Yen also pointed out how such a court decision could help cut inflation in the US, too, “by dropping the price of a significant chunk of digital purchases by 30% overnight”.
I bet most companies will just take that extra 30% as profit rather than giving it back to their users like proton has.
athairmor@lemmy.world
on 06 May 16:43
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Yeah, even of the companies don’t pocket the difference, he’s an idiot to suggest that this will cut inflation.
If someone purchases a Proton plan through their iOS app, Apple got a 30% cut of that. Which is stupid. Because Proton (and every other company with an iOS app) already pays Apple to simply have their app on Apple’s app store.
Proton…already pays Apple to simply have their app on Apple’s app store.
Uhhh I mean they pay a $100/year developer fee, which probably doesn’t even cover the infrastructure costs. Is that what you’re referring to?
I’m not arguing against you, Apple should consider those costs as a service to their (overpaying) customers. I’m just not sure what other costs you’re referring to.
Yes (I thought it was more, but w/e). I’ll admit, I don’t know a whole lot about development and everything that it entails, but nuance is key here. Say what you will about Proton, but this ruling just set a precedent that a company hosting an app/game download cannot take a cut from purchases completed within said app/game. That affects everyone.
I’m just looking at this from a bigger picture perspective. Apple has more than enough money already, and frankly there are far too many companies like this who need to be cut back down.
You have zero market. Pay to make your own payment portal, processing, etc etc. With what? Venture funding? Personal investment? Offload to square or PayPal and they take a cut instead?
Apple charges 15% (not 30% for under 2 mil) of each $1. Making 85c per transaction with no upfront costs seems reasonable.
That explains my experience. I just brought proton vpn for the easiest travel solution for me, and when I was shopping around I thought I was losing my mind. Checked the price online and it was one price and then checked from the Apple app for convenience and it was higher. I was confused, but just bought it online and used it on the app after (along with other devices).
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 06 May 17:22
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Every company who takes a cut from in-app purchases, be it subscriptions or DLC, should be kneecapped by this ruling.
It’s one thing for the hosting marketplace (App Store, Steam, Play Store, etc) to take a cut from the initial purchase of a game/app. But it’s a whole other issue for that initial marketplace to keep reaching further into the dev’s pockets and take a cut from in-app purchases unrelated to where it was originally obtained.
That just turns paid apps into splash screens for in-app purchases though. That way apple never gets a cut because the “purchase” is in-app. Pay to be listed (maybe tiered depending on downloads) seems fair especially because it doesn’t incentivize people to do scammy things with pricing. It’s already a fee anyway.
I’m not entirely optimistic about this ruling, but we’ll see.
Apple had no reason NOT to give refunds and then use their weight to claw it back from the app developer.
But what happens when not-too-legit apps use non-AppStore external sites to unlock features in an app?
In a perfect world it’s cheap and easy and reliable.
But it can also be a scammy shop that lures you into expensive subscriptions with no easy way to cancel them (eg. gym membership) and what happens when Little Timmy spends $9000 for Nlartbux in a mobile game’s external store?
Could go either way 🤷🏻♂️
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 06 May 18:26
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I’m not entirely optimistic about this ruling, but we’ll see.
Apple had no reason NOT to give refunds and then use their weight to claw it back from the app developer.
Greed.
But what happens when not-too-legit apps use non-AppStore external sites to unlock features in an app?
I suppose we will see what happens. That’s a very slippery slope though, full of FUD, and is the same logic that Apple, Microsoft, and others try to use to keep users locked into their walled gardens.
In a perfect world it’s cheap and easy and reliable.
But it can also be a scammy shop that lures you into expensive subscriptions with no easy way to cancel them (eg. gym membership) and what happens when Little Timmy spends $9000 for Nlartbux in a mobile game’s external store?
Could be. Multiple alternative markets exist for Android already though, and some shops are scammy as fuck. Google has already put protections in place to prevent sideloading potentially harmful apps (including alternative markets), but the savvy user who knows how to bypass those restrictions should* know how to spot scammy shit.
That’s a failure of the parent. My 5 year old likes to do the “color by number” things on my phone (waiting at dr appts and whatnot), and even she understands not to click on the ads, or to at least hand it back to me if one comes up.
hikaru755@lemmy.world
on 06 May 21:58
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What? Since when does Valve prohibit companies from redirecting customers to non-Valve purchasing flows? Because that’s what this ruling is about, it says Apple can’t prohibit apps from telling users to go buy off-platform for lower prices. Valve isn’t doing that with Steam afaik, actually I’m not aware of any other platform that does this
JimmyMcGill@lemmy.world
on 06 May 22:37
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Valve will even allow developers to create their own Steam keys free of charge and sell them wherever they want with no commission whatsoever
That’s pretty open I’d say
sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 08 May 15:40
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Lol, as long as you properly plan in advance and coordinate such a thing, not the way that uh… Dead Matter tried to do it.
I have many issues with the gamer deference to the steam monopoly… But they don’t partake in this particular abuse: taking a cut from the dev for all in game purchases. They only take a (sizeable) cut for the initial game purchase.
TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world
on 07 May 06:58
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They literally do not lol
In game purchases in steam games don’t have to pay Valve, nor does Valve prevent you from uploading your game to other stores, which is what this ruling was about.
Or he’s just shitting on other companies who he knows are too greedy to do the same. Proton is getting positive press for this and he’s leaning into it with a bit of hyperbole
Not saying he’s a genius or anything, he’s just a spokesperson doing spokesperson things
Interesting that Andy Yen does not have a Wiki page. But Proton says “Previously, Andy was a research scientist at CERN and has a PhD in particle physics from Harvard University.” so, I think he’s very smart, he’s just outside of his lane here.
sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 08 May 15:25
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So, I initially wanted to just kneejerk respond yes, it is absurd to suggest this ruling against Apple… would have any kind of generally noticable effect on inflation.
But I wanted to check the actual numbers.
Ok, so, total US consumer spending in 2024 is about $64 Trillion.
… The Apple App Store generated $105 Billion in revenue in 2024.
Ok, napkin math: 30% off of lets just say literally all App Store payments… , ok, we’ve cut costs by about $32 Billion… shave that off the $64 Trillion…
And voila!
A rough general price reduction of… 0.05%
Call a median US yearly income $60K, and they’ve saved $30 bucks. Maybe the cost of either one or two DoorDash meals, depending on where you live… probably much closer to just one.
It’s not. It’s just related to the competition AKA what people are willing to pay.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
on 08 May 15:14
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With enough competition, someone is going to compete on price to attract customers. They obviously can’t sell for less than their costs (again, sufficiently competitive so you don’t get monopolies starving their competition), so that’s the floor for what they can sustainably charge.
It doesn’t matter what the service is, if there are enough viable alternatives, at least one of them will go for the value play. Customers aren’t willing to pay more than they have to, so they’ll be attracted to lower cost options.
What I’m saying is that competition is included in “what people are willing to pay”. Cost of production is not.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
on 08 May 15:27
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Sure. But if people aren’t willing to pay more than the cost of production, games wouldn’t be made. The cost of production is the floor, and the cost people are willing to pay is the ceiling, and competition finds a line somewhere in the middle. The more competition, the closer it is to the cost of production.
if people aren’t willing to pay more than the cost of production, games wouldn’t be made.
Then that unmade game wouldn’t be relevant to this discussion.
The cost of production is the floor, and the cost people are willing to pay is the ceiling, and competition finds a line somewhere in the middle
Again, no it doesn’t. “What people are willing to pay” includes the competition. If one company undercuts another with a comparable product, consumers won’t pay for the more expensive one.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
on 08 May 15:43
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People would be willing to pay more if there wasn’t as much competition. People obviously want to pay less, and companies obviously want to charge more, so the real variable here is how competitive the market is. And the more competitive the market, the closer to production costs companies are able to pay.
The variable here isn’t how much people are willing to pay, that’s elastic and depends on competition. The real variable is competitiveness in the market, since that is what drives prices closer to production costs.
Companies that were app-first like mobile games probably won’t cut prices much if any. Companies that were web-first like Proton and Patreon probably will.
That is a very broad generalization. First of all inflation is not just some co-product of economic activity. It has specific reasons. An economy is not stagnant because the oil price sinks after geopolitical tensions ease. An economy is not stagnant because businesses are kept from price gouging in cartels or monopoly situations.
Also “stagnant” is not inherently bad. The reason why we need economic growth is because the super rich are siphoning off more and more wealth, so economic growth is the only thing keeping poor people from revolting. A zero growth or even degrowth economy could serve the people very well, if wealth wouldn’t be hoarded away by select few.
CaptainBasculin@lemmy.bascul.in
on 06 May 16:35
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based move
philycheeze@sh.itjust.works
on 06 May 16:42
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Do he still think fascism is good for small businesses though?
It sounds like that is the same as saying “you can’t oppose corporate monopolies without openly opposing fascism”
There is a lot of risk in that sort of intentional abdication of nuance, hopefully self-evident to you and to all who read this.
gofsckyourself@lemmy.world
on 07 May 03:07
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The difference is that he could have just not said anything, yet he chose to praise Republicans and denounce Democrats. Sure, there’s plenty of reasons to denounce Democrats, but putting that alongside praising Republicans is beyond tone-deaf.
It was the same with Elon before he went head first into facism. They usually start by selling themselves as liberal with some occasional praise of conservatives. Then later claim they are moderate or the go to favorite of tech bros claiming they are libertarian, since saying they are conservative might receive backlash.
philycheeze@sh.itjust.works
on 06 May 17:26
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So not really. Thanks for the actual answer.
