conversation, and everyone has a duty to acknowledge the work that enabled their own and do their best to be a good custodian of the upstream works.
No. The idea that someone should be allowed to control what others do with their expressions and ideas is a very new concept (~100 years) and it has not brought any benefit to society
Tell that to anybody holding crypto as prices hang out around all time high.
Not to mention solving the problem with energy consumption which LLMs are beginning to dwarf.
And if you think state currency is the answer, then I have really bad news about how that’s been going…
Alternate headline:
GenAi is unfortunately here, and the technocracy wants you to want it so they can farm you for more and more intimate data to leverage and enforce their technocracy. And the only way they’re going to do it is by keeping the press positive, and feed it more and more data in the hopes it fixes things.
Unfortunately, I think it’s been demonstrated that OpenAI will feed your data into their training pipeline whether you like it or not. They did this with YouTube. And they demonstrated this with Scarlett Johanson. (Even if they used a voice actor instead of actually scraping voice clips of her, it’s still unethical.)
So we knew they’d just scrape these articles anyway. This way, at least the publications get paid.
I just saw an Inverse article about Mario Kart that said “could of.”
I can expect random people online to do that dumb shit, but not someone whose job is literally to write things.