Edit: goddamn, you actually changed my view somewhat and people still go piling on lol
Why is it bad though? This business is in no form related to politics. It wouldn’t change fundamentally even if Hitler ran it.
philycheeze@sh.itjust.works
on 07 May 16:06
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I’m not going to willingly put my money towards someone who supports that kind of thing. The first response to my comment was a very level headed response and provided evidence that he does not directly support the administration.
Still doesn’t provide me a lot of consumer confidence though.
Maybe you should reconsider your threat model. You seem to be very light on information. If political views is an issue than you’re the issue.
gimmemahlulz@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 08 May 13:57
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Political views are 100% the issue, they drive all other business decisions. If you’re fucked enough to support what’s going on in the US government, I can’t trust you to be a normal human, let alone run a business.
suicidaleggroll@lemm.ee
on 06 May 16:49
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If they can charge 30% less without Apple’s fees, then why are their prices the same whether you buy on their iOS app or direct on their website? Why have they been overcharging users who don’t buy through the iOS app by 30% all this time?
Scipitie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 06 May 17:00
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Old knowledge disclaimer, but if they didn’t change it then:
Because Apple literally tells people that they’re not allowed to charge less somewhere else - at least that was the case several years ago…
This is the same on most platforms. You’ll rarely find a product for different prices in different places because if they’re listed on Amazon, Steam, Apple, Google, etc. they’re not allowed to.
That isn’t exactly true with Steam. Valve does allow a dev to offer a discount at a different store as long as that same discount comes to Steam in a reasonable amount of time.
Straight from the docs:“It’s OK to run a discount for Steam Keys on different stores at different times as long as you plan to give a comparable offer to Steam customers within a reasonable amount of time.”
That’s probably only for selling steam keys on another store. You might be able to sell non steam versions for any price you want
patrick@lemmy.bestiver.se
on 06 May 17:42
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Some things do charge different amounts though. YouTube Premium for example is more expensive if you subscribe in iOS but maybe that’s just because it’s Google.
They also could have just not let anyone subscribe through the iOS app. Lots of things do that.
When people tell you the laws are behind internet they’re taking about this all of this ND social media is unregulated but imagine if psychological abuse was the reason social media was successful.
chiliedogg@lemmy.world
on 06 May 17:09
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Because Apple prohibited that.
MangoPenguin@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 06 May 17:36
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Likely they were not allowed to by the terms they agreed to with apple.
Most favored nation clause. Apple gets the lowest price that you offer. I’d you offer any discounts elsewhere, that have to be the same on the app store
compostgoblin@slrpnk.net
on 06 May 17:35
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Cool! Still not gonna put all my eggs in the fascist-sympathetic basket
It doesn't matter either way. Never do it that anyway. You would think people would learn a thing after being thoroughly fucked by apple and google...
It is amazing how sundar and Tim literally violated you in sexually uncomfortable ways but you are crying about Andy being a pathetic regime whore...
AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world
on 06 May 17:38
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No doubt Proton’s CEO will use this to justify his “Trump is better for regulating big tech” claim, while ignoring that the judge is an Obama appointee.
Too bad the owner of Proton supports Trump, so when my two years subscription ends, I’m moving to Tuta or Posteo
anachrohack@lemmy.world
on 07 May 10:52
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I moves to proton because I was paying for a vpn, storage, and password manager and it all came out to like ~$45/mo. Proton gives me all that for $30/mo. This was the 3rd password manager I had my family migrate to so I think I’m gonna stick with them for a bit unless I see some kind of evidence that proton is violating the security of its users for governments. I don’t want to have my family have to move to yet ANOTHER password manager
gusgalarnyk@lemmy.world
on 07 May 10:52
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throwawayacc0430@sh.itjust.works
on 07 May 03:29
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So, Mr. Yen, are you still sympathetic to the republicans, who have a disdain for the same courts that gave you a win?
Or is your head burried so deep in your particle accelerator you don’t even have any clue about politics?
Dude thinks he knows everything because he has a PhD in Physics, literally out of touch with the politics that anyone doing 5 minutes of web searching can understand.
no no, you see Trump is totally anti-big tech. once he bleeds them dry from all the bribes they’ll be gone!
/s
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 07 May 10:55
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Dude thinks he knows everything because he has a PhD in Physics, literally out of touch with the politics that anyone doing 5 minutes of web searching can understand.
This is such a common thing. STEM education needs to be more well rounded.
Why? Idiots thinking they know more than they do won’t be stopped by this. Also if we wanted to round humanities and liberal arts by making it mandatory to pass analysis, linear algebra, organic chemistry and classical physics would just lead to much more people not graduating anything.
School is for a general education. Academia is for specialization.
I can only speak for myself… But I had 2+ years at university before declaring a (STEM) major, allowing me to take courses in political science, history, etc.
So, as someone with a STEM degree, in a field of specialists who have zero understanding of the real world outside of their field, the difference is instantly recognizable.
The idea that a more well rounded education can ever be a bad thing is just straight up ignorant and it comes off as some sort of insecurity on your part.
Nobody is kept from taking additional education if they want to, like you did. But the general education should be from school and school education needs to define the standard of what everyone should know or should at least have known at some point so he or she can refresh upon it.
If you make it mandatory to make academic education contain every subject like school did, you will end up with programs taking 20 years instead of 5 years to graduate. If you want to discriminate against certain subjects you end up in the same trap of defining certain subjects as relevant and others as irrelevant, like the criticized “STEM-lords”
What does politics even have to do with a ruling like this? Isn’t the law separated from the government in the US? Or is the US just a corrupt country that allow people to influence the judges ruling to impact the lawsuit in a certain outcome … O wait …
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 07 May 07:10
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Inb4 Trump invents tariffs on foreign coded software
This article keeps getting posted but it really just shows the author doesn’t understand the issue that was presented. It goes as far as brushing of the criticism almost immediately. Truth is Proton decided they would publicly praise a running fascist leader for goodboy points
Proton didn’t decide anything, Andy Yen posted ONE tweet and then doubled down on it with the Proton Reddit account which was deleted.
I know the US is really into this “us vs them” or Republicans against the Democrats or whatever you want to and that is fair, that’s how US policies sadly work which is also one of the reasons why the country is basically corrupt.
For most people agreeing with one statement a politician made doesn’t mean anything. I can agree with some things Geert Wilders said, but that doesn’t mean Ill vote for him.
There are other articles about the whole situation, but I believe that the Tweet says more than the bullshit some people have been shouting on every post regarding Proton. Share the Tweet yes, but don’t share the bullshit.
Never said I was American. Proton as a team has kept him on so that’s their answer. He did not have to make a post at all complementing Donald but he did and that fact says A LOT.
Who else’s opinion should I barade them with then? I was a loyal customer and this was something I felt ruined their reputation to myself and anyone that should be looking to find a solution that doesn’t show sympathies for fascist regimes. And I feel the Medium article I initially commented on brushes those concerns away and focus on “but are they MAGA?”
I am sorry, but I find it so absurd that people can literally kick somebody or a company down because of something relatively small.
Most companies can be found dirt on, what are you going to do?
I am just saying that there is more to the story than just calling somebody a MAGA supporter which these days is basically calling somebody a Nazi
I can say the same thing about you mentioning god. Religious conservatives have been an issue in the US (and outside the US as well) for years. But I am not going to call you out publicly for doing that either.
Now fascists are different, but agreeing with a more economic focussed standpoint doesn’t mean you have sympathy for fascists. I am progessive-center right aligned in politics, what are you gonna call me a Nazi?
The US politics don’t lend for people to have specific directions with their votes.
Proton the company and the foundation are still on the consumer side of the while discussion and besides a deleted Tweet that aint gonna happen.
booly@sh.itjust.works
on 07 May 13:43
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Proton didn’t decide anything, Andy Yen posted ONE tweet and then doubled down on it with the Proton Reddit account which was deleted.
How are you going to say that Proton didn’t say anything and then acknowledge that the official Proton social media accounts were making statements like this:
Until corporate Dems are thrown out, the reality is that Republicans remain more likely to tackle Big Tech abuses
That’s the context you keep brushing under the rug. The official Proton position is not just that Trump made a good choice, on this one thing, it’s that you should vote for Republicans over Democrats.
Yes, it was official corporate Proton position to delete that comment. But it was the official Proton position to make that comment in the first place.
I don’t brush anything under the rug. I actively shared the Tweet that started this hole BS.
Well fair, maybe I should have shown their response. They doubled down on it, but they also deleted it.
Both of the American parties are a shitshow, but then again America is just corrupt anyway. Trump didn’t even have 50% of the votes.
Saying “Proton = Maga” or whatever doesn’t shed light on the issue either. In the end I believe more in actions than words (and i have faith in a decent governance structure) and I believe that people should take their own conclusion on the matter based on the Tweet and well yeah I should start linking the Reddit post again.
The moment Proton itself starts to fuck things over I am out of there as well, but currently I prepaid just before this came to light, but I use my own domain so mhe
I don’t brush anything under the rug. I actively shared the Tweet that started this hole BS.
I get that. But my point is that you can’t claim that Proton’s CEO is acting independently of the Proton corporation itself when Proton’s official corporate accounts chimed in on his side on this.
Both of the American parties are a shitshow
Not on antitrust. The Biden administration was one of the strongest advocates for consumers on antitrust issues we’ve seen since Robert Bork convinced Reagan to tear it all down.
Anyone who says otherwise is trying to lie to the American public about it, and should be called out for actively advocating for false MAGA propaganda. Andy Yen did it, and Proton agreed with it.
Proton’s official account also deleted the comment and Yen created a new account for himself so Proton did what eas really required by any rule book or whatever you wanna call it in situations like this.
So no I wouldn’t say Proton agreed on it.
Call him out for his tweet or Protons post fair, but that doesnt him a MAGA supporter. It just makes him a supporter of a bullshit statement. And it definitely doesn’t make Proton MAGA. Nuances are needed to make it so people can have their own opinions formed and we don’t get a black or white/good or bad view on the world.
anachrohack@lemmy.world
on 08 May 12:31
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Calling this an “us vs them” is disingenuous. Republicans are actively shredding the rule of law in the US by the day. Democrats are weak on some policy points (though not tech policy, by the way). The two are not the same at all
Well yes, but Proton is still located in Switzerland and has a decent governance structure in play with a non profit.
He cannot just kill the company by switching it’s core USP
I mean this is like saying "I only agree with that one thing Hitler did" and then trying to explain to everyone why you felt the need to defend Hitler. I mean sure, there were probably a handful of policies the Nazis got right, but people are going to look at you funny if you go around phrasing it like that. Especially, in this case, if that "one thing" was actually just praise for shitty authoritarian policies.
Proton itself never directly commited on anything from Trump in a positive way.
Their current CEO Andy Yen posted this Tweet. Yes he is an idiot and even doubled down on it with the Proton account
Now I am not from a country with a 2 party system, but last time I checked agreeing with one statement from somebody doesn’t mean you support them. Heck finding common ground is often a way to find compromises.
Do what you want and don’t support them if you don’t want them, but don’t act like the company Proton is a Trump supporter. Heck there are a lot of articles on the Proton site which are pro privacy and pro consumer.
Andy Yen went out of his way to criticize Democrats on antitrust, which is how you can tell it’s actually a pro-Trump position unsupported by the actual facts.
I like Gail Slater. She’s possibly the best choice among people who Trump likes, to head DOJ’s Antitrust Division. She has bipartisan bona fides.
But to say that Democrats, after 4 years of Lina Khan leading the FTC, and a bunch of the reforms that the Biden FTC and DOJ made to merger standards and their willingness to sue/seek big penalties for antitrust violations, aren’t more serious than Republicans about reining in big tech consolidation and about stronger enforcement of antitrust principles, completely flips around the history and is a bad faith argument.
Andy Yen could’ve praised Gail Slater, and that would be that. Instead, he took a post by Trump that didn’t even mention Democrats, and made it about how the Democrats are bad on taking on big tech. That’s the problem everyone had with it.
Well yeah he did support a Trump statement and went out of his way to do it. Later stupidly doubled down on it by using the official response.
But, and this might be because I am not American and live in a country where politics aren’t so black and white, but I fail to see how that means you are a MAGA nut/Trump supporter or what not. Especially not because he hasn’t taken action (will be hard to do anyway since he is not American).
And there is a strong governance structure with Andy Yen only having 33% power on final says since he is 1 of 3 people in the Proton Foundation which is the shareholder of the Proton company.
Name some policies of Adolf Hitler that you support
PyroNeurosis@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 08 May 13:25
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The policy on preservation of natural areas was not terrible. It was probably executed poorly and wasn’t intended to be anything but a bludgeon of the state to displace people, but nature preservation as a concept is a necessity.
medgremlin@midwest.social
on 07 May 13:43
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Yeah, my 2 year plan is up in June. I haven’t decided what I’m switching to. I’ve heard good things about Mullvad’s privacy policies and politics, but I’ve also seen reviews that a bunch of sites and services have them blocked.
I’m open to suggestions at this point.
uawarebrah@sh.itjust.works
on 07 May 14:13
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Mullvad is the gold standard
medgremlin@midwest.social
on 07 May 14:21
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That’s what I’ve been seeing. I don’t use Netflix anyways and I mostly just have a VPN for when I’m on a university or hospital campus and I’d like to keep my internet usage private. (Or when sailing the high seas for books.)
He approved of an appointment Trump made, and criticized Dem on the issue – doesn’t make him a Trump supporter. If we can’t tell the Dems off when we think the GOP does better, how can we proceed?
People aren’t criticizing him because he criticized the democrats. Liberals and leftists are pretty unhappy with the DNC right now, too. Anybody can criticize the democrats all day if they want, thats not forbidden.
They’re criticizing him because the things he said are actually fucking braindead retarded.
I’d use their VPN even if Hitler owns it. It’s private, secure and they stand to their values with respect to that. Why would I care about political views? Politics don’t change the service on a technical level. Literally don’t give a shit.
Except politics, actually, can change the service. For example, surrendering data in secret. Or installing backdoors.
Not that I think Proton is gonna do that (or at least hope so), but thinking “why would I care about politics, they don’t affect the app on a technical level” is incredibly naive and potentially incorrect.
With an over-the-top example, it’s kinda like saying “why should I care about the politics of my landlord after they support the “Increase Tenant’s Rent” party, it doesn’t change the service”
doodledup@lemmy.world
on 08 May 04:01
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If your threat model depends of political idiologies then you should reconsider your threat model.
If a person signals loyalty to a criminal government which is violating the rights of its people daily, why would I trust them not to cooperate with that government when they ask for a backdoor to be installed? Conservatives are simply not trustworthy. They’re lying, backstabbing, and manipulative. They have no principles at all and will say or do anything to acquire more power and money
So why do you trust any company? Every company has people like that employed. Do you make a political-views check on every employee of a company before choosing your product?
Call me crazy, but I think there is a bit of difference between the average worker, and CEOs, investors and execs, in terms of hability to sway the company one way or another.
commander@lemmy.world
on 07 May 15:33
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Damn. People here sure love purity testing. The guy could pay for their cancer treatment and still slap him every chance because they got it wrong publicly in the past but once you get it wrong publicly once, you’re out of the club. Go be a conservative we don’t want you. When someone at Tuta has a bad year and ends up in the wrong publicly, find another email service to try and convince people to go too. Probably worse in functionality than Tuta as you go down to smaller and worse funded efforts in this niche field of Internet activism
But people here do it here too to Mozilla because they don’t like their social outreach programs and their attempts to get advertising revenue so screw Mozilla too. So because nothing but perfection is acceptable, push away people that may be adjacent/left leaning right and switch to less developed products. Switch from Firefox and attack Mozilla who do the bulk of Firefox development and use Waterfox who do a custom deployment/build. Pure display of perfection being the enemy of good here.
You want people to embrace privacy but keep whiplashing people around when the org/anyone in leadership says something wrong. Screw Signal, they’re not perfect. Screw Matrix/Element, some developer said something one day so it’s all bad. I’m surprised anyone here uses any privacy software or a major open source software like Linux or Krita or Blender at the risk that someone in the background may be wrong in someway which I am 100% certain they exist in important positions. Same with Lemmy
Go back to the 60s and you all would be shitting on Fred Hampton for accepting the impure and the color coalition for everyone that had ever said something wrong. Al Franken definitely would not make it with y’all. Y’all can’t build up leftist communities because y’all are bitter assholes that can’t move on and spend so much time purity testing. Y’all are probably mediocre too so can’t make a difference in privacy and data ownership activism anyways so should be lining up to support not just Tuta, someone hasn’t screwed up publicly yet, and Proton
Reminds me of Aung San Suu Kyi. She was under the gun of the military ruling class that permitted limited democratic government and because she didn’t make speech as if she lived in the US, a bunch of Americans turned on her and celebrated when the military dictatorship came back to rule and put her in prison the moment it seemed like the civilian government would actually assert more power
It’s not a purity test so much as a fear that publicly signaling loyalty to trump devalued their trustworthiness as private and secure. If their CEO legitimately believes that Republicans are better on tech policy than democrats because conservatives want to weaponize the federal government to control speech online, then I don’t really trust him not to cooperate with federal authorities when they want to access someone’s emails or vpn traffic. Conservatives are simply not trustworthy to me
crypt0cler1c@infosec.pub
on 08 May 12:26
nextcollapse
This is literally just insane rambling. You need serious media literacy.
He endorsed the republican party. He said we should clean house of democrats. Is that not declaring party loyalty? It was also a completely unnecessary comment, in response to nothing. It was shortly after Trump’s election when every CEO went out of their way to kowtow to the new regime. Its transparently a loyalty pledge to the new boss
The fact that you inflate the meaning of that tweet to make it more meaningful than it is, doesn’t mean he did anything of the sort.
The tweet happened after the election but before the government, and it was an endorsement of the antitrust appointee. He also expressed his opinion that republicans were more likely than democrats to fight big tech monopolies in the antitrust space. This is far from an endorsement.
It was also a completely unnecessary comment, in response to nothing.
It was in response to Trump’s tweet about the antitrust appointee. I would say quite relevant context for a tweet about the antitrust appointee.
It was unnecessary, true. Like every tweet. He expressed his unnecessary opinion, the same way we are doing now.
10 years ago, Republicans were the party of big business and Dems stood for the little guys, but today the tables have completely turned.
Bro I mean come on, this is literally an endorsement of the republican party. I don’t know how more explicit it can get. You’re asking people to not believe their own eyes here. Even worse:
By working on the front lines of many policy issues, we have seen the shift between Dems and Republicans over the past decade first hand. And that’s a missed opportunity for Dems, because by and large, support for cracking down on corporate monopolies is popular on both sides of the political spectrum. Unfortunately, corporate capture of Dems is real and in the end money won. It is hard to see how this changes, and Republicans are likely to lead the antitrust charge in the coming years
He decries the “corporate capture” of the Democratic party while completely failing to address to much larger and more immediate threat of an outright christo-fascist movement capturing the entire Republican party and all 3 branches of federal government. Like he thinks that “the democrats didnt move as fast on this thing as I wanted them to” somehow compares to “the president is kidnapping people with a personal army of gestapo and disappearing them to a black site in El Salvador”.
And you may say “well he’s not interested in immigration policy; he’s interested in technology policy”. If you are in the business of privacy and security, then you should not be putting yourself in the corner of a political cult with zero respect for the law, zero guiding moral principles, and which is only motivated by using any means necessary to crush their political enemies. Yen is supporting a wannabe dictator because he’s willing to weaponize the federal government to destroy his competitors.
If all he said was “good pick by Trump, look forward to working with them”, I’d accept it as a politically neutral statement that you often see from business leaders and even democratic politicians sometimes. But he went out of his way to demonize the democratic party and somehow hold the Republicans up as the defenders of small business
It’s such an unbelievably bad take (which he dug in on like 5 times even though he could have said nothing and waited for it to blow over) and completely tone deaf as to be unbelievable. Like I literally don’t believe that he doesn’t know what he’s saying; I think he, like many tech CEOs, is simply a conservative who’s too ashamed to admit it.
Yes, the whole discussion is around antitrust, and he thinks republicans have a chance to do better than democrats there. There is nothing to “bro” about, it’s pretty clear from the context.
If he said any of that before the election, I could vaguely read an endorsement for single-issue voters. Saying republicans are better than democrats in fighting antitrust after Democrats shat their pants about it, doesn’t sound an endorsement to me.
The rest of this comment is out of topic. His focus (and his company focus) has always been on a specific political area. So there is no expectation that he would address the whole political scenario, when he was talking about that narrow area.
But he went out of his way to demonize the democratic party and somehow hold the Republicans up as the defenders of small business
So this is what bothers you? A completely legitimate critique of the democratic party?
Well, I personally cannot care less, but you do you.
I see the issue as very simple:
Him and his company work in the privacy space. Tech monopolies are a problem because captured people. Improving in this space is a win for privacy. Which is not something that is beneficial “in a vacuum”, it’s beneficial to all those vulnerable people that will be attacked by this government, or the next. he expressed optimism about the fact that republicans can do better than democrats here. Period. Naive, wrong, whatever. A legitimate opinion based on his reading of the last few years’ trend.
No endorsement, no “pledge loyalty”, nothing. Just a consideration. He also mentioned on his reddit account that ultimately actions will be what will count (as it is obvious).
So to me this is legitimately a nothing burger. I cannot care less that people in US (and in many more places) live politics like a football game. I cannot care less that you or others got hurt because he criticized Democrats. They could and should do better, and then if the critique is unfair I will be there saying that he “goes out of his way” to criticize them. So far he clearly motivated his opinion with what Schumer did.
This. It's amazing how naive people here can be just because they fanboyed some random CEO before they were revealed to be problematic.
commander@lemmy.world
on 08 May 13:58
nextcollapse
That’s just ad hominem to say people are fanboying the CEO. I never heard the name of the CEO until people started complaining about him. Then I read the statements he put out and that people are hysterical over and reading into as if he’s some Trump fanboy. The guys not even an American. He doesn’t live in the US. He just runs a service as an alternative to the big tech companies. Was he even in the US for anything but his university years and he’s 40?
Americans read more into him than his record and statements say. Not everyone’s politics revolve around Americans. I’m waiting for American leftist to turn on Shawn Fain too for supporting Trump auto tariffs and be anti auto workers union because too many in the union are Trump supporters and even someone in opposition like Shawn Fain is supporting a Trump policy. That’s even more direct and influential than a guy in Europe that runs a niche privacy centric internet service company
Problematic, barely. It’s a handful of statements months ago compared to his life of work. Magnifying glass to your whole life and people would likely find something problematic. If this guy is representative of what a problematic person is, the world would be pretty solid. Waste of energy to be so anti this guy and Proton when it’s a service more conducive to privacy rights than anything I or probably any of us have done. Problematic has become such an empty insult with how easily it’s thrown around with such passion. Waste of passion
Yeah a lot of people fan over celeberties politicians or CEO’s, but at the same time a lot of people also hate those same people for various reasons.
And people believe in bad against bad and not even the law anymore and don’t believe in second changes or forgiveness.
I am sad because of all the people in this thread who think the CEO is “fascist-sympathetic” because he said Trump did something better than the Democrats one time.
Nobilmantis@feddit.it
on 07 May 16:18
nextcollapse
Absolutely agreed. I think when you have such role in a company you should avoid making political statements at all, because no matter what you say you will end up upsetting some people. In this case, “try-hard” democrats.
Well, it’s worth leveraging your status to communicate to the politicians things they’ve done well (i.e. this tweet). In this case, it cost him more than I think he was expecting.
Yeah he should’ve said what he said more tactfully. But sometimes one’s most controversial comments are ones that one wouldn’t have thought would get a lot of attention at all.
Yeah, having only just switched from GMail to Proton last week my heart sank when I saw “Proton are MAGA”.
Then I spent three minutes reading up on it and it’s like, the CEO said one thing about policy on regulation of big tech that was critical of the Democrats for not doing enough, and the internet has decided that means he’s MAGA.
He said Republicans are better on tech policy than democrats. Republicans tech policy is motivated entirely by the fact that their racist and conspiratorial views were getting them banned on social media sites from 2015 - 2024
Conservatives have absolutely zero principles. If they say they want to break up big tech, it’s because they want to control it in some way. They want the platforms to promote speech that’s beneficial to them.
If you believe that Republicans truly are better for tech policy than democrats, then you either whole-heartedly agree that a group of criminals and wannabe dictators should be able to destroy any business that publishes speech against them, or you are extremely gullible. Either way, why would I want to give you my business?
Republicans tech policy is motivated entirely by the fact that their racist and conspiratorial views were getting them banned on social media sites from 2015 - 2024
And i should care because…? Why should I care why republicans wanted to break up tech monopolies, if breaking monopolies is anyway something that I consider a positive change?
Breaking monopolies give people more choice. More choice (free) leads to hopefully people choosing more privacy conscious tools. More privacy means less data that can be handed over to doge, less data that ICE has to target minorities, etc.
then you either whole-heartedly agree that a group of criminals and wannabe dictators should be able to destroy any business that publishes speech against them, or you are extremely gullible.
Those are not the only 2 options.
I am instead very happy that they will do the right thing for the wrong reason, and outside those monopolies more people will choose services that republicans have no power over.
Moreover, your whole argument assumes someone is in US. I am sympathetic to the people in US, but tech monopolies are a global problem.
Why should I care why republicans wanted to break up tech monopolies, if breaking monopolies is anyway something that I consider a positive change?
Because they’re not interested in breaking up monopolies; they’re interested in threatening their political enemies with breakup so they can control speech on those platforms. Mark Zuckerberg is kowtowing to Trump now to avoid being broken up.
You think the Republicans are going to break up tech and create a more diverse online publishing ecosystem that’s harder for any one party to control? No, they’ll crush their enemies and bolster their allies, so we’ll end up with even fewer choices
There are less than 10 companies that control almost the entire tech space. What “fewer choices”…?
Breaking up google would be already enough, which is what the focus was.
All your comment sounds very fuzzy to me. Basically the whole antitrust thing is on google, if republicans break it up, great. Which " allies" are they going to bolster?
Should have done a valve and allowed selling anywhere but require price parity. Now from their greed there will be financial incentive for people to use another platform.
threaded - newest
I bet most companies will just take that extra 30% as profit rather than giving it back to their users like proton has.
Yeah, even of the companies don’t pocket the difference, he’s an idiot to suggest that this will cut inflation.
This guy is just not very smart, I think.
I think he’s a salesperson trying to sell the idea that getting rid of the apple tax is good for consumers.
I mean that’s not wrong. I had no idea Apple was double-dipping like this. I wonder if Google is doing the same thing…
What do you mean “double dipping”? I don’t own any Apple products. I purchased through Proton’s website.
If someone purchases a Proton plan through their iOS app, Apple got a 30% cut of that. Which is stupid. Because Proton (and every other company with an iOS app) already pays Apple to simply have their app on Apple’s app store.
Uhhh I mean they pay a $100/year developer fee, which probably doesn’t even cover the infrastructure costs. Is that what you’re referring to?
I’m not arguing against you, Apple should consider those costs as a service to their (overpaying) customers. I’m just not sure what other costs you’re referring to.
Yes (I thought it was more, but w/e). I’ll admit, I don’t know a whole lot about development and everything that it entails, but nuance is key here. Say what you will about Proton, but this ruling just set a precedent that a company hosting an app/game download cannot take a cut from purchases completed within said app/game. That affects everyone.
I’m just looking at this from a bigger picture perspective. Apple has more than enough money already, and frankly there are far too many companies like this who need to be cut back down.
Yeah, a fraction of a cent per customer is double dipping. w/e
Precedent is precedent, and now smaller independent devs can use this ruling to their favor.
This won’t help small devs. Here’s why:
You have zero market. Pay to make your own payment portal, processing, etc etc. With what? Venture funding? Personal investment? Offload to square or PayPal and they take a cut instead?
Apple charges 15% (not 30% for under 2 mil) of each $1. Making 85c per transaction with no upfront costs seems reasonable.
That explains my experience. I just brought proton vpn for the easiest travel solution for me, and when I was shopping around I thought I was losing my mind. Checked the price online and it was one price and then checked from the Apple app for convenience and it was higher. I was confused, but just bought it online and used it on the app after (along with other devices).
Every store does this. Even Holy Valve
Every company who takes a cut from in-app purchases, be it subscriptions or DLC, should be kneecapped by this ruling.
It’s one thing for the hosting marketplace (App Store, Steam, Play Store, etc) to take a cut from the initial purchase of a game/app. But it’s a whole other issue for that initial marketplace to keep reaching further into the dev’s pockets and take a cut from in-app purchases unrelated to where it was originally obtained.
That just turns paid apps into splash screens for in-app purchases though. That way apple never gets a cut because the “purchase” is in-app. Pay to be listed (maybe tiered depending on downloads) seems fair especially because it doesn’t incentivize people to do scammy things with pricing. It’s already a fee anyway.
Welcome to Android lol
“This app is Free!”
*opens app*
“Psyche! Get your credit card out…”
I’m not entirely optimistic about this ruling, but we’ll see.
Apple had no reason NOT to give refunds and then use their weight to claw it back from the app developer.
But what happens when not-too-legit apps use non-AppStore external sites to unlock features in an app?
In a perfect world it’s cheap and easy and reliable.
But it can also be a scammy shop that lures you into expensive subscriptions with no easy way to cancel them (eg. gym membership) and what happens when Little Timmy spends $9000 for Nlartbux in a mobile game’s external store?
Could go either way 🤷🏻♂️
Greed.
I suppose we will see what happens. That’s a very slippery slope though, full of FUD, and is the same logic that Apple, Microsoft, and others try to use to keep users locked into their walled gardens.
Could be. Multiple alternative markets exist for Android already though, and some shops are scammy as fuck. Google has already put protections in place to prevent sideloading potentially harmful apps (including alternative markets), but the savvy user who knows how to bypass those restrictions should* know how to spot scammy shit.
“For your security” was never about security.
That’s why you don’t put your credit card info in a phone or tablet and let kids play with it.
And still people do it, they even give their own devices to kids with CC info pre-filled and no safeties on purchases.
Imagine how bad it is when the next fake ad game gets Timmy to subscribe to a $99/day gem pack…
That’s a failure of the parent. My 5 year old likes to do the “color by number” things on my phone (waiting at dr appts and whatnot), and even she understands not to click on the ads, or to at least hand it back to me if one comes up.
What? Since when does Valve prohibit companies from redirecting customers to non-Valve purchasing flows? Because that’s what this ruling is about, it says Apple can’t prohibit apps from telling users to go buy off-platform for lower prices. Valve isn’t doing that with Steam afaik, actually I’m not aware of any other platform that does this
Valve will even allow developers to create their own Steam keys free of charge and sell them wherever they want with no commission whatsoever
That’s pretty open I’d say
Lol, as long as you properly plan in advance and coordinate such a thing, not the way that uh… Dead Matter tried to do it.
Dear god what a fustercluck.
Any of the video game console companies.
Here comes the Steam defenders.
I have many issues with the gamer deference to the steam monopoly… But they don’t partake in this particular abuse: taking a cut from the dev for all in game purchases. They only take a (sizeable) cut for the initial game purchase.
They literally do not lol
In game purchases in steam games don’t have to pay Valve, nor does Valve prevent you from uploading your game to other stores, which is what this ruling was about.
Or he’s just shitting on other companies who he knows are too greedy to do the same. Proton is getting positive press for this and he’s leaning into it with a bit of hyperbole
Not saying he’s a genius or anything, he’s just a spokesperson doing spokesperson things
How many years until prices go up? I bet they marked down 1-2 years where they realize they can’t up the prices. But after, it will creep up.
In a decade it’ll probably be the same price it was last year.
Interesting that Andy Yen does not have a Wiki page. But Proton says “Previously, Andy was a research scientist at CERN and has a PhD in particle physics from Harvard University.” so, I think he’s very smart, he’s just outside of his lane here.
So, I initially wanted to just kneejerk respond yes, it is absurd to suggest this ruling against Apple… would have any kind of generally noticable effect on inflation.
But I wanted to check the actual numbers.
Ok, so, total US consumer spending in 2024 is about $64 Trillion.
… The Apple App Store generated $105 Billion in revenue in 2024.
Ok, napkin math: 30% off of lets just say literally all App Store payments… , ok, we’ve cut costs by about $32 Billion… shave that off the $64 Trillion…
And voila!
A rough general price reduction of… 0.05%
Call a median US yearly income $60K, and they’ve saved $30 bucks. Maybe the cost of either one or two DoorDash meals, depending on where you live… probably much closer to just one.
We’re saved from inflation rofl!
Yep, product prices are not based on costs but rather just the absolute maximum of what consumers are willing to pay.
Proton just seems to be an exception.
In a sufficiently competitive market, the maximum is related to costs.
Proton is trying to get cheap marketing.
It’s not. It’s just related to the competition AKA what people are willing to pay.
With enough competition, someone is going to compete on price to attract customers. They obviously can’t sell for less than their costs (again, sufficiently competitive so you don’t get monopolies starving their competition), so that’s the floor for what they can sustainably charge.
It doesn’t matter what the service is, if there are enough viable alternatives, at least one of them will go for the value play. Customers aren’t willing to pay more than they have to, so they’ll be attracted to lower cost options.
What I’m saying is that competition is included in “what people are willing to pay”. Cost of production is not.
Sure. But if people aren’t willing to pay more than the cost of production, games wouldn’t be made. The cost of production is the floor, and the cost people are willing to pay is the ceiling, and competition finds a line somewhere in the middle. The more competition, the closer it is to the cost of production.
Then that unmade game wouldn’t be relevant to this discussion.
Again, no it doesn’t. “What people are willing to pay” includes the competition. If one company undercuts another with a comparable product, consumers won’t pay for the more expensive one.
People would be willing to pay more if there wasn’t as much competition. People obviously want to pay less, and companies obviously want to charge more, so the real variable here is how competitive the market is. And the more competitive the market, the closer to production costs companies are able to pay.
The variable here isn’t how much people are willing to pay, that’s elastic and depends on competition. The real variable is competitiveness in the market, since that is what drives prices closer to production costs.
I don’t know how many different ways I can say the same thing and help you understand. It’s a trivial semantic argument anyway. Have a nice day.
We’ve certainly gone in circles. Hope your day is excellent as well.
Companies that were app-first like mobile games probably won’t cut prices much if any. Companies that were web-first like Proton and Patreon probably will.
Yeah, Proton is bucking the obvious trend, with this one. Most companies will totally take the profits rather than lowering prices.
I highly doubt Apple App Store revenues are a significant portion of the CPI.
I mean, let’s not kid ourselves that it has no effect, but it’s not even in the basket
i’m scared how many ceos don’t understand that rapid fall of inflation or zero inflation is bad because it means your economy is stagnant.
That is a very broad generalization. First of all inflation is not just some co-product of economic activity. It has specific reasons. An economy is not stagnant because the oil price sinks after geopolitical tensions ease. An economy is not stagnant because businesses are kept from price gouging in cartels or monopoly situations.
Also “stagnant” is not inherently bad. The reason why we need economic growth is because the super rich are siphoning off more and more wealth, so economic growth is the only thing keeping poor people from revolting. A zero growth or even degrowth economy could serve the people very well, if wealth wouldn’t be hoarded away by select few.
based move
Do he still think fascism is good for small businesses though?
If only he ever said that you weren’t making up bullshit by misrepresenting his statement.
And article on the topic of what Andy Yen said: https://techissuestoday.com/proton-ceo-responds-to-backlash-after-his-post-supporting-trump-selection/
So, while his comment wasn’t entirely neutral I don’t see any endorsement of fascism in there.
I’d say you either openly oppose fascism or you condone it, there are no other possibilities
That’s fair I guess.
It sounds like that is the same as saying “you can’t oppose corporate monopolies without openly opposing fascism”
There is a lot of risk in that sort of intentional abdication of nuance, hopefully self-evident to you and to all who read this.
The difference is that he could have just not said anything, yet he chose to praise Republicans and denounce Democrats. Sure, there’s plenty of reasons to denounce Democrats, but putting that alongside praising Republicans is beyond tone-deaf.
This.
It was the same with Elon before he went head first into facism. They usually start by selling themselves as liberal with some occasional praise of conservatives. Then later claim they are moderate or the go to favorite of tech bros claiming they are libertarian, since saying they are conservative might receive backlash.
So not really. Thanks for the actual answer.
Edit: goddamn, you actually changed my view somewhat and people still go piling on lol
It’s always this exact article “on the topic” that gets posted in response. I remember his posts on social networks though.
x.com/andyyen/status/1864436449942110660
Seems pretty clear to me.
xcancel.com/andyyen/status/1864436449942110660
Better link
Are you kidding? Hating on Andy Yen for saying dumb shit he didn’t actually literally say is basically a Lemmy staple meme by now.
I’m not a Nazi, I just admire their personnel picks. And their economic policy. And their uniforms. And the killing of some jews. But I’m not a Nazi!
I’m so tired
.
.
Why is it bad though? This business is in no form related to politics. It wouldn’t change fundamentally even if Hitler ran it.
I’m not going to willingly put my money towards someone who supports that kind of thing. The first response to my comment was a very level headed response and provided evidence that he does not directly support the administration.
Still doesn’t provide me a lot of consumer confidence though.
Maybe you should reconsider your threat model. You seem to be very light on information. If political views is an issue than you’re the issue.
Political views are 100% the issue, they drive all other business decisions. If you’re fucked enough to support what’s going on in the US government, I can’t trust you to be a normal human, let alone run a business.
Fuck off with your apologisim for nazis
I bet every company has at least one employee with right-wing political views. Choosing a product based on some random quotes by employees is stupid.
MASSIVE fucking difference between Bob in the warehouse being a racist fuck, and the god damn CEO.
You are not cooking blud
If they can charge 30% less without Apple’s fees, then why are their prices the same whether you buy on their iOS app or direct on their website? Why have they been overcharging users who don’t buy through the iOS app by 30% all this time?
Old knowledge disclaimer, but if they didn’t change it then:
Because Apple literally tells people that they’re not allowed to charge less somewhere else - at least that was the case several years ago…
This is the same on most platforms. You’ll rarely find a product for different prices in different places because if they’re listed on Amazon, Steam, Apple, Google, etc. they’re not allowed to.
That isn’t exactly true with Steam. Valve does allow a dev to offer a discount at a different store as long as that same discount comes to Steam in a reasonable amount of time.
Straight from the docs:“It’s OK to run a discount for Steam Keys on different stores at different times as long as you plan to give a comparable offer to Steam customers within a reasonable amount of time.”
Yes but recent lawsuits have exposed that their policies and their enforcement aren’t aligned.
Got a link to an article or something discussing that?
I don’t even know how to find it again.
That’s probably only for selling steam keys on another store. You might be able to sell non steam versions for any price you want
Some things do charge different amounts though. YouTube Premium for example is more expensive if you subscribe in iOS but maybe that’s just because it’s Google.
They also could have just not let anyone subscribe through the iOS app. Lots of things do that.
I’ve noticed this too, there’s no consistency. Some companies seem to get away with two prices, others not.
When people tell you the laws are behind internet they’re taking about this all of this ND social media is unregulated but imagine if psychological abuse was the reason social media was successful.
Because Apple prohibited that.
Likely they were not allowed to by the terms they agreed to with apple.
Most favored nation clause. Apple gets the lowest price that you offer. I’d you offer any discounts elsewhere, that have to be the same on the app store
Cool! Still not gonna put all my eggs in the fascist-sympathetic basket
It doesn't matter either way. Never do it that anyway. You would think people would learn a thing after being thoroughly fucked by apple and google...
It is amazing how sundar and Tim literally violated you in sexually uncomfortable ways but you are crying about Andy being a pathetic regime whore...
No doubt Proton’s CEO will use this to justify his “Trump is better for regulating big tech” claim, while ignoring that the judge is an Obama appointee.
Andy big mad they didn't invite him to the Inauguration, he should sitting there next to sundar the creep!!!
And Faceberg and Bezonator
This the trump-licker? Yeah, bye Proton.
Buh bye now
Thundermail is coming soon. By Mozilla.
That’s the best name by far! Well, I guess second, compared to Thunderbird.
.
It’s not exactly 30%. For sales below $1M, it’s 15%: developer.apple.com/…/small-business-program/
In Europe, where this was established last year, they started charging a Core Technology Fee to cover the cost of hosting and data transfer: developer.apple.com/support/core-technology-fee/
And if you switch payment providers, you have to pay at least 2.5% plus transaction and any intermediary fees.
It’s nice that Proton is offering a discount, but for everyone else there may be additional ongoing costs.
15% if you know about it, if you apply, if you get accepted
<img alt="" src="https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/7715753e-6983-4e3e-9e19-d3a3fbddc910.jpeg">
Good watch on this stuff, the recent court decision overall
<img alt="" src="https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/4f11966e-1178-4811-8771-d60f3a856612.png">
Dude’s so vindicated. Apple lover who HATES their treatment of developers cases like this.
“Up to”…… here’s 5% off
Very true. I’m giving you up to* 1000 upvotes.
I got a Proton two-year subscription that averages out to two dollars and change per month.
I already feel like I got an incredible deal.
Too bad the owner of Proton supports Trump, so when my two years subscription ends, I’m moving to Tuta or Posteo
I moves to proton because I was paying for a vpn, storage, and password manager and it all came out to like ~$45/mo. Proton gives me all that for $30/mo. This was the 3rd password manager I had my family migrate to so I think I’m gonna stick with them for a bit unless I see some kind of evidence that proton is violating the security of its users for governments. I don’t want to have my family have to move to yet ANOTHER password manager
I’m looking at mailbox.org when mine ends.
Agreeing with a statement from a politician doesn’t mean you support that politician, that’s how compromises can even start.
But Any Yen isn’t in politics, let alone US politics, he is just an idiot.
This articles goes a bit more into it, but it is also an opinion. Don’t use Proton if you don’t want to idc: medium.com/…/does-proton-really-support-trump-a-d…
So, Mr. Yen, are you still sympathetic to the republicans, who have a disdain for the same courts that gave you a win?
Or is your head burried so deep in your particle accelerator you don’t even have any clue about politics?
Dude thinks he knows everything because he has a PhD in Physics, literally out of touch with the politics that anyone doing 5 minutes of web searching can understand.
no no, you see Trump is totally anti-big tech. once he bleeds them dry from all the bribes they’ll be gone! /s
This is such a common thing. STEM education needs to be more well rounded.
Why? Idiots thinking they know more than they do won’t be stopped by this. Also if we wanted to round humanities and liberal arts by making it mandatory to pass analysis, linear algebra, organic chemistry and classical physics would just lead to much more people not graduating anything.
School is for a general education. Academia is for specialization.
I can only speak for myself… But I had 2+ years at university before declaring a (STEM) major, allowing me to take courses in political science, history, etc.
So, as someone with a STEM degree, in a field of specialists who have zero understanding of the real world outside of their field, the difference is instantly recognizable.
The idea that a more well rounded education can ever be a bad thing is just straight up ignorant and it comes off as some sort of insecurity on your part.
Nobody is kept from taking additional education if they want to, like you did. But the general education should be from school and school education needs to define the standard of what everyone should know or should at least have known at some point so he or she can refresh upon it.
If you make it mandatory to make academic education contain every subject like school did, you will end up with programs taking 20 years instead of 5 years to graduate. If you want to discriminate against certain subjects you end up in the same trap of defining certain subjects as relevant and others as irrelevant, like the criticized “STEM-lords”
What does politics even have to do with a ruling like this? Isn’t the law separated from the government in the US? Or is the US just a corrupt country that allow people to influence the judges ruling to impact the lawsuit in a certain outcome … O wait …
Inb4 Trump invents tariffs on foreign coded software
You mean tariffs on services and the EU been floating the idea of putting tariff on US big tech
Proton = Trump support
So no for me.
Fuuuuck.
This article goes into it some more, please pick your own opinion: medium.com/…/does-proton-really-support-trump-a-d…
Thanks for sharing this!
It really does appear that the “Proton is MAGA” thing is just quote taken out of context nonsense.
Yeah no problem, everybody is allowed to make their own decisions, but I feel like everybody should at least see the actual Tweet.
Edit: apparantly people don’t want the truth to be shared? Share the dang Tweet people.
This article keeps getting posted but it really just shows the author doesn’t understand the issue that was presented. It goes as far as brushing of the criticism almost immediately. Truth is Proton decided they would publicly praise a running fascist leader for goodboy points
Proton didn’t decide anything, Andy Yen posted ONE tweet and then doubled down on it with the Proton Reddit account which was deleted.
I know the US is really into this “us vs them” or Republicans against the Democrats or whatever you want to and that is fair, that’s how US policies sadly work which is also one of the reasons why the country is basically corrupt. For most people agreeing with one statement a politician made doesn’t mean anything. I can agree with some things Geert Wilders said, but that doesn’t mean Ill vote for him.
There are other articles about the whole situation, but I believe that the Tweet says more than the bullshit some people have been shouting on every post regarding Proton. Share the Tweet yes, but don’t share the bullshit.
“Proton didn’t decide anything” He is the God damned CEO of the company.
Proton is not responsible for everything Andy Yen does, Andy Yen has to take responsibility for everything Proton does.
But his power is limited anyway since there is a governance structure by using the non profit that is shareholder of Proton. This is not America.
Never said I was American. Proton as a team has kept him on so that’s their answer. He did not have to make a post at all complementing Donald but he did and that fact says A LOT.
It says a lot to you, but not to a lot of people. Stop barading the company for your own opinion
Who else’s opinion should I barade them with then? I was a loyal customer and this was something I felt ruined their reputation to myself and anyone that should be looking to find a solution that doesn’t show sympathies for fascist regimes. And I feel the Medium article I initially commented on brushes those concerns away and focus on “but are they MAGA?”
I am sorry, but I find it so absurd that people can literally kick somebody or a company down because of something relatively small. Most companies can be found dirt on, what are you going to do? I am just saying that there is more to the story than just calling somebody a MAGA supporter which these days is basically calling somebody a Nazi
I don’t know what to say to you. Something small? I have lost faith if fascist sympathies is small. God help us
I can say the same thing about you mentioning god. Religious conservatives have been an issue in the US (and outside the US as well) for years. But I am not going to call you out publicly for doing that either.
Now fascists are different, but agreeing with a more economic focussed standpoint doesn’t mean you have sympathy for fascists. I am progessive-center right aligned in politics, what are you gonna call me a Nazi? The US politics don’t lend for people to have specific directions with their votes.
Proton the company and the foundation are still on the consumer side of the while discussion and besides a deleted Tweet that aint gonna happen.
How are you going to say that Proton didn’t say anything and then acknowledge that the official Proton social media accounts were making statements like this:
That’s the context you keep brushing under the rug. The official Proton position is not just that Trump made a good choice, on this one thing, it’s that you should vote for Republicans over Democrats.
Yes, it was official corporate Proton position to delete that comment. But it was the official Proton position to make that comment in the first place.
I don’t brush anything under the rug. I actively shared the Tweet that started this hole BS.
Well fair, maybe I should have shown their response. They doubled down on it, but they also deleted it. Both of the American parties are a shitshow, but then again America is just corrupt anyway. Trump didn’t even have 50% of the votes.
Saying “Proton = Maga” or whatever doesn’t shed light on the issue either. In the end I believe more in actions than words (and i have faith in a decent governance structure) and I believe that people should take their own conclusion on the matter based on the Tweet and well yeah I should start linking the Reddit post again.
The moment Proton itself starts to fuck things over I am out of there as well, but currently I prepaid just before this came to light, but I use my own domain so mhe
I get that. But my point is that you can’t claim that Proton’s CEO is acting independently of the Proton corporation itself when Proton’s official corporate accounts chimed in on his side on this.
Not on antitrust. The Biden administration was one of the strongest advocates for consumers on antitrust issues we’ve seen since Robert Bork convinced Reagan to tear it all down.
Anyone who says otherwise is trying to lie to the American public about it, and should be called out for actively advocating for false MAGA propaganda. Andy Yen did it, and Proton agreed with it.
Proton’s official account also deleted the comment and Yen created a new account for himself so Proton did what eas really required by any rule book or whatever you wanna call it in situations like this.
So no I wouldn’t say Proton agreed on it.
Call him out for his tweet or Protons post fair, but that doesnt him a MAGA supporter. It just makes him a supporter of a bullshit statement. And it definitely doesn’t make Proton MAGA. Nuances are needed to make it so people can have their own opinions formed and we don’t get a black or white/good or bad view on the world.
Calling this an “us vs them” is disingenuous. Republicans are actively shredding the rule of law in the US by the day. Democrats are weak on some policy points (though not tech policy, by the way). The two are not the same at all
Well yes, but Proton is still located in Switzerland and has a decent governance structure in play with a non profit. He cannot just kill the company by switching it’s core USP
I mean this is like saying "I only agree with that one thing Hitler did" and then trying to explain to everyone why you felt the need to defend Hitler. I mean sure, there were probably a handful of policies the Nazis got right, but people are going to look at you funny if you go around phrasing it like that. Especially, in this case, if that "one thing" was actually just praise for shitty authoritarian policies.
So Andy Yen is Hitler now?
Proton itself never directly commited on anything from Trump in a positive way.
Their current CEO Andy Yen posted this Tweet. Yes he is an idiot and even doubled down on it with the Proton account Now I am not from a country with a 2 party system, but last time I checked agreeing with one statement from somebody doesn’t mean you support them. Heck finding common ground is often a way to find compromises.
Do what you want and don’t support them if you don’t want them, but don’t act like the company Proton is a Trump supporter. Heck there are a lot of articles on the Proton site which are pro privacy and pro consumer.
Andy Yen went out of his way to criticize Democrats on antitrust, which is how you can tell it’s actually a pro-Trump position unsupported by the actual facts.
I like Gail Slater. She’s possibly the best choice among people who Trump likes, to head DOJ’s Antitrust Division. She has bipartisan bona fides.
But to say that Democrats, after 4 years of Lina Khan leading the FTC, and a bunch of the reforms that the Biden FTC and DOJ made to merger standards and their willingness to sue/seek big penalties for antitrust violations, aren’t more serious than Republicans about reining in big tech consolidation and about stronger enforcement of antitrust principles, completely flips around the history and is a bad faith argument.
Andy Yen could’ve praised Gail Slater, and that would be that. Instead, he took a post by Trump that didn’t even mention Democrats, and made it about how the Democrats are bad on taking on big tech. That’s the problem everyone had with it.
Well yeah he did support a Trump statement and went out of his way to do it. Later stupidly doubled down on it by using the official response.
But, and this might be because I am not American and live in a country where politics aren’t so black and white, but I fail to see how that means you are a MAGA nut/Trump supporter or what not. Especially not because he hasn’t taken action (will be hard to do anyway since he is not American).
And there is a strong governance structure with Andy Yen only having 33% power on final says since he is 1 of 3 people in the Proton Foundation which is the shareholder of the Proton company.
Name some policies of Adolf Hitler that you support
The policy on preservation of natural areas was not terrible. It was probably executed poorly and wasn’t intended to be anything but a bludgeon of the state to displace people, but nature preservation as a concept is a necessity.
A general increase in old person pension?
Every coin has two sides
Anti Democrat does not mean pro Republican/trump. I personally hate both but the latter much more.
The statement he out out was literally pro-republican. He said the Republicans are better on tech policy than democrats, which is straight up retarded
How so?
Andy praised Gail Slater publicly, and they even worked together.
www.reddit.com/r/ProtonMail/comments/…/m7psmzx/
Yeah, my 2 year plan is up in June. I haven’t decided what I’m switching to. I’ve heard good things about Mullvad’s privacy policies and politics, but I’ve also seen reviews that a bunch of sites and services have them blocked.
I’m open to suggestions at this point.
Mullvad is the gold standard
That’s what I’ve been seeing. I don’t use Netflix anyways and I mostly just have a VPN for when I’m on a university or hospital campus and I’d like to keep my internet usage private. (Or when sailing the high seas for books.)
Except that Mullvad is hostile to the torrent infrastructure since there is no port forwarding. No thanks!
He approved of an appointment Trump made, and criticized Dem on the issue – doesn’t make him a Trump supporter. If we can’t tell the Dems off when we think the GOP does better, how can we proceed?
People aren’t criticizing him because he criticized the democrats. Liberals and leftists are pretty unhappy with the DNC right now, too. Anybody can criticize the democrats all day if they want, thats not forbidden.
They’re criticizing him because the things he said are actually fucking braindead retarded.
Can you explain?
I’d use their VPN even if Hitler owns it. It’s private, secure and they stand to their values with respect to that. Why would I care about political views? Politics don’t change the service on a technical level. Literally don’t give a shit.
Except politics, actually, can change the service. For example, surrendering data in secret. Or installing backdoors.
Not that I think Proton is gonna do that (or at least hope so), but thinking “why would I care about politics, they don’t affect the app on a technical level” is incredibly naive and potentially incorrect.
With an over-the-top example, it’s kinda like saying “why should I care about the politics of my landlord after they support the “Increase Tenant’s Rent” party, it doesn’t change the service”
If your threat model depends of political idiologies then you should reconsider your threat model.
If a person signals loyalty to a criminal government which is violating the rights of its people daily, why would I trust them not to cooperate with that government when they ask for a backdoor to be installed? Conservatives are simply not trustworthy. They’re lying, backstabbing, and manipulative. They have no principles at all and will say or do anything to acquire more power and money
Because his power is limited? He cannot just change policy on a dime
Trump is the peak example that they can, in fact, just change policy on a dime, laws and constitution be dammed.
The US is not the same as Switzerland lol
So why do you trust any company? Every company has people like that employed. Do you make a political-views check on every employee of a company before choosing your product?
Call me crazy, but I think there is a bit of difference between the average worker, and CEOs, investors and execs, in terms of hability to sway the company one way or another.
Unless the governance structure agrees to it they can’t and even the we vaj sue them for abusing a Swiss non profit
Just use KSuite instead
tuta and mullvad
Based, as they say.
Is tuta torrent friendly?
tuta is mail and calendar only
But I already use proton and purchased outside the Apple Store (on the proton website) and use it on my iPhone? What changed?
Nothing
Damn. People here sure love purity testing. The guy could pay for their cancer treatment and still slap him every chance because they got it wrong publicly in the past but once you get it wrong publicly once, you’re out of the club. Go be a conservative we don’t want you. When someone at Tuta has a bad year and ends up in the wrong publicly, find another email service to try and convince people to go too. Probably worse in functionality than Tuta as you go down to smaller and worse funded efforts in this niche field of Internet activism
But people here do it here too to Mozilla because they don’t like their social outreach programs and their attempts to get advertising revenue so screw Mozilla too. So because nothing but perfection is acceptable, push away people that may be adjacent/left leaning right and switch to less developed products. Switch from Firefox and attack Mozilla who do the bulk of Firefox development and use Waterfox who do a custom deployment/build. Pure display of perfection being the enemy of good here.
You want people to embrace privacy but keep whiplashing people around when the org/anyone in leadership says something wrong. Screw Signal, they’re not perfect. Screw Matrix/Element, some developer said something one day so it’s all bad. I’m surprised anyone here uses any privacy software or a major open source software like Linux or Krita or Blender at the risk that someone in the background may be wrong in someway which I am 100% certain they exist in important positions. Same with Lemmy
Go back to the 60s and you all would be shitting on Fred Hampton for accepting the impure and the color coalition for everyone that had ever said something wrong. Al Franken definitely would not make it with y’all. Y’all can’t build up leftist communities because y’all are bitter assholes that can’t move on and spend so much time purity testing. Y’all are probably mediocre too so can’t make a difference in privacy and data ownership activism anyways so should be lining up to support not just Tuta, someone hasn’t screwed up publicly yet, and Proton
Reminds me of Aung San Suu Kyi. She was under the gun of the military ruling class that permitted limited democratic government and because she didn’t make speech as if she lived in the US, a bunch of Americans turned on her and celebrated when the military dictatorship came back to rule and put her in prison the moment it seemed like the civilian government would actually assert more power
It’s not a purity test so much as a fear that publicly signaling loyalty to trump devalued their trustworthiness as private and secure. If their CEO legitimately believes that Republicans are better on tech policy than democrats because conservatives want to weaponize the federal government to control speech online, then I don’t really trust him not to cooperate with federal authorities when they want to access someone’s emails or vpn traffic. Conservatives are simply not trustworthy to me
This is literally just insane rambling. You need serious media literacy.
Tell me why I’m wrong
The premise is already wrong. There was no promise or loyalty, not even close.
He endorsed the republican party. He said we should clean house of democrats. Is that not declaring party loyalty? It was also a completely unnecessary comment, in response to nothing. It was shortly after Trump’s election when every CEO went out of their way to kowtow to the new regime. Its transparently a loyalty pledge to the new boss
He didn’t endorse the republican party.
The fact that you inflate the meaning of that tweet to make it more meaningful than it is, doesn’t mean he did anything of the sort. The tweet happened after the election but before the government, and it was an endorsement of the antitrust appointee. He also expressed his opinion that republicans were more likely than democrats to fight big tech monopolies in the antitrust space. This is far from an endorsement.
It was in response to Trump’s tweet about the antitrust appointee. I would say quite relevant context for a tweet about the antitrust appointee.
It was unnecessary, true. Like every tweet. He expressed his unnecessary opinion, the same way we are doing now.
Bro I mean come on, this is literally an endorsement of the republican party. I don’t know how more explicit it can get. You’re asking people to not believe their own eyes here. Even worse:
He decries the “corporate capture” of the Democratic party while completely failing to address to much larger and more immediate threat of an outright christo-fascist movement capturing the entire Republican party and all 3 branches of federal government. Like he thinks that “the democrats didnt move as fast on this thing as I wanted them to” somehow compares to “the president is kidnapping people with a personal army of gestapo and disappearing them to a black site in El Salvador”.
And you may say “well he’s not interested in immigration policy; he’s interested in technology policy”. If you are in the business of privacy and security, then you should not be putting yourself in the corner of a political cult with zero respect for the law, zero guiding moral principles, and which is only motivated by using any means necessary to crush their political enemies. Yen is supporting a wannabe dictator because he’s willing to weaponize the federal government to destroy his competitors.
If all he said was “good pick by Trump, look forward to working with them”, I’d accept it as a politically neutral statement that you often see from business leaders and even democratic politicians sometimes. But he went out of his way to demonize the democratic party and somehow hold the Republicans up as the defenders of small business
It’s such an unbelievably bad take (which he dug in on like 5 times even though he could have said nothing and waited for it to blow over) and completely tone deaf as to be unbelievable. Like I literally don’t believe that he doesn’t know what he’s saying; I think he, like many tech CEOs, is simply a conservative who’s too ashamed to admit it.
Yes, the whole discussion is around antitrust, and he thinks republicans have a chance to do better than democrats there. There is nothing to “bro” about, it’s pretty clear from the context. If he said any of that before the election, I could vaguely read an endorsement for single-issue voters. Saying republicans are better than democrats in fighting antitrust after Democrats shat their pants about it, doesn’t sound an endorsement to me.
The rest of this comment is out of topic. His focus (and his company focus) has always been on a specific political area. So there is no expectation that he would address the whole political scenario, when he was talking about that narrow area.
So this is what bothers you? A completely legitimate critique of the democratic party? Well, I personally cannot care less, but you do you.
I see the issue as very simple: Him and his company work in the privacy space. Tech monopolies are a problem because captured people. Improving in this space is a win for privacy. Which is not something that is beneficial “in a vacuum”, it’s beneficial to all those vulnerable people that will be attacked by this government, or the next. he expressed optimism about the fact that republicans can do better than democrats here. Period. Naive, wrong, whatever. A legitimate opinion based on his reading of the last few years’ trend.
No endorsement, no “pledge loyalty”, nothing. Just a consideration. He also mentioned on his reddit account that ultimately actions will be what will count (as it is obvious). So to me this is legitimately a nothing burger. I cannot care less that people in US (and in many more places) live politics like a football game. I cannot care less that you or others got hurt because he criticized Democrats. They could and should do better, and then if the critique is unfair I will be there saying that he “goes out of his way” to criticize them. So far he clearly motivated his opinion with what Schumer did.
This. It's amazing how naive people here can be just because they fanboyed some random CEO before they were revealed to be problematic.
That’s just ad hominem to say people are fanboying the CEO. I never heard the name of the CEO until people started complaining about him. Then I read the statements he put out and that people are hysterical over and reading into as if he’s some Trump fanboy. The guys not even an American. He doesn’t live in the US. He just runs a service as an alternative to the big tech companies. Was he even in the US for anything but his university years and he’s 40?
Americans read more into him than his record and statements say. Not everyone’s politics revolve around Americans. I’m waiting for American leftist to turn on Shawn Fain too for supporting Trump auto tariffs and be anti auto workers union because too many in the union are Trump supporters and even someone in opposition like Shawn Fain is supporting a Trump policy. That’s even more direct and influential than a guy in Europe that runs a niche privacy centric internet service company
Problematic, barely. It’s a handful of statements months ago compared to his life of work. Magnifying glass to your whole life and people would likely find something problematic. If this guy is representative of what a problematic person is, the world would be pretty solid. Waste of energy to be so anti this guy and Proton when it’s a service more conducive to privacy rights than anything I or probably any of us have done. Problematic has become such an empty insult with how easily it’s thrown around with such passion. Waste of passion
Yeah a lot of people fan over celeberties politicians or CEO’s, but at the same time a lot of people also hate those same people for various reasons. And people believe in bad against bad and not even the law anymore and don’t believe in second changes or forgiveness.
We call that, the internet.
Louder for the idiots who can’t seem to listen. Preach!
They legally can’t though that’s the thing people are missing
I am sad because of all the people in this thread who think the CEO is “fascist-sympathetic” because he said Trump did something better than the Democrats one time.
Absolutely agreed. I think when you have such role in a company you should avoid making political statements at all, because no matter what you say you will end up upsetting some people. In this case, “try-hard” democrats.
Well, it’s worth leveraging your status to communicate to the politicians things they’ve done well (i.e. this tweet). In this case, it cost him more than I think he was expecting.
lol that is done with money, not social media posts. A CEO should know that.
why would he want to donate to trump? Public praise is worth more in many instances.
I’m of the opinion he should’ve shut the fuck up or said better words, so I don’t have any interest in trying to answer that for you.
Yeah he should’ve said what he said more tactfully. But sometimes one’s most controversial comments are ones that one wouldn’t have thought would get a lot of attention at all.
Not Even trump, just «the republicans»
It was definitely Trump.
I’m convinced that Trump is just a puppet.
No puppet!
Yeah, having only just switched from GMail to Proton last week my heart sank when I saw “Proton are MAGA”.
Then I spent three minutes reading up on it and it’s like, the CEO said one thing about policy on regulation of big tech that was critical of the Democrats for not doing enough, and the internet has decided that means he’s MAGA.
He said Republicans are better on tech policy than democrats. Republicans tech policy is motivated entirely by the fact that their racist and conspiratorial views were getting them banned on social media sites from 2015 - 2024
Conservatives have absolutely zero principles. If they say they want to break up big tech, it’s because they want to control it in some way. They want the platforms to promote speech that’s beneficial to them.
If you believe that Republicans truly are better for tech policy than democrats, then you either whole-heartedly agree that a group of criminals and wannabe dictators should be able to destroy any business that publishes speech against them, or you are extremely gullible. Either way, why would I want to give you my business?
And i should care because…? Why should I care why republicans wanted to break up tech monopolies, if breaking monopolies is anyway something that I consider a positive change?
Breaking monopolies give people more choice. More choice (free) leads to hopefully people choosing more privacy conscious tools. More privacy means less data that can be handed over to doge, less data that ICE has to target minorities, etc.
Those are not the only 2 options. I am instead very happy that they will do the right thing for the wrong reason, and outside those monopolies more people will choose services that republicans have no power over. Moreover, your whole argument assumes someone is in US. I am sympathetic to the people in US, but tech monopolies are a global problem.
Because they’re not interested in breaking up monopolies; they’re interested in threatening their political enemies with breakup so they can control speech on those platforms. Mark Zuckerberg is kowtowing to Trump now to avoid being broken up.
You think the Republicans are going to break up tech and create a more diverse online publishing ecosystem that’s harder for any one party to control? No, they’ll crush their enemies and bolster their allies, so we’ll end up with even fewer choices
There are less than 10 companies that control almost the entire tech space. What “fewer choices”…?
Breaking up google would be already enough, which is what the focus was. All your comment sounds very fuzzy to me. Basically the whole antitrust thing is on google, if republicans break it up, great. Which " allies" are they going to bolster?
It’s time to end monopolies
Should have done a valve and allowed selling anywhere but require price parity. Now from their greed there will be financial incentive for people to use another platform.
I thought Valve was the one who created Proton in the first place to let people play games on Linux
They did, but you only need that to play windows games. You can also use wine or play native Linux games.
Different Proton my dude.
The Proton in the post offers mail, storage, and VPN services.
Companies lowering prices is unheard of
probably to make up for their customer loss after the pro Twumph shit
They lowered the price of Pass. proton.me/blog/proton-pass-price-change
Better than not lowering anything at all
.
They just lowering the prices cause of his backlash for supporting Trump.
Fuck Proton. Snitching ass bitches.
Online drama which it seems you’ve been drawn into believing
“The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”
That’s you and all the trumpets.
I’m not American?
.
Another Russian bot dont you have Twitter to go spew your dumb shit? Fk off.
You really think only Russian bots don’t believe you